2006 MLB Thread

[Dan Gould]

I take back everything I said about the Red Sox making a push based on the schedule, and I take back absolutely nothing I said about the White Sox. They SUCK big time.

But thanks for bending over for the Yankees. At this rate, when the Yankees take over the division lead, the Red Sox will lead for the Wild Card and the "CHUMPS" will be on the outside looking in, where they belong.

Seriously, how can any team have a serious chance with one ancient ace and the rest are complete and utter crap? (I know, I know, you're thinking that Schilling is an ancient ace, and the rest of the staff sucks but I'll take Beckett and Wake over any other two on the White Sox staff. Hell, if Wells returns, he leapfrogs everyone the White Sox threw against the Yankees.)

[MartyJazz]

Down here in south Florida we get to see the White Sox on WGN occasionally so I got a kick out of hearing the Sox home announcers, especially Hawk Harrelson whom I've always found to be quite entertaining as well as knowledgable. He was especially peeved that the Sox could be swept by a very depleted Yankee team. Besides, Matsui and Sheffield, the Yanks were without Damon, Cano and Bernie Williams today and still the bottom third of the lineup produced. Harrelson credits the White Sox' still formidable record entirely to their hitting, stating that compared to last year when he rated their pitching at 8-1/2 to 9 on a ten point scale, this year's staff at best comes in at 5-1/2 to 6. Between the lines, he implied that Freddy Garcia is essentially through as his fast ball is down to 88-89 and he cannot get the ball consistently down. He also believes that the drop in pitching ties in with a defense that is not as reliable as the one fielded by the Sox last year. It'll be interesting to see how and if they rebound against the shocking Tigers this week.

[Dan Gould]

Marty, I can't believe you can stomach those White Sox announcers. I've never been able to listen long enough to hear any honest or insightful commentary, they are the worst "homer" announcers in all of creation. I am absolutely stunned that they could manage to say a damn thing that would constitute criticism of their team. I hate announcers who act that way, and "Hawk" and the other guy are the very worst example I have ever heard.

[MartyJazz]

Yeah, they're homers but you forget that I grew up listening to Phil Rizzuto. Any other announcer appears to be the model of objectivity compared to him. As for Hawk, he has a way of communicating his view and knowledge of baseball that I find very entertaining, e.g., after a strikeout, "grab some bench", etc. And he gives credit where it's due. I don't mind "homerism" at all as long as it's just plain rooting for your team. It's only when the accomplishments of the opposing team are dismissed or minimized that I then object.

As for providing "insightful" commentary, I thought Hawk was very objective concerning the White Sox and Freddy Garcia in particular if you reread my previous post.

Edited July 16, 2006 by MartyJazz

[Dan Gould]

As for providing "insightful" commentary, I thought Hawk was very objective concerning the White Sox and Freddy Garcia in particular if you reread my previous post.

it sounded "insightful" the first time I read it. That shocked the hell out of me as I've never heard Hawk say a single insightful thing.

[BERIGAN]

Dan,

I am glad to see that you aren't taking baseball too seriously these days.

You know as well as anyone you can't judge a team by the way they play for a series, or 2. It seems like every team is having pitching problems right now. Hell, even the Braves just beat the living piss out of the Padres very good staff(Well, except for big Al's favorite, Chan Ho Park) by scores of 15-12, 11-4 and 10-5 today for a 3 game sweep.(And cuz everyone cares, the Braves are 11 1/2 back in the east, 5 1/2 in the wildcard race)

Oh Dan, give up whatever it takes to get another former Brave Jason Schmidt(another brilliant move by our brilliant GM to trade him away) His E.R.A. is 2.78, and the league is hitting .216 against him. Add half a run or so to his E.R.A. and he would be the best number 3 pitcher in the league. I heard a rumor that the ChiSox want him as well, and if they get him, with that offense, hang it up, no one will touch them in the Playoffs.

Edited July 16, 2006 by BERIGAN

[Dan Gould]

With the Giants in the thick of it, Schmidt isn't going anywhere.

And I'm tired of trading away good young talent for a pitching rental. Given the market for pitching, it is inevitable that someone will overpay for a Schmidt or a Smoltz or whoever. I'd much rather stick with what we have and see where it takes us. There is too good talent both on the ML roster right now, and down in AA to make anymore stupid moves. I'd much rather add an effective David Wells at the deadline, and get rid of Seanez and Tavarez for a couple of mid-level prospects than give up our future for a modest upgrade now.

Or how much do you want to bet that the move they make will go down with the Larry Andersen for Jeff Bagwell or Jeff Suppan for Freddie Sanchez deals? Yup, Sanchez was traded for Suppan, a worthless sack of garbage for a young infielder who is now hitting .350+.

