Blindfold Test #1 - Discussion

[Joe G]

Yeah, Yeah, Yeah. My first reaction was "that's familiar" rather than "That's Metheny", but I wasn't able to dredge up the better fit. I was listening to a Jack DeJohnette tape with Abercrombie and Lester Bowie in the car a couple weeks ago, but didn't make the connection.

Just having a little fun. We got our asses kicked too.

[mikeweil]

Received my disc - thanks a lot to Couw - on Wednesday and had resisted the temptation to look up the answers, but had read through some of the discussion, which convinced me to join the club. Looking forward to the second test - excellent choices! I had a lot of fun with it, but if goes on like this my wish list will expand rapidly ...

When I get the second disc I won't read any comments before I posted my own. Since most of you have posted their guesses already and/or read the answers, I'm not afraid to drop names.

Here are my comments after three spins:

Track 1: I have no idea who this is, but I would say it's definitely not Django, from what I've heard of him. I enjoyed it, nice style, I'd buy this.

Track 2: At first listen from the kitchen while preparing dinner it reminded me of a 1949 Kai Winding session with Brew Moore, but a closer inspection reveals a newer recording, I'd say Columbia's studios. Could be Jay Jay. Tenor Player? Bobby Jaspar? I'm not sure. I resist the temptation to browse the Columbia Jay Jay discography. Drummer is not Elvin, maybe Tootie Heath?

Track 3: Knew right away this is Kenny Clarke, a Barney Wilen session, I have this, a great session, played to exhaustion after I bought it. Nice to read about Jim Sangrey's problem's with this .... One of Europe's greatest sax talents so far. I would have chosen him for a blindfold just as well.

Track 4: Nice arrangement of Jitterbug Waltz. Has touches of some of the experimental stuff people like George Russell, Hal McKusick, Teddy Charles etc. did in the late 1950's, but not as radical tonality-wise. I know that trumpet player. Like him a lot. Phil Woods or Gene Quill? Might be Bill Evans on piano, sounds like the stuff he played on the Russell arrangements I know - the tenor player sounds like early Coltrane. I'd like to have that one, too. Is this on CD?

Track 5: Great tenor player - from what I've heard of him I'd say Buck Hill. Would have been nice to have a piano solo as well.

Track 6: Very nice. The mood reminds me of one of the pensive trio pieces Horace Silver did on one of his Blue Note albums. Like the way the pianist takes his time and choses his notes well, he knows his church and modern stuff, the way he throws in dissonant chords in unexpected places reminds me of Randy Weston, or one of his disciples, Rodney Kendrick. This is getting expensive - like to have that one too!

Track 7: Sonny Simmons came to mind first. Don't know why, but this sounds like a European rhythm section to me. Don't like the way the bass player phrases during his solo - timing is much too inaccurate. A wild guess would be one of Pony Poindexter's European sessions, but this does not sound like the things I know of him. Too many sloppy notes for him.

Track 8: Two violins - well .... drummer's brushwork sounds like Kenny Clarke again, but the breaks don't - Arthur Taylor or Ed Thigpen? Bass could be NHOP. Wasn't there a violin record with Grappelli and some others - or is this the MPS Violin Summit? Third violin solo starting the fours on the left channel sounds like Stuff Smith. Some answering phrases remind me of Svend Asmussen. Great swinging piano player.

Track 9: Knew this right away - Eddy Louiss with René Thomas and Kenny Clarke - would have been one of my candidates to fool the overseas folks too ... great organ trio record.

Track 10. No this is not Thad Jones & Mel Lewis - drummer doesn't sound like Lewis. Akiyoshi/Tabackin? Haven't heard much of them, but the tenor could be Tabackin. Don't like that they use electric bass, acoustic would be better in my opinion. Curious about the alto and trumpet players - I'll know very soon ...

Track 11: First phrase after the intro gave it away - Joe Henderson on tenor. Is the trumpet Woody Shaw? Thought it was on the Shaw Mosaic, but it isn't! Doesn't quite sound like Shaw. I'm not sure. The piano player is either Herbie or has digested him very well, with a hint of Cedar Walton mixed in. Drummer is Victor Lewis, I'm certain.

