Free For All Posted July 26, 2003 Report Posted July 26, 2003 (edited) There's a tune on Pepper Adams' recording "Encounter" that Thad wrote called "Elusive" that has a very interesting form. It's just like something Thad would do, an extended blues that's a little left of center. Anyone familiar w/this one? Anyone play this tune? Anyone else like this recording? (W/Zoot, Elvin, Ron Carter and Tommy Flanagan) It's nice to come across a tune that breaks the usual 8 bar phrase routine. That's one reason I never get tired of tunes like Alone Together (nice 14 bar A section) or Infant Eyes (9 bar phrases) among others. I must say I'm totally impressed and humbled by the knowledge represented on this board. So, can I borrow $20? Edited July 26, 2003 by Free For All Quote
Michael Fitzgerald Posted July 26, 2003 Report Posted July 26, 2003 Don't ask me for money - but advice is no problem. It's worth investigating the compositions of Gigi Gryce and Benny Golson. They were really stretching things in terms of form in the 1950s. Go check out a tune Gigi wrote called "Satellite." It's so deceptive - it sounds easy and swings, but it's very complex in form with key changes and also meter shifts. Plus the head chords aren't the solo chords, and the different soloists get different chords, with interludes, etc. There are plenty more where that came from. Gigi could write a great contrafact, or a great simple tune, but to me, his greatest accomplishment writing-wise was how he brought in those odd phrase lengths. Benny was being discussed elsewhere here. Mike Quote
Free For All Posted July 26, 2003 Author Report Posted July 26, 2003 (edited) Michael, I sure enjoy your posts. You really know your shit! So, where can I find a recording of Gryce's "Satellite"? I'd like to check it out. I know, I could do a search, but I thought first I'd see if you had it on the tip of your tongue. Edited July 26, 2003 by Free For All Quote
Michael Fitzgerald Posted July 26, 2003 Report Posted July 26, 2003 But of course - he recorded it twice (and no one has ever done it since). First in 1955 with Art Farmer on "Art Farmer Quintet featuring Gigi Gryce" (CD on OJC) and then in 1957 with Donald Byrd on the Jazz Lab's "Modern Jazz Perspective" (CD on Collectables). Mike Quote
Free For All Posted July 26, 2003 Author Report Posted July 26, 2003 (edited) ......and thank you! BTW, are you familiar w/that Thad tune? It's really interesting. Edited July 26, 2003 by Free For All Quote
Michael Fitzgerald Posted July 26, 2003 Report Posted July 26, 2003 (edited) I know it from the recording with Mingus, not from the later one with Zoot. Somehow I want to say there's another well-known recording of this tune - perhaps under another title but maybe it's just too late and I need sleep. Mike Now I'm really confused - I have a Glenn Wilson record titled Elusive and the title tune is credited to Thad, but it's what the 1954 Debut album calls "Bitty Ditty" - which I know from the Miles Davis recording, which is the well-known recording I was thinking of. OK - I'm slowly coming around. The tune listed as Elusive on the Mingus Debut box is actually Bitty Ditty - yes? So just clear things up - is the Pepper & Zoot one the tune that starts with a repeated minor second or the one that starts with a triplet with a pickup? Mike Edited July 26, 2003 by Michael Fitzgerald Quote
Free For All Posted July 27, 2003 Author Report Posted July 27, 2003 Triplet with an eighth pickup. Quote
mikeweil Posted July 29, 2003 Report Posted July 29, 2003 As far as I can see there was a mix up of tune titles when the Debut 10" LPs were reassembled for the 12" issues. So maybe Pepper Adams used the falsely attributed title from the LP he had. Or he was right, if he got the lead sheet from Thad - which is not all that unlikely - and the LP has it wrong .... Quote
Jim Alfredson Posted August 14, 2003 Report Posted August 14, 2003 That tune "Shades of Light" by Hubert Laws has interesting changes that are tricky to navigate. I first heard it on Mel Rhyne's Criss Cross release "Boss Organ". Cool tune! Quote
Soul Stream Posted August 16, 2003 Report Posted August 16, 2003 (edited) O.k., Jim, I don't want to be the one to tell you this. But you HAVE to stop playing "Sugar." It's an intervention. ....If you don't stop now, you could move on to even more self-destructive tunes...like "Mr. Magic." Edited August 16, 2003 by Soul Stream Quote
