chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez Posted March 15, 2007 Report Posted March 15, 2007 i noticed its mcghee + a bunch of unknowns so i thought maybe it was mcghee? is anyone familar w/ this? May 19, 1950 (3 items; TT = 14:27) Renaissance Ballroom, New York NY Private recording (Tape) Machito's Afro-Cuban band Charlie Parker (as); Howard McGhee (tpt); Mario Bauza (tpt); Frank "Paquito" Davilla (tpt); Bob Woodlen (tpt); Gene Johnson (as); Fred Skerritt (as); Jose Madera (ts); Frank Socolow (ts); Leslie Johnakins (bs); Rene Hernandez (p); Roberto Rodriguez (b); Jose Mangual (bgo); Luis Miranda (cga); Umbaldo Nieto (timbales); Frank "Machito" Grillo (maracas) 1 Mambo Fortunado (Unknown) [bird's Mambo] 5:04 2 Lament for the Congo (Unknown) [bongo Ballad] 5:44 3 Reminiscing at Twilight (F. Davilla) 3:39 Quote
Quasimado Posted March 15, 2007 Report Posted March 15, 2007 Doesn't sound much like Howard to me ... the vibrato is too wide and there are none of his rhythmic mannerisms ... also whoever he is, he seems to be pretty used to playing in that Afro-Cuban style ... Reminiscing is intriguing ... no solos, but it could be Bird playing the lead alto part ... but then again, why would he do that? Q Quote
robviti Posted March 15, 2007 Report Posted March 15, 2007 i noticed its mcghee + a bunch of unknowns so i thought maybe it was mcghee? is anyone familar w/ this? mario bauza is an unknown? Quote
brownie Posted March 15, 2007 Report Posted March 15, 2007 Machito seems to be the accepted leader of the band on those tapes by now. This was not always the case. In the liner notes to the 1979 Spotlite reissue 'Afro_Cubop', Mark Gardner writes about these sides: 'Which brings us to the three titles by an unknown Afro-Cuban Orchestra recorded in New York around May 1950.There are many ifs and buts about these performances. Was is Machito (unlikely) or perhaps Tito Puente? They were supposedly recorded by the late jazz historian Marshall Stearns and it is believed that Frank Socolow was a member of the reed section. Scanty data, to be sure, but of one fact we can be certain: Charlie Parker is the alto saxophonist on Mambo and Lament for the Conga. He may also be present, without soloing, on the dance number Reminiscing at Twilight. Quote
JSngry Posted March 15, 2007 Report Posted March 15, 2007 Reminiscing is intriguing ... no solos, but it could be Bird playing the lead alto part ... but then again, why would he do that? Q Why wouldn't he? Quote
Quasimado Posted March 15, 2007 Report Posted March 15, 2007 Reminiscing is intriguing ... no solos, but it could be Bird playing the lead alto part ... but then again, why would he do that? Q Why wouldn't he? Well, he seems to be the guest soloist, so I would have thought that would be what he was doing - but then again, as you say ... Q Quote
mikeweil Posted March 15, 2007 Report Posted March 15, 2007 (edited) Spinning the Spotlite LP right now. As often, the credits seem to be only partly correct. But it sure sounds like the Machito band of the time! 1. Mambo - This is in fact Roger "King" Mozian's tune Asia Minor Bird on alto. Ubaldo Nieto's timbales cut through - that lick he plays at the end of the chorus (daddaboom) I copied - but try do do it his way! 2. Lament for the Conga (that's the spelling on the Spotlite LP, but Congo should be correct) This sounds like a misnaming of another familiar Machito band repertoire item, but don't ask me now to go through all of them! Trumpet could be Mario Bauza. The bongo player is José Mangual. These descending chord changes are very old - baroque composers used them as Ciacona or Chaconne or Passacaglia - interestingly, baroque scholars always tell they originated in Spain's Latin American colonies! 3. Reminiscing at Twilight If that's really Frank "Paquito" Davilla's tune, why shouldn't he be the featured trumpet on this track (he was a member of the band at the time)? If you listen to other Machito recordings of the time, his lead alto player Eugene Johnson sounds just like the lead alto here. The Spotlite LP, BTW, does not list McGhee for that session! Edited March 15, 2007 by mikeweil Quote
chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez Posted March 15, 2007 Author Report Posted March 15, 2007 is howard mcghee realy even on it? that sux that he is on it but the other guy takes the solo. this lp is the bees knees i tell u- it is a great compainon to the bird "south of the border" cd on verve Quote
mikeweil Posted March 15, 2007 Report Posted March 15, 2007 Which issue of this material do you have? As I said, the Spotlite LP doesn't list McGhee - personnel unknown except for Bird it says. Quote