Track 12: That's great! Completely threw me! How's the remainder of the record? If it's that wild, I wanna have it! Those tempo changes are great. The marimba player sound like a crossing of Dave Pike and Walt Dickerson to me. Very creative but controlled at the same time. It's not Hutcherson. This is the one I wanna really about! Drummer is somewhat like Daniel Humair. Nice compositional touches, great humor. My favourite of the test.

Track 13: Sounds like an ECM session, probably Abercrombie. Don't know the soprano player. Drums are too low in the mix, maybe Jon Christensen. They all sound alike when recorded that way.

Track 14: Monk's "Little Rootie Tootie". Nice idea to transform those three dissonant chords into that upward phrase. In most cases it won't work when you change even the smallest details in a Monk composition, but this fits. Don't know who this is, but sure would like to have it!

Again: Excellent choices, we're in for a magnificent series of explorations of too little known music. Thanks a plenty to Dr J - had to edit in the name - for compiling this great selection.

And now Ladies and Gentlemen, I'm off the answers thread ...

Edited September 10, 2003 by mikeweil

[Tom Storer]

I'm coming in way late - just received Blindfold #1 on Friday (thanks, Jim D). Had a chance to listen to it and once again recognize the depths of my ignorance. Before reading the answers or even more than the first page of this discussion, here are my guesses:

1. No idea who this is - sounds like it's finger-picked on an electric guitar by someone whose style is more suited to acoustic. Old-timey stuff - I'd say 20's but the electric guitar and the recording sound make me say 30's, maybe even 40's. Nice, but I would have preferred it on acoustic. The percussive effect is a bit brutal on the electric.

2. Brookmeyer and Getz? But it doesn't really have Getz trademarks other than overall fluidity and feel. Could be JJ - only he could make a slide trombone sound like a valve trombone, so crisply articulated. I like this, but the arrangement is a bit rigid; the rhythm section is cooking but they don't let their hair down much.

3. Max Roach, or maybe another early bop drummer. Could be Klook or even Haynes, but it's a little too straight up for Haynes. I'll guess an early Sonny Rollins quartet date with Max.

4. "Jitterbug Waltz." Miles and Trane definitely, therefore I'm assuming it's Cannonball on alto; it also sounds like Bill Evans on piano. This points to circa 1958. The first thing that comes to mind is a Gil Evans collaboration, but I don't think they did "Jitterbug Waltz" on any of their albums together. An out-take? But it sounds way too hokey for Gil Evans. And who's that flute? Not sure where this comes from.

5. I think I know this tenor player but I can't put my finger on who he is. He's a good bebop saxophonist, 1950's era I'd say, but he plays too many notes too evenly for it to be Rollins, and his phrasing lacks the sort of spirited quirkiness of Johnny Griffin, who I considered for the role. I dunno.

6. I can't say I like this one very much. It drags along rather gloomily; in that respect I think of Mal Waldron, not my favorite player, except that this might be a little too bright for him. No idea.

7. I wonder if this isn't from the mid-60's quartet album Elvin Jones did with Hank Jones, Richard Davis, and Charlie Mariano on alto. The drummer sounds Elvinish, and I don't know Mariano much but I have the impression he has this kind of sound; also the music has just enough Coltrane flavor to fit the bill. A guess.

8. "How High The Moon." Sounds like Stephane Grappelli in the right channel. The first thing I thought of was his album with Yehudi Menuhin, but if that's Menuhin playing the other violin, I'm a monkey's uncle. It swings too much. But I'm not enough of a jazz violin buff to identify the other guy.

9. No clue. I'd guess Coryell or some European dude.

10. No idea. Meaty stuff.

11. Beautiful tenor - Joe Henderson? Real nice trumpeter, no idea who it is.

12. My first thought was Bobby Hutcherson and Andrew Hill, but it sounds a lot closer to the present day - avant-gardish but very clean, without that experimental edge. Maybe Stefon Harris and Jason Moran? Bass and drums are right on top of things and keep it swinging - fine musicians. Very well done.