[jazzypaul]

Dan,

did kids sporting Minnie Minoso shirts steal your lunch money as a kid or something? Or do they do it now?

Just wondering...

[Dan Gould]

How about you tell me why your team deserves the praise its gotten? Tell me why anyone should be afraid of your starting five? And there's talk that they are dangling two of those five to try to get bullpen help?

Newflash:

The only thing that may keep the White Sox from pulling an Indians-size collapse is all of those veterans probably won't let it happen. Probably. But this is a fundamentally flawed team without a prayer of catching the Tigers.

[Soulstation1]

dan please don't bring my boys into this...

i think the tribe is 20 games out of first

[Soulstation1]

i'm going on record

the NY Mets will win it all, if they can stay healthy.....

[jazzypaul]

How about you tell me why your team deserves the praise its gotten? Tell me why anyone should be afraid of your starting five? And there's talk that they are dangling two of those five to try to get bullpen help?

Newflash:

The only thing that may keep the White Sox from pulling an Indians-size collapse is all of those veterans probably won't let it happen. Probably. But this is a fundamentally flawed team without a prayer of catching the Tigers.

Ummm, no shit, sherlock. I'm thinking more than likely, we're the wild card. Are we the LUCKIEST team alive this season? absolutely. Trust me, I'll be the first to tell you that this isn't going to be the magic season of last year. But, considering that luck factor, you never can tell.

Considering how much rage you've got dripping through your posts regarding my beloved White Sox, however, Dan, one has to get back to my original question. Maybe Ron Kittle gave you a wedgie. Or maybe you're just mad that Pudge likes us more than you guys these days.

[Brad]

Hmm. They didn't look too good but it's only 3 games. I think Dan is mad because the Yanks are starting to put a little heat on his BoSox. I don't think he hates the pale hose per se.

As far as the Mets going all the way, I think that's a little early for that. They have some pitching problems themselves. Pedro is hurt, Glavine hasn't looked too good lately and the rest of the starting rotation is suspect. With the lead they'll have, they'll try to fix those problems. However, they don't want to let the Braves get too close.

[wolff]

Mariners vs The 2nd best team in NY.

The M's need this series after the tough one in Toronto.

The M's are a funny team. 1st and 3rd with their 20+ mil paychecks

are killing them, while short and 2nd with their minimums are what

baseball is all about.

[Dave James]

Any Yankee fan has to be pleased with what the team has been able to accomplish in their injury-riddled condition. You have to wonder how well the White Sox would be holding up without Konerko and Dye or the Red Sox without Manny and Papi. Think about the boost you get when both Matsui and Sheffield return. It's like trading for two all-stars without having to give up a thing. You gotta like that. Still, it's all about the pitching. For sure, Fat Sidney P. isn't the answer...but if the Yanks could land someone like a Jon Lieber or a Livan Hernandez before the deadline, I'd feel a whole lot better about their chances. I just hope they focus on arms and not bats. The offense is fine.

Up over and out.

[Dan Gould]

Livan has been atrocious pitching in a big park in a weak league. Lieber has declined too. Neither should be expected to excel in the AL. And they'd cost a lot, too. I am afraid that there will be no help for AL teams as far as pitching goes, unless Zito gets traded, and I doubt that the A's will trade him to a team they may face in the AL playoffs. The only pitcher in the NL who might be available and might actually succeed in the AL is John Smoltz, and I'm not convinced he'll be traded.

The better move, Dave, may be to go for Abreu or Soriano and hope that the offense can overcome whatever eggs the back of the rotation lays.

[MartyJazz]

Any Yankee fan has to be pleased with what the team has been able to accomplish in their injury-riddled condition. You have to wonder how well the White Sox would be holding up without Konerko and Dye or the Red Sox without Manny and Papi. Think about the boost you get when both Matsui and Sheffield return. It's like trading for two all-stars without having to give up a thing. You gotta like that. Still, it's all about the pitching. For sure, Fat Sidney P. isn't the answer...but if the Yanks could land someone like a Jon Lieber or a Livan Hernandez before the deadline, I'd feel a whole lot better about their chances. I just hope they focus on arms and not bats. The offense is fine.

Up over and out.

Can anyone explain to me why they let Lieber go in the first place? True, he had a so-so year during the year he was with them, but I seem to remember that when the games got very important towards the end of the season and into the playoffs, he pitched consistently well.

