Guest youmustbe Posted February 11, 2007 Report Posted February 11, 2007 The well earned success of ECM, even in these changing times for the record biz, is due to Manfred Eicher's understanding, that 'Jazz' today, even in Europe, is background, 'Easy Listening' music. I.E. European Smooth Jazz. Nothing wrong with it, just the way it is. Quote
sal Posted February 11, 2007 Report Posted February 11, 2007 Charles Lloyd's latest one with Zakir Hussien and Eric Harland ain't European Smooth Jazz. Quote
Guest youmustbe Posted February 11, 2007 Report Posted February 11, 2007 Not everything is 100%....or is my post too subtle for your mind? Quote
Guy Berger Posted February 11, 2007 Report Posted February 11, 2007 ECM is too big of a label for one troll alone! Guy Quote
tonym Posted February 11, 2007 Report Posted February 11, 2007 ECM is too big of a label for one troll alone! Guy They work in teams you know.... Quote
king ubu Posted February 14, 2007 Report Posted February 14, 2007 Another of these great threads! I love'em! Quote
king ubu Posted February 14, 2007 Report Posted February 14, 2007 On second thought, if what ECM releases is smooth jazz, the same applies to (not 100%, either, mind me!) the output of labels like Palmetto, Criss Cross et. al. It's just a bit of a bluesier and boppier kind of smooth, but it's all old mainstream crap, too.... and of course nothing beats king of smooth remasters, RVG's editions, although it would be smoothier if it wasn't for his use of edgy compression... Quote
king ubu Posted February 14, 2007 Report Posted February 14, 2007 and why start this in the discography forum anyway? want to pull together a list of ECM smoothies here? Quote
Guest donald petersen Posted February 14, 2007 Report Posted February 14, 2007 i would say most of lloyd's oovre on ECM has been some "quiet heat" smooth jazz snooze fests. i was surprised that live recordings of his recent percussion and drums group sounded more heated. maybe he is still upset about billy higgins passing. jan garbarek adding cheesy electronic beats to his most recent "in praise of dreams" album is probably the final boundary breaking down. Quote
king ubu Posted February 14, 2007 Report Posted February 14, 2007 Garbarek had bad electronics before, nothing new under the sun.... but you'd be quite alone among serious jazz fans if you still considered him someone to watch... true, he was quite ok on the Katché Neighbourhood album, and probably also on the Vitous one, but that's about it, as far as Garbarek goes, in the last 15 or so years... Quote
tonym Posted February 14, 2007 Report Posted February 14, 2007 Garbarek had bad electronics before, nothing new under the sun.... but you'd be quite alone among serious jazz fans if you still considered him someone to watch... true, he was quite ok on the Katché Neighbourhood album, and probably also on the Vitous one, but that's about it, as far as Garbarek goes, in the last 15 or so years... From what I've heard of him over that period nothing is close to Star IMO. I think Neighbourhood would've been a ... ahem...better.... album without him. Quote
rockefeller center Posted February 14, 2007 Report Posted February 14, 2007 youmustbe, I'd like to hear your music. Thanks. Quote
king ubu Posted February 15, 2007 Report Posted February 15, 2007 adult contemporary? (aka the US version of ECM euro smooth...) Quote
andybleaden Posted February 15, 2007 Report Posted February 15, 2007 Hear waht you are saying about Jan Garberek and yet got a couple of DVD tv shows from this last year which are really really good. Not fussed mself with In Praise of Dreams but liked him on Manu's LP myself. As for the 'smooth jazz'label ....puulllease! Have you actually heard some of the stuff you are talking about? Some of it is at the limits of what I can tolerate in terms of improvisation......and then there is all the folk traditions....once again too big a mix to lable as this or that...worth a listen..for instance I have got Tonu Kalijuste on at the mo- Estonian Folkie stuff...really NOT smooth jazz trust me Quote
king ubu Posted February 15, 2007 Report Posted February 15, 2007 Yes, I've heard recent live shows of Garbarek (in quartet with Brüninghaus/Weber/Mazur, I think) that were pretty fine, but it seems he (or Eicher? likely both...) is not interested in producing disks along those lines. Quote
neveronfriday Posted February 15, 2007 Report Posted February 15, 2007 If I hear Garbarek one more time ... I have one double CD plus a few single ones that are good and interesting, but that's all I'll ever need (I saw him live twice and it was the same old same old ... again). Nothing against the man, but he's got such a distinct sound and way of playing that I personally find more than one hour of his music boring. There's so much other stuff on ECM and similar labels, but Garbarek turns up again and again. Smooth jazz? ECM? Yeah, some of it ... although my definition of smooth jazz seems to be quite a different one when compared to just about anything I get from ECM. Quote
porcy62 Posted February 15, 2007 Report Posted February 15, 2007 (edited) SMOOTH JAZZ? Coleman Hawkins is smoother then most of ECM stuff. And what about Miles/Gil outputs? Edited February 15, 2007 by porcy62 Quote
7/4 Posted February 15, 2007 Report Posted February 15, 2007 And what about Miles/Gil outputs? Too hip to be smooth. Quote
neveronfriday Posted February 15, 2007 Report Posted February 15, 2007 SMOOTH JAZZ? Coleman Hawkins is smoother then most of ECM stuff. And what about Miles/Gil outputs? And Ben Webster. Quote
porcy62 Posted February 15, 2007 Report Posted February 15, 2007 (edited) SMOOTH JAZZ? Coleman Hawkins is smoother then most of ECM stuff. And what about Miles/Gil outputs? And Ben Webster. I forgot him! Maybe because he makes me sleep at every listening Edited February 15, 2007 by porcy62 Quote
neveronfriday Posted February 15, 2007 Report Posted February 15, 2007 SMOOTH JAZZ? Coleman Hawkins is smoother then most of ECM stuff. And what about Miles/Gil outputs? And Ben Webster. I forgot him! Maybe because he makes me sleep at every listening Yeah, but we're talking healthy and smooooooooooooth sleeping here. And that's a good thing, ain't it? Quote
porcy62 Posted February 15, 2007 Report Posted February 15, 2007 SMOOTH JAZZ? Coleman Hawkins is smoother then most of ECM stuff. And what about Miles/Gil outputs? And Ben Webster. I forgot him! Maybe because he makes me sleep at every listening Yeah, but we're talking healthy and smooooooooooooth sleeping here. And that's a good thing, ain't it? Yeah, much better then benzodiazepines Quote
RDK Posted February 15, 2007 Report Posted February 15, 2007 Why the hostility? I thought Youmustbe was joking - or at least being sarcastic. Iirc, he's stood up for Eicher and ECM in other threads. Quote
Joe G Posted February 15, 2007 Report Posted February 15, 2007 I also think there was a mis-reading of the original post. Quote
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