13. Jan Garbarek? That sour tone, that heart-on-the-sleeve sensibility...

14. Modern rendition of Monk's "Little Rootie Tootie". I think it could be any one of a number of modern jazz pianists. Expertly done, nice tension, and I like the drummer, but nothing revolutionary.

[paul secor]

I received Test #1 on Monday, courtesy of Jim Dye (thanks, Jim), and have listened to it a couple of times through, and some tracks three or four times. I"ve made it a true blindfold test - haven't read other people's comments (though I'm looking forward to that after I post my guesses, and haven't checked out AMG).

Listening to this was a humbling experience. There's a lot here that I don't recognize, even though I enjoyed listening to much of it. Anyway, here goes.

1 - No idea. The first names that came to mind were Lonnie Johnson and Teddy Bunn, but neither plays with a much virtuosity as this musician. I normally am somewhat turned off by flashy playing, but in this case the virtuosity is part of the musicality. I'd like to hear more of whoever this is.

2 - J.J.? Possibly a Columbia side?

3 - The tenor player has me baffled. I'm sure it's someone I know, and I probably have this record. The more I listen, the more frunstrated I get. I like the sax, and I would have liked a longer sax solo and less drums.

4 - Nice arrangement of "Jitterbug Waltz". It could have sounded cute, but these guys pulled it of nicely. I enjoyed the trumpet player and the alto (Phil Woods?).

I"m looking forward to finding out who this is. I'd like to get the record if it's available.

5 - Finally! One I have in my collection. Tubby Hayes: "You For Me" from Tubby the Tenor. I played this fairly recently so I recognized the opening.

6 - This drove me nuts. It sounded like someone whose playing I know well, but I couldn't pin it down. Finally I realized that it sounded like late Bud Powell to me. I'm not certain that's it, but some of the voicings and rhythm reminded me of Bud, so I'll go with that.

7 - A post-Trane sax player. Didn't grab me. No idea who it is.

8 - One of the violin players sounded to me like Stephane Grappelly. I know he made a record with Stuff Smith, so it may be them, although he probably recorded with other violinists also. I'd buy this.

9 - Just a guess. I know that Doug Raney made an organ trio record. I've never heard it, but that's my guess.

10 - No idea. The soloists seemed rather anonymous to me, and the large group seemed a bit extraneous.

11 - Generic post bop. The only player who grabbed my attention was the trumpeter for about a minute. He sounded as if his sound came out of his horn very easily, perhaps too easily though, as his solo went nowhere after it opened.

12 - Dave Pike came to mind. I don't know why, as I've never heard Dave Pike. I guess that none of the vibists I know fit and I ended up picking someone whose playing I didn't know. Didn't like the drummer at all. I hope that it's not someone whose playing I normally enjoy. The whole thing seemed like something that was just thrown together.

13 - An ECM recording? Didn't interest me at all, whoever they may be.

14 - "Little Rootie Tootie", I believe. I enjoyed the pianist's playing of the theme - not Monk, but sounded OK to me. They lost me with the solos - where was Monk?

I know that Barry Harris has recorded Monk tunes. I think that he would be somewhat truer to Monk than this.

OK - That's the best I can do. I'm going to check out the answers now and find out what a dunce I am.

[Tom Storer]

What I've found interesting about everybody's comments is that it's got me to wondering how different people "hear" a piece for the first time. Do y'all listen for tone, or rhythm, or vocabulary, or jsut what? And what about studio sound? The Columbia studio & VanGelder studio I could spot right away, but that's just me.

I just wanted to remind you of these thoughts, 'cause I wanted to reply but didn't want to derail this thread. I thinks it's an interesting topic.

Hard to say precisely what I listen for, other than "everything"... probably rhythm section first, then the overall structure, then what the soloist is doing. Definitely not studio sound--in fact, the idea startled me. The concept means nothing to me! I wouldn't recognize a studio sound if I tripped over one.