Saxes inc/ Trombone Scene

[jazzkrow]

Dem bastards at Dusty Groove are selling 2 Warner Bros 1956/1959 LPs as a compilation-Lps titled Saxes Inc (with all the big names-Hawkins, Woods, Sims, etc) along with Trombone Scene with Bert, Cleveland, Green and Knepper. Anyone here heard either of these 2 Warner Bros LPs. Sounds like an intriguing 2-fer for $12.99.

Anyone have these Lps? Comments?

thanks,

Jeff

[jazzbo]

The lps are good. Not essential, but good listening, great sound.

[brownie]

At that price, the two reunited albums are a giveaway!

The Saxes Inc. is a very interesting gathering with all the required sax greats. The Trombones is not as successful but still makes a satisfying date!

[Stereojack]

  brownie said:

At that price, the two reunited albums are a giveaway!

The Saxes Inc. is a very interesting gathering with all the required sax greats. The Trombones is not as successful but still makes a satisfying date!

I love the Trombones, Inc record, especially the west coast side. Frank Rosolino steals it. Great arrangements by Marty Paich & JJ Johnson.

The Saxes Inc looks good on paper, but has never completely hung together for me.

[Chuck Nessa]

I always thought both dates were stupid "producer's dates". YMMV.

Why give money to creeps for bad music?

[Big Beat Steve]

I have the original LP of Saxes, Inc. and agree with Brownie and Jazzbo.

Not absolutely essential but a nice session. Both the arangers' and the soloists' work include enough highlights to warrant repeated hearing. It should appeal both to both modernist and swing-oriented mainstream jazz fans. On the other hand of course, it definitely is no Hard Bop ...

If it was only a gimmick, why would Down Beat have rated it 4 stars? Not that I would base my record buying on DB reviews but I'd say their tastes weren't that weird. The reviewer incidentally said the date first looked like "another gimmick idea" to him too but when he heard the final record he realized "how good it really was" and credited the soloits with being "on a generally high level throughout".

The project may have been a sort of salesman's idea, but on the other hand one might say the same of other dates, e.g. some Blue Note dates striving for that "Blue Note sound" in the first place or of some Prestige dates set up as "yet another Prestige blowing session".

[Larry Kart]

  Big Beat Steve said:

If it was only a gimmick, why would Down Beat have rated it 4 stars? Not that I would base my record buying on DB reviews but I'd say their tastes weren't that weird.

DB reviewers, at any point in that mag's life span, were a very mixed bag -- some trustworthy and at best quite insightful, others close to or utterly worthless. Do you know the name of the reviewer in this case (or perhaps this was when they went by initials only, e.g. D.C. for Dom Cerulli, M.W. for Martin Williams)? As a faithful reader of DB in that era, I could give you a pocket estimate of that reviewer's competence and prejudices.

[Chuck Nessa]

  Larry Kart said:

  Big Beat Steve said:

If it was only a gimmick, why would Down Beat have rated it 4 stars? Not that I would base my record buying on DB reviews but I'd say their tastes weren't that weird.

DB reviewers, at any point in that mag's life span, were a very mixed bag -- some trustworthy and at best quite insightful, others close to or utterly worthless. Do you know the name of the reviewer in this case (or perhaps this was when they went by initials only, e.g. D.C. for Dom Cerulli, M.W. for Martin Williams)? As a faithful reader of DB in that era, I could give you a pocket estimate of that reviewer's competence and prejudices.

Saxes Inc was reviewed by Ira.

BTW, in another thread I pointed out DB gave Ellington's In Orbit 2.5 stars. You gotta know the reviewers, the context and the music.

[felser]

  Chuck Nessa said:

  Larry Kart said:

DB reviewers, at any point in that mag's life span, were a very mixed bag -- some trustworthy and at best quite insightful, others close to or utterly worthless. Do you know the name of the reviewer in this case (or perhaps this was when they went by initials only, e.g. D.C. for Dom Cerulli, M.W. for Martin Williams)? As a faithful reader of DB in that era, I could give you a pocket estimate of that reviewer's competence and prejudices.

