Prestige

[kh1958]

I picked up a number of "blue label" (I believe late 1960s) Prestige LPs last weekend--the vinyl was very dusty but once cleaned, seemed to have been played once, if at all.

Don Patterson with Sonny Stitt--Donny Brook

Willis Jackson--Soul Grabber

Sonny Stitt--Soul Electricity

Johnny Hammond Smith--the Stinger

Sonny Stitt with Don Patterson--Night Crawler

Shirley Scott--Hip Twist

Willis Jackson with Brother Jack McDuff--Cool Grits

Brother Jack McDuff--Go With It

Richard Groove Holmes--The Groover.

I was just wondering--what do these late Prestiges typically go for? Just about all are Van Gelder recordings with Van Gelder in the wax. They sound rather good to me. Do these simply lack the allure of Blue Notes and sell for a low price typically?l

[Parkertown]

The ones I usually see are beat to hell.

How do they sound? Thin? Or warm?

[kh1958]

They sound warm to me, not thin--the organs sound especially good. Mind you, I'm listening on a Revolver turntable with a Linn Basik tonearm--nice but not super high end.

This is my best LP score in many years.

[porcy62]

I have some of them, and they were hugely cheaper compared to yellow label. I don't remember the sound. I am sure Chuck will know where they were pressed and how is the vinyl quality.

[The Magnificent Goldberg]

Most of that stuff was never available on yellow labels. The blue ones are the originals. But I'm not sure when the changeover from yellow to blue occurred.

All very good Soul Jazz material. Prices in Britain may well be higher than in the US, as there's still a bit of affection among UK DJs for this stuff. I'm not up on what the material is going for NOW, however, but a few years ago, the stuff was going for somewhere in the region of $40-50. All of it is out on CD.

MG

[kh1958]

The Don Patterson LP has "Blue Grant" on guitar. He takes the first solo on the record, and it is obviously Grant Green.

[sidewinder]

For some reason the 'Blue' labels seem to be rediculously overpriced in Europe. In North America they seem to be readily available around the $20 mark but are routinely twice that in UK and France, for example. High prices in UK probably as a result of not many copies making it over here (the country was bust in the 1960s and early 70s ). Not sure exactly when the switch to blue label happened but must have been around 1967.

Edited January 17, 2007 by sidewinder

[brownie]

The switch from yellow to blue labels for Prestige vinyls occured in 1964.

[Soul Stream]

  kh1958 said:

The Don Patterson LP has "Blue Grant" on guitar. He takes the first solo on the record, and it is obviously Grant Green.

Yeah, that's definately Grant. When they issued the CD, he's listed as Grant Green.

My favorite soul jazz alias was Litte Miss Cott for Shirley Scott on Turrentine's "Dearly Beloved" Blue Note LP.

[sidewinder]

  brownie said:

The switch from yellow to blue labels for Prestige vinyls occured in 1964.

Interesting !

[porcy62]

  The Magnificent Goldberg said:

Most of that stuff was never available on yellow labels. The blue ones are the originals.

oops...

[jazzhound]

  porcy62 said:

  The Magnificent Goldberg said:

Most of that stuff was never available on yellow labels. The blue ones are the originals.

oops...

blue label originals sound fine. I just picked up some sealed Chet Baker ones and can't decide to keep them or sell them ...

[Jim R]

  Soul Stream said:

  kh1958 said:

The Don Patterson LP has "Blue Grant" on guitar. He takes the first solo on the record, and it is obviously Grant Green.

Yeah, that's definately Grant. When they issued the CD, he's listed as Grant Green.

This may be useless trivia, but I remember being a little surprised years ago when I bought Patterson's TUNE UP! album. He was listed as "Blue Grant" on that LP as well, and it was pretty clear that it was Grant Green, but I could swear the recording had been sped up... Grant almost sounded like Pat Martino. I wonder if the same thing occured on the LP version of DONNYBROOK (which I never owned).

[The Magnificent Goldberg]

  Jim R said:

  Soul Stream said:

  kh1958 said:

The Don Patterson LP has "Blue Grant" on guitar. He takes the first solo on the record, and it is obviously Grant Green.

Yeah, that's definately Grant. When they issued the CD, he's listed as Grant Green.

This may be useless trivia, but I remember being a little surprised years ago when I bought Patterson's TUNE UP! album. He was listed as "Blue Grant" on that LP as well, and it was pretty clear that it was Grant Green, but I could swear the recording had been sped up... Grant almost sounded like Pat Martino. I wonder if the same thing occured on the LP version of DONNYBROOK (which I never owned).

GG COULD play fast, when necessary, but he didn't like to do a whole lot of it because it wasn't what he was there for. But he did try to fit in and work with whoever he was playing with and, with Don, well you've got to do a bit of speedy stuff.

MG

[Peter A]

  Jim R said:

This may be useless trivia, but I remember being a little surprised years ago when I bought Patterson's TUNE UP! album. He was listed as "Blue Grant" on that LP as well, and it was pretty clear that it was Grant Green, but I could swear the recording had been sped up... Grant almost sounded like Pat Martino. I wonder if the same thing occured on the LP version of DONNYBROOK (which I never owned).

Grant played MUCH faster on his later (post 1969) than on his earlier (pre 1966) records, at least on some of the tracks. Try for instance Rusty Bryant Returns, Visions, Shades of Green or The Final Comedown.

[Peter A]

  brownie said:

The switch from yellow to blue labels for Prestige vinyls occured in 1964.

That's correct.

Some more labeltrivia: the switch seems to be around the numbers 7300-7320, although there might even have been a transition label: a plain gold label (unfortunately don't have a picture).

