Monk and JJ Johnson on Blue Note

[take5]

I've seen different versions of The Eminent J.J. Johnson Vol 2 and Thelonious Monk Vol 1 & 2 (but only one version of JJ Vol 1, which I bought) with different cover art. Is there a different in content and/or mastering between them?

[Dan Gould]

I am pretty sure it was a mastering difference when they were brought back into print. And the covers were much better, too.

[jazzbo]

Here's how I remember it: The two volumes of both versions collectively have the same material, but they may not be identical volume to volume. . . .

The newest are the RVGs and I think these are among the very best sounding RVGs there ever have been.

[Claude]

The new ones are remastered by Rudy Van Gelder (nice improvement). I think the tracklists changed too, so you better compare them before upgrading individual discs only.

[J.A.W.]

The RVGs have the complete tracks in chronological order; I think the earlier CD issues followed the (different) LP order. I'm not sure if the earlier discs had all the tracks.

Edited July 20, 2006 by J.A.W.

[Chuck Nessa]

IIRC the track lists were the same for old and new cd editions, at least the US versions.

Edit to say I'm certain about the JJ, less sure about the Monks.

Edited July 20, 2006 by Chuck Nessa

[J.A.W.]

Note in the booklets of the RVG Monks: Because this CD does not conform in content to the original 12" LP, we have not included the original liner notes. The original LP mixed various sessions in incomplete form. This CD reissue presents the music of each session as it was recorded and in complete form.

The earlier Monk CD issues followed the LP session order.

Edited July 20, 2006 by J.A.W.

[mikeweil]

Note in the booklets of the RVG Monks: Because this CD does not conform in content to the original 12" LP, we have not included the original liner notes. The original LP mixed various sessions in incomplete form. This CD reissue presents the music of each session as it was recorded and in complete form.

The earlier Monk CD issues followed the LP session order.

That last sentence is not correct:

These sessions originally had been on 10" LP (partly on 78's) and, due to playing time restrictions, were mixed up for the 12" LPs, which thus were the first reissues. Cover art was changed, too. On an average, three 10" LPs were used for two 12" LPs; in some cases, previously unissued alternates or tracks were added. In cases were there was not enough material for two LPs, tracks were left off (e.g. Lou Donaldson, Horace Silver Trios).

This applies to the Miles Davis, Thelonious Monk, Jay Jay Johnson, Clifford Brown, Tadd Dameron, Art Blakey Birdland, and Milt Jackson sessions.

For the first US CD issues Michael Cuscuna completed the sessions and put the tracks in recording order, but used the cover art of the 12" LPs.

The RVGs also have the complete sessions in recording order but ise the 10" LP cover art and, of course, are newly remastered by RVG.

There were Japanese issues replicating the 12" LP order, putting the remaining material on additional CDs.

[J.A.W.]

Note in the booklets of the RVG Monks: Because this CD does not conform in content to the original 12" LP, we have not included the original liner notes. The original LP mixed various sessions in incomplete form. This CD reissue presents the music of each session as it was recorded and in complete form.

The earlier Monk CD issues followed the LP session order.

That last sentence is not correct:

These sessions originally had been on 10" LP (partly on 78's) and, due to playing time restrictions, were mixed up for the 12" LPs, which thus were the first reissues. Cover art was changed, too. On an average, three 10" LPs were used for two 12" LPs; in some cases, previously unissued alternates or tracks were added. In cases were there was not enough material for two LPs, tracks were left off (e.g. Lou Donaldson, Horace Silver Trios).

This applies to the Miles Davis, Thelonious Monk, Jay Jay Johnson, Clifford Brown, Tadd Dameron, Art Blakey Birdland, and Milt Jackson sessions.

For the first US CD issues Michael Cuscuna completed the sessions and put the tracks in recording order, but used the cover art of the 12" LPs.

The RVGs also have the complete sessions in recording order but ise the 10" LP cover art and, of course, are newly remastered by RVG.

There were Japanese issues replicating the 12" LP order, putting the remaining material on additional CDs.

I was referring to the Japanese Monk CD reissues, in the 1990s "Blue Note Works" series. Forgot to mention that. Oh well, no need to edit my post now.

Edited July 20, 2006 by J.A.W.

[Bluesnik]

As has been said above the tracks are the same but in different order and maybe some differences in alt takes. But I'm speaking off the top of my head, without the discs at hand.

What really sets them apart is the RVG remastering on the recent (2001-02, I guess) RVGs and the cover art. The RVGs use the covers of the first (pre '55) release, the 5000 series, while the older versions (the first CD release) use the more popular Reid Miles covers of the 1500 series 12" LP reissues of those 10 inchers.

I personally prefer the older covers (John Hermansadder, I think), but I'm a sucker for 50's cover art. So I would recommend the RVGs, even if only soundwise. And they also carry repros of the Reid Miles covers inside, if I remember well.

[John L]

Since they used the older cover for the RVG J.J. Volume 2, I wonder why they didn't do the same for Volume 1?

J.J Volume 1

[brownie]

Since they used the older cover for the RVG J.J. Volume 2, I wonder why they didn't do the same for Volume 1?

J.J Volume 1

I would say because the original was a composite photo which was probably a no-no by the time of the RVG reissue series.