Jim Alfredson Posted August 21, 2003 Report Posted August 21, 2003 Damn, we everybody be gettin' on my case for playin' Sugar? It's a good tune! Fine. I'll stop playing it. We'll stick to "Why Not?" instead. And if I have to get my Stanley fix we'll do Minor Chant. Actually, I love Shirley & Stanley's version of "411 West". We were playin' that for awhile but it's not quite the same without tenor. I also wrote a tune in tribute of Don Patterson that's a nice little minor thing. We'll do that now instead of Sugar. I promise. Next gig is tomorrow night and no Sugar will be had. For the record, I have played Mr. Magic exactly once in my lifetime. o.O Quote
Soul Stream Posted August 21, 2003 Report Posted August 21, 2003 Damn, we everybody be gettin' on my case for playin' Sugar? It's a good tune! Fine. I'll stop playing it. We'll stick to "Why Not?" instead. And if I have to get my Stanley fix we'll do Minor Chant. Actually, I love Shirley & Stanley's version of "411 West". We were playin' that for awhile but it's not quite the same without tenor. I also wrote a tune in tribute of Don Patterson that's a nice little minor thing. We'll do that now instead of Sugar. I promise. Next gig is tomorrow night and no Sugar will be had. For the record, I have played Mr. Magic exactly once in my lifetime. o.O Speaking of the live set. When are you going to post some special "live" recordings again on your website? I dig when musicians w/websites do that. Feels like you're getting some extra candy for free! ...hey, and I'm just kidding about "Sugar." But NOT Mr. Magic!!!!! B) Quote
Rooster_Ties Posted August 21, 2003 Report Posted August 21, 2003 Speaking of the live set. When are you going to post some special "live" recordings again on your website? I dig when musicians w/websites do that. Feels like you're getting some extra candy for free!! I hear that, and second the nomination. All in favor????? Where's some live stuff!!! Bring it on!!!!! Quote
Soul Stream Posted August 21, 2003 Report Posted August 21, 2003 Damn, we everybody be gettin' on my case for playin' Sugar? It's a good tune Hey Jim, why not combine your love of Shirley Scott and "Sugar"....play "Let It Go" from the Impulse Stanley Turrentine LP of the same name. "Let It Go" is the same song as "Sugar" except hipper AND with Shirley!!!!! Quote
CJ Shearn Posted August 21, 2003 Report Posted August 21, 2003 Jim, while your at it, play "Mr Magic" and the George Howard tune "Shower You With Love" ::barf:: what crap, I saw that video on BET On Jazz passing thru, what the hell is that lame ass shit? Quote
Jim Alfredson Posted August 21, 2003 Report Posted August 21, 2003 Let It Go... good idea. That is a nice tune. I'm not familiar with "Shower You With Love". Perhaps this is a good thing? Quote
Soul Stream Posted August 21, 2003 Report Posted August 21, 2003 Let It Go... good idea. That is a nice tune. I'm not familiar with "Shower You With Love". Perhaps this is a good thing? I thought of "Let It Go" because I just got the used CD in the mail today!!!! I put it on and.... B) Well, I'm not really THAT hip on tunes, just lucky the mailman showed up. But I had never heard "Let It Go." I had no idea that "Sugar" was just an old Turrentine number renamed basically. Pretty cool. Quote
CJ Shearn Posted August 22, 2003 Report Posted August 22, 2003 (edited) yes Jim, it is a good thing you are not familiar with that.... actually the tune is called "Shower You With My Love" just imagine a lame bassline, a quiet storm drum loop, horrid 80's production, lame but not as bad as you know who soprano playing, a singer with blue eyes and a mullet singing cliche stuff like ::slight roar in voice:: "I LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOVE YOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOU ::insert melisma here::" Edited August 22, 2003 by CJ Shearn Quote
Jim Alfredson Posted August 22, 2003 Report Posted August 22, 2003 Well... no Sugar tonight as promised. We played my Patterson tribute instead. That's a fun tune to solo over. Interesting gig tonight... I had a lot of fun! I did have a revelation, too. I finally realized where I stole the changes for my tune "Jimmy Smith Goes To Washington". Who wants to guess? Quote
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