My copies of 7310 (The New Boss Guitar of George Benson) 7316 (John Coltrane - Black Pearls), 7331 (The Exciting New Organ of Don Patterson) have this gold label.

On the other hand 7318 (Booker Ervin - The Song Book) and 7321 (The Rocking Tenor Sax of Eddie Chamblee) still have the yellow label, while 7315 (Kenny Burrell - Soul Call) and 7320 (Gene Ammons Velvet Soul) have blue labels.

[The Magnificent Goldberg]

  Peter A said:

  brownie said:

The switch from yellow to blue labels for Prestige vinyls occured in 1964.

That's correct.

Some more labeltrivia: the switch seems to be around the numbers 7300-7320, although there might even have been a transition label: a plain gold label (unfortunately don't have a picture).

My copies of 7310 (The New Boss Guitar of George Benson) 7316 (John Coltrane - Black Pearls), 7331 (The Exciting New Organ of Don Patterson) have this gold label.

On the other hand 7318 (Booker Ervin - The Song Book) and 7321 (The Rocking Tenor Sax of Eddie Chamblee) still have the yellow label, while 7315 (Kenny Burrell - Soul Call) and 7320 (Gene Ammons Velvet Soul) have blue labels.

I'd forgotten about the gold labels. "Cookin' together" by Red Holloway & Jack McDuff PR7325 had a gold label. Spoon's "Blues around the clock" PR7314 had a yellow label.

Prestige LPs didn't necessarily come out in numerical order, so I wonder whether these differences relate to release dates.

7310 ?......gold

7314 9/64 yellow

7315 ?......blue

7316 ?......gold

7318 9/64 yellow

7320 3/65 blue

7321 8/64 yellow

7325 ?......gold

7331 ?......gold

Unfortunately, my 1967 Schwann doesn't give release dates for the LPs against which I've put question marks. It LOOKS as if the release date may be the important point here, and maybe we could be more positive if we had a bigger sample of the issues.

MG

Edited January 18, 2007 by The Magnificent Goldberg

[Chuck Nessa]

Prestige 7326, a reissue of Saxophone Colossus, had gold labels.

[Peter A]

  The Magnificent Goldberg said:

It LOOKS as if the release date may be the important point here, and maybe we could be more positive if we had a bigger sample of the issues.

Thanks for the additional info, MG. It absolutely makes sense that the release date is the key to the problem here.

Blue Note LP's have the same problem: like Prestige LP's they were not released in numerical order. That's why for instance at some point the new titles were released with NY-labels, while some later numbers - which in fact were released earlier - still had the 63rd St-labels.

Peter

[The Magnificent Goldberg]

  Chuck Nessa said:

Prestige 7326, a reissue of Saxophone Colossus, had gold labels.

That's another for which there's no release date in Schwann. Schwann only used to quote release dates if the company provided a track listing - the date is technically a reference to the date on which the track listing appeared in earlier editions of the catalogue.

Looks like there was a period when Prestige staff couldn't be asked to provide listings.

MG

[kh1958]

I bought a few more from the same source:

Brother Jack McDuff--Hallelujah Time!, the Midnight Sun, Prelude, and Soul Circle.

Gene Ammons--the Boss is Back

Richard Groove Holmes--That Healin' Feelin'

James Moody--Don't Look Away Now!

The Ammons, Groove Holmes, and McDuff's Soul Circle, all have Chris Albertson liner notes.

[six string]

  Chuck Nessa said:

Prestige 7326, a reissue of Saxophone Colossus, had gold labels.

I have a copy of Eric Dolphy's Outward Bound on a gold label Prestige. It's not mentioned in the Goldmine book.

[The Magnificent Goldberg]

  six string said:

  Chuck Nessa said:

Prestige 7326, a reissue of Saxophone Colossus, had gold labels.

I have a copy of Eric Dolphy's Outward Bound on a gold label Prestige. It's not mentioned in the Goldmine book.

That's 7311, another with no release date listed.

MG

[Chuck Nessa]

  The Magnificent Goldberg said:

  six string said:

  Chuck Nessa said:

Prestige 7326, a reissue of Saxophone Colossus, had gold labels.

I have a copy of Eric Dolphy's Outward Bound on a gold label Prestige. It's not mentioned in the Goldmine book.

That's 7311, another with no release date listed.

MG

FWIW, the Schwann listings were dated when first published. The issue date was often 2 months earlier. Schwann also asked for promo copies to "verify information". If you sent the record the details were printed, if you didn't they only listed the record. In the early '70s while managing a chain of record stores in Boston I discovered the reason for the demand of promos - William Schwann would drive up to the store's front door and sell the records out of the trunk/boot. What a creep.

Edited January 21, 2007 by Chuck Nessa

[The Magnificent Goldberg]

  Chuck Nessa said:

  The Magnificent Goldberg said:

  six string said:

  Chuck Nessa said:

Prestige 7326, a reissue of Saxophone Colossus, had gold labels.

I have a copy of Eric Dolphy's Outward Bound on a gold label Prestige. It's not mentioned in the Goldmine book.

That's 7311, another with no release date listed.

MG

FWIW, the Schwann listings were dated when first published. The issue date was often 2 months earlier. Schwann also asked for promo copies to "verify information". If you sent the record the details were printed, if you didn't they only listed the record. In the early '70s while managing a chain of record stores in Boston I discovered the reason for the demand of promos - William Schwann would drive up to the store's front door and sell the records out of the trunk/boot. What a creep.

What a shyster!

MG