Michael Weiss Debuts at the Village Vanguard

[AllenLowe]

well, as long as Lorraine doesn't confuse Mike with Thelonious Monk -

[Guest youmustbe]

Yes. the cold, hard facts of the nite club life........Birdland, the current one on 44th Street, had this policy of letting theatergoers after their play in for free for 2nd set...so the musicians would say "Hey, the second set is Sold Out!!...How come he's paying us so little?!'...

[AllenLowe]

"how come he's paying us so little?"

because he's a cheap a-hole like all club owners -

[catesta]

Saturday is ALWAYS sold out at Vanguard...it;s such a small place that if my grandmother played there, it would be sold out. ALL clubs pack 'em in on Saturday nights, for that matter.

Are you saying Jim Belushi would come watch your grandmother play?

[Guest youmustbe]

Open a club in NYC...deal with the high rent, labor costs, etc, etc, and see how 'generous' you are to the musicians, especially when no one shows up to see them... Don't make comments about things you have no knowledge about.

NY Jazz clubs have finally stopped their stupid turf wars against the Blue Note...they all offer a reasonable fee for the artists they book, based on their drawing power. It;s human nature to complain. Back in the 'Golden Age' Max Gordon, if people didn't show up would not pay the band..."Boys, it was kind of light tonite...." Today the main complaint by musicians is that they get 1099's from the clubs.

You know, it's like everyone bitched about the record companies and how they were 'thieves' etc. Well, there are no more record companies anymore! The musicians have their own. And you know what? Branford doesn't pay royalties either!

[AllenLowe]

something I know nothing about? How many NYC clubs have you played? I lived down there and worked down there (including a regular gig for a time at Sweet Basil) - so stick it and stop behaving like a first-class jerk -

[marcello]

Things have changes a lot since the 70's.

Youmustbe is spot on (outside of the personal jibe) in my expierence.

As a producer,youmustbe has much current contact with the clubs and artists in NYC.

[Guest youmustbe]

Whatever!

But be that as it may, many Jazz clubs in NY are now run like any other entertainment business. Jazz Standard has weekly meetings with board of directors of holding company, in which the booking agent has to justify the previous week's earnings. Dizzy's Coca Cola has such a high overhead that they have to keep the fees relatively low. All the clubs now have adopted a 'this is what we can pay and stay in business' attitude.

The reason Birdland let the theatergoers in for free on 2nd sets btw, was because NOBODY was showing up for second sets! Now they charge them 10 dollars plus minimum if they show their Playbill for second set. And many clubs have 50% discounts for students. So you look and see a lot of young people and chances are they are paying half price admissions, and they're not ordering the bottle of wine or the salmon! And the fact that most clubs serve food, even with the great markup, it's still a whole 'nother biz.

The only worrying trend is that the 2 nighter seems to be coming to NYC from the rest of America. It's hard booking the States because, of course, the geography and the cost to transverse it, but also because a lot of clubs in the rest of the country are doing 2 nighters. Like in the Smooth Jazz world, you get a Wednesday and Thursday, no weekends at the Hard Rocks because on Friday and Saturday people come out anyway so why pay for a band when the place is gonna be packed?!

Which is where I came in. (Gotta get Grandma that Vegas Hard Rock gig! I've been promising her)

[J Larsen]

The thread took a totally unneccesary and nasty turn, which I nearly made the mistake of furthering.

In any case, glad it went well, Michael. Sorry I couldn't make it.

[AllenLowe]

"Things have changed a lot since the 70's."

I didn't work in clubs in the 1970s but 20 years after that - and I know enough working musicians to know that some things have not changed; to quote Gertrude Stein, a clubowner is a clubowner is a clubowner - plead poverty and than drive the Mercedes home to Westchester every night.

but to get back on topic - the Vanguard is one of the premier gigs anyone in the world can land - and I have been in that club when it was anything but full, so unless Weiss has a REALLY BIG family, this was a major successful gig -

[Michael Weiss]

For what it's worth, we had a full house again last night. Cedar Walton and Barry Harris came out.

Thanks for the well wishes, catesta.

youmustbe ought to start another thread where he can vent about his problems and leave me out of it.

My group was paid and treated quite well. I don't know what all the fuss is about.

Edited October 30, 2006 by Michael Weiss

[sheldonm]

For what it's worth, we had a full house again last night. Cedar Walton and Barry Harris came out.

Thanks for the well wishes, catesta.

youmustbe ought to start another thread where he can vent about his problems and leave me out of it.

My group was paid and treated quite well. I don't know what all the fuss is about.

Congrats Michael....wish I could have been there!

Mark~

[catesta]

For what it's worth, we had a full house again last night. Cedar Walton and Barry Harris came out.

Thanks for the well wishes, catesta.

youmustbe ought to start another thread where he can vent about his problems and leave me out of it.

My group was paid and treated quite well. I don't know what all the fuss is about.

Very impressive.

[ghost of miles]

For what it's worth, we had a full house again last night. Cedar Walton and Barry Harris came out.

That was my intro to you, actually--around the time I started getting into jazz I picked up the Powell-on-Verve set, and really enjoyed reading your & Barry's reactions to the music (contained within the booklet). Here's hoping we see Peter Pullman's Bud bio soon.