[Dan Gould]

Any Yankee fan has to be pleased with what the team has been able to accomplish in their injury-riddled condition. You have to wonder how well the White Sox would be holding up without Konerko and Dye or the Red Sox without Manny and Papi. Think about the boost you get when both Matsui and Sheffield return. It's like trading for two all-stars without having to give up a thing. You gotta like that. Still, it's all about the pitching. For sure, Fat Sidney P. isn't the answer...but if the Yanks could land someone like a Jon Lieber or a Livan Hernandez before the deadline, I'd feel a whole lot better about their chances. I just hope they focus on arms and not bats. The offense is fine.

Up over and out.

Can anyone explain to me why they let Lieber go in the first place? True, he had a so-so year during the year he was with them, but I seem to remember that when the games got very important towards the end of the season and into the playoffs, he pitched consistently well.

I guess you don't remember, Marty. The Yankees actually held an option on Lieber for 2005, but they felt it was for too much money so they declined it, planning to sign him for less. Cashman totally misread the market for pitching and the final result was that the Phils jumped in with a three year offer that Lieber accepted. Bottom line, Lieber skipping off to Philadelphia made Carl Pavano that much more important to the Yankees (although perhaps they would have gone as hard for him regardless) so the argument can be made that in effect the Yankees swapped Lieber for the MIA Carl Pavano. And paid much more money for him, too.

The lesson here is that if you have an option on a halfway decent pitcher, you need to think long and hard before declining it, because there are plenty of teams out there that will bid up the price for a starting pitcher and its not worth the risk.

[Dave James]

Dan,

The reason I pitched (so to speak) guys like Lieber or Hernandez is I think they're affordable. I know neither one might be what the doctor ordered, but you've got to think being thrown into the middle of a hotly contested pennant race might give them a little more performance incentive. On the non-arm side, the Nat's won't even take Cashman's calls unless Phillip Hughes is on the table, and Abreu apparently wants an extension through 2011 in order to waive his no trade clause. There's some talk about Shawn Green as well. Or Jose Guillen. Based on what the Yanks are clearly capable of doing offensively, though, I just think they have to focus on pitching. That's a place where you can never be too deep. Hey, here's a thought. What if Fat Sid turns out to be this year's Aaron Small? Guess we'll get our first look at the chances of lightning striking twice when he goes against the M's tomorrow night.

Up over and out.

[Dan Gould]

Hey, here's a thought. What if Fat Sid turns out to be this year's Aaron Small? Guess we'll get our first look at the chances of lightning striking twice when he goes against the M's tomorrow night.

Well, if it happens you can say the odds weren't nearly as long as they were with Small, the career minor leaguer. The fact is that Fat Sid was 17-12 with a 3.75 ERA in 2003. Unfortunately he's 22-30 and since then, with an ERA around 5.75.

Too bad the original Fat Sid already tried, and failed, in his comeback with the Yanks:

[Dave James]

Dan,

Ouch! Hey, if one Sid won't work, how about another? What if Sidd Finch was available? I haven't heard much about him since...geez...it's gotta be at least 20 years.

Up over and out.

[catesta]

I'm going to see the Yanks and Mariners play on Wednesday.

First game I've been to all year, go figure.

[Brad]

I'd stay away from all those guys Dave mentions, except for Abreu. To trade Hughes for anybody except Dontrelle (don't hold your breath) would not be smart and that includes Zito. He's about as good as he's going to get before going downhill. Unless you're sure that someone you can acquire is going to win the AL for you this year, don't bother. They're getting Sheffield and Mitsui back sometime this year and those guys should be relatively fresh, having had a few months off. If I were Cashman, I'd save the money.

[BERIGAN]

I'd stay away from all those guys Dave mentions, except for Abreu. To trade Hughes for anybody except Dontrelle (don't hold your breath) would not be smart and that includes Zito. He's about as good as he's going to get before going downhill. Unless you're sure that someone you can acquire is going to win the AL for you this year, don't bother. They're getting Sheffield and Mitsui back sometime this year and those guys should be relatively fresh, having had a few months off. If I were Cashman, I'd save the money.

The one problem with waiting for Sheffield and Matsui, is that they are not exactly young guys, and wrist injuries are a bitch and a half to get over. Usually it takes a long time to get your power back. Plus as someone mentioned on espn(I think) the Yankees won't resign Sheffield next year, so to take on Abreu's contract won't be a real problem for them, and they may not have to give up as much to save the Phillies all that money....

[Dan Gould]

And as I've mentioned, Sheffield and Matsui may return after the minor league seasons are over, leaving them with no place to go for rehab. Will they be nearly as effective, trying to get their timing back against major leaguers in the middle of a pennant race?