Saxes Inc was reviewed by Ira.

BTW, in another thread I pointed out DB gave Ellington's In Orbit 2.5 stars. You gotta know the reviewers, the context and the music.

Who were the best of the reviewers in that era? Who are the best since then?

[Chuck Nessa]

  felser said:

  Chuck Nessa said:

  Larry Kart said:

DB reviewers, at any point in that mag's life span, were a very mixed bag -- some trustworthy and at best quite insightful, others close to or utterly worthless. Do you know the name of the reviewer in this case (or perhaps this was when they went by initials only, e.g. D.C. for Dom Cerulli, M.W. for Martin Williams)? As a faithful reader of DB in that era, I could give you a pocket estimate of that reviewer's competence and prejudices.

Saxes Inc was reviewed by Ira.

BTW, in another thread I pointed out DB gave Ellington's In Orbit 2.5 stars. You gotta know the reviewers, the context and the music.

Who were the best of the reviewers in that era? Who are the best since then?

The real answer is "who matches up with my tastes most often". One thing you might not think of is the reviewer's friendship with the artist or producer.

So, they are all good if you know your shit.

[felser]

  Chuck Nessa said:

  felser said:

  Chuck Nessa said:

  Larry Kart said:

DB reviewers, at any point in that mag's life span, were a very mixed bag -- some trustworthy and at best quite insightful, others close to or utterly worthless. Do you know the name of the reviewer in this case (or perhaps this was when they went by initials only, e.g. D.C. for Dom Cerulli, M.W. for Martin Williams)? As a faithful reader of DB in that era, I could give you a pocket estimate of that reviewer's competence and prejudices.

Saxes Inc was reviewed by Ira.

BTW, in another thread I pointed out DB gave Ellington's In Orbit 2.5 stars. You gotta know the reviewers, the context and the music.

Who were the best of the reviewers in that era? Who are the best since then?

The real answer is "who matches up with my tastes most often". One thing you might not think of is the reviewer's friendship with the artist or producer.

So, they are all good if you know your shit.

But most of us are outside the industry, and aren't able to factor in things like the reviewer's relationship with the artist. I understand that you need a proper paradigm to optimally benefit from a reviewer, but while some just have different tastes (Milo Fine in Cadence loved free jazz back when I was reading Cadence faithfully, and I'm a more marginal fan, but he was a good read. Bob Rusch was the guy my tastes matched up much better with, plus he was also excellent), some are just better than others (Scott Yanow was a huge improvement over Wynn and Nastos in the Allmusic Guide when he came in), more able to explain what's going on in the music, and able to explain why they give a certain evaluation to a certain album. Some, like Nate Dorward in Coda, are just such utterly enjoyable writers, I don't have to agree with them to appreciate their reviews.

[Stereojack]

FWIW, the label was pleased enough with the Down Beat review of Trombones, Inc, that they redesigned the jacket, highlighting the rave review on the front cover (4 or 5 stars, can't remember).

I agree with Chuck that the only valuable reviews are the ones with which we agree, and one has to know a reviewer to have any sense whether his review has any value. Some of my favorite records have been panned, and I've heard some dogs that got high reviews. It's all pretty meaningless, ultimately.

I stopped paying attention to reviews a long time ago. I know what I like, and, with all modesty, I know more than most reviewers, so their opinions are of little value to me.

[Dan Gould]

  Big Beat Steve said:

The project may have been a sort of salesman's idea, but on the other hand one might say the same of other dates, e.g. some Blue Note dates striving for that "Blue Note sound" in the first place or of some Prestige dates set up as "yet another Prestige blowing session".

I don't think striving for the "Blue Note sound" or "another Prestige blowing session" qualifies as a "salesman's idea" unless the salesman is happy selling the "same old same old" and doesn't care what gets ordered as long as he leaves with an order. I don't think Blue Note or Prestige ever indulged in this sort of slightly contrived session.

That Jazz Masquerade Party or the Morris Gant plays Junk (or whatever that title was), those were "salesman's ideas".