mikeweil Posted March 15, 2007 Report Posted March 15, 2007 is howard mcghee realy even on it? that sux that he is on it but the other guy takes the solo. Well - they were guests sitting in. When the band played their regular arrangements they would have had to read their part. The regular guys in the band knew them better. They couldn't do descargas all the time! Quote
Teasing the Korean Posted March 16, 2007 Report Posted March 16, 2007 What album or CD are these tracks released on? Quote
brownie Posted March 16, 2007 Report Posted March 16, 2007 The session is on the Spotlite LP 138 (Afro-Cuban) and on the Philology Bird's Eyes vol. 22 CD. Not easy to find! Quote
chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez Posted March 16, 2007 Author Report Posted March 16, 2007 my version had NO liner notes- its the "France Saultes the american jazzmen" version from boris rose- i was using the miles ahead online searchable bird disog. for my info! Quote
Quasimado Posted March 16, 2007 Report Posted March 16, 2007 my version had NO liner notes- its the "France Saultes the american jazzmen" version from boris rose- i was using the miles ahead online searchable bird disog. for my info! Philology Birds Eyes 22 doesn't include Reminiscing, presumeably because Bird doesn't solo - it has the other 2 tracks. Q Quote
Quasimado Posted March 29, 2007 Report Posted March 29, 2007 This is an interesting disc - *Afro Bop - Machito and His Orchestra* (Spotlite LP - SPJ 138). Sources include Boris Rose broadcast tapes from the Royal Roost and Bop City in '49 (Sid introduces several tracks). Soloists are Howard McGhee and Brew Moore, and it includes the 3 tracks discussed above with Bird, including Reminiscing at Twilight. Intelligent notes are by Mark Gardener... The Spotlite label is pretty interesting in itself. Run by Tony Williams in the UK, it put out a lot of fairly obscure Bird things - example *Yardbird in Lotus Land* - SPJ 123, has amazing stuff from the Finale Club etc. in LA '46 (notes are by Ross Russell!), as well as many things from the Dial Catalogue. Spotlite still exists if you do a web search. These days its catalogue includes a lot of British Jazz. Unfortunately, a lot of the issued LPs do not seem to have made it to CD... Afro Bop Machito and His Orchestra Side One Howard's Blues Indianola How High the Moon Cubop City Boppin the Vibes (+Milt Jackson) Side Two Mambo Lament for the Conga Reminiscing at Twilite How High the Moon Tanga Lean on Me (+ Harry Belafonte vocal) Q Quote
chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez Posted March 29, 2007 Author Report Posted March 29, 2007 quasimodeO; can u share more about the bird in loutsland lp--- is that 46 finale on the mosaic? is it worth gettin that lp for that session alone, i thnik its all of just side B Quote
mikeweil Posted March 29, 2007 Report Posted March 29, 2007 Unfortunately, a lot of the issued LPs do not seem to have made it to CD... 4 tracks are on Tumbao TCD-012 by machito and his Afro-Cubans "Cubop City": Howard's Blues Indianola How High the Moon Cubop City Click here Quote
mikeweil Posted March 29, 2007 Report Posted March 29, 2007 Spotlite still exists if you do a web search. These days its catalogue includes a lot of British Jazz. Unfortunately, a lot of the issued LPs do not seem to have made it to CD... Click here. That Cubop LP hasn't been reissued as CD. it seems. Quote
Quasimado Posted March 30, 2007 Report Posted March 30, 2007 quasimodeO; can u share more about the bird in loutsland lp--- is that 46 finale on the mosaic? is it worth gettin that lp for that session alone, i thnik its all of just side B As well as the Finale session, it has a killer Bird/Cherokee w. Nat King Cole. The Finale is possibly on the Mosaic... Away for a week - get back to you later. Q Quote
Quasimado Posted April 9, 2007 Report Posted April 9, 2007 is that 46 finale on the mosaic? is it worth gettin that lp for that session alone, i thnik its all of just side B Yardbird in Lotus Land Spotlite SPJ 123 A (Dizzy Gillespie Rebop Six - Diz/Bird/Haig/Ray Brown/Levy - Hollywood Dec. 29 '45) Shaw 'nuff Groovin High Dizzy Atmosphere (+Milt Jackson) Salt Peanuts (+ Lucky Thompson - Jan. '46) (Bird/WillieSmith/Benny Carter + King Cole Trio+Buddy Rich - Hollywood March/April '46) Medley -Tea for 2 -Body&Soul -Cherokee (Bird w. King Cole Trio ? - Hollywood March/April '46) Ornithology B (Bird/Miles/Joe Albany/Addison Farmer/ Chuck Thompson - Finale Club LA, March '46?) Anthropology Billies Bounce Blue&Boogie All the Things Ornithology B. may be on the Mosaic ... classic. Q Quote
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