Unissued/Unreleased Grant Green

[monkboughtlunch]

Could this have been taped in colour perhaps? The well known Uk clip from this tour is in colour? Can't believe this is languishing 'hidden' in the hand of 'collectors'.

France used the 625 line SECAM system (higher resolution than the US NTSC 525 line standard) and introduced color broadcasts in 1967. So, yes it's possible the Green performance was taped in color; however, there is no evidence of this yet.

Edited July 27, 2014 by monkboughtlunch

[danasgoodstuff]

What's the best source for the Blue John +5 reissue, the Bastards?

[jazzbo]

I recommend cdjapan.

[Jim R]

I recall reading somewhere that around 1969 Green was getting himself back together (apparently after kicking H) and that Burrell was helping Green out and took him on this Paris tour. It would great to hear and see Green's full Parisian TV performance.

Based on the brief "tease", plus the "Blue Mist" performance from around that same time, I would actually look forward to seeing it more for Burrell and Kessel than for Green.

[JohnS]

I recommend cdjapan.

Me too, Blue John is in the region of £13-£14 from cdjapan including airmail shipping to the UK.

[robertoart]

I recall reading somewhere that around 1969 Green was getting himself back together (apparently after kicking H) and that Burrell was helping Green out and took him on this Paris tour. It would great to hear and see Green's full Parisian TV performance.

Based on the brief "tease", plus the "Blue Mist" performance from around that same time, I would actually look forward to seeing it more for Burrell and Kessel than for Green.

Hopefully we will all get to see it one day, and we can all have an informed opinion. My opinion of Kessel, in this kind of company, is you would probably get to hear how his playing is more connected to the swing and hillbilly times, Dandy fashion sense notwithstanding. I suspect when his chord melody schtick is taken out of the equation, he would reveal himself to suffer from the kinds of limitations that are pejoratively thrown Greens way - ad infinitum. Certainly Burrell shines in the London performance, his lines and tones are very edgy for the context. But Burrell could get very third streamy and aspirational in his own greasy way...if you think that might float your boat.

Edited July 28, 2014 by freelancer

[The Magnificent Goldberg]

I recommend cdjapan.

Me too, Blue John is in the region of £13-£14 from cdjapan including airmail shipping to the UK.

Mine's coming from an Amazon UK seller (in Switzerland) for a tenner.

MG

[Head Man]

I recommend cdjapan.

Me too, Blue John is in the region of £13-£14 from cdjapan including airmail shipping to the UK.

Mine's coming from an Amazon UK seller (in Switzerland) for a tenner.

MG

Not any more, it's gone up to £14 plus shipping..... so it's probably cheaper from CDJapan now.

[The Magnificent Goldberg]

I recommend cdjapan.

Me too, Blue John is in the region of £13-£14 from cdjapan including airmail shipping to the UK.

Mine's coming from an Amazon UK seller (in Switzerland) for a tenner.

MG

Not any more, it's gone up to £14 plus shipping..... so it's probably cheaper from CDJapan now.

Bloomin' 'eck, Tucker!

MG

[Jim R]

I recall reading somewhere that around 1969 Green was getting himself back together (apparently after kicking H) and that Burrell was helping Green out and took him on this Paris tour. It would great to hear and see Green's full Parisian TV performance.

Based on the brief "tease", plus the "Blue Mist" performance from around that same time, I would actually look forward to seeing it more for Burrell and Kessel than for Green.

Hopefully we will all get to see it one day, and we can all have an informed opinion. My opinion of Kessel, in this kind of company, is you would probably get to hear how his playing is more connected to the swing and hillbilly times, Dandy fashion sense notwithstanding. I suspect when his chord melody schtick is taken out of the equation, he would reveal himself to suffer from the kinds of limitations that are pejoratively thrown Greens way - ad infinitum. Certainly Burrell shines in the London performance, his lines and tones are very edgy for the context. But Burrell could get very third streamy and aspirational in his own greasy way...if you think that might float your boat.

First of all, I love Grant Green. My comment had more to do with how much I also love Kessel and Burrell, and the state of Grant's playing and his style at that particular time. I don't agree with all of your comments, but that's a common scenario on discussion boards. I do know where you're coming from with regard to BK, and I probably share some of those sentiments, but I think you're going overboard with the disrespect. No need for that in the interest of propping up Green, imo. The man's chord and chord/melody playing was highly advanced and seminal, in addition to being distinctive and wonderful. That last comment about Burrell possibly floating my boat almost makes me wonder if you think I'm new to this stuff...? (same thing with what I would "get to hear" from Kessel...?). Whatever. I know what I like, and I know pretty well what to expect should the video surface.

[monkboughtlunch]

On 6/7/2006 at 1:17 PM, robertoart said:

 

Hi I am new to the board, just wanting to see if someone might be able to provide some info...In the liner notes to Live at the Lighthouse, Bob Belden mentions a session with Houston Person that does not appear in any Grant discographies...if this session is all that BB says it is then it must be a very special and important recording.. especially in light of when it was made...does anyone have any knowledge of this

Did anyone figure out if Belden was referring to an unissued Person date or if he was referring to "The Real Thing" LP?

I recently tracked down a mint copy of the Houston Person "The Real Thing" LP from 1973 (live material).  It's revelatory hearing Grant play some straight ahead type material in the 1970s instead of just the boogaloo material found on his own LPs from this era.   in the early 1990s, a compilation CD included an outtake from the live date -- Lester Leaps In.

It makes one wonder how much unreleased stuff form this live date exists.  It would be nice if the ownership of the Eastbound label would remix the source tapes and release the sets with Grant in full, unedited.

http://www.jazzdisco.org/grant-green/catalog/

Houston Person - The Real Thing  (Eastbound 2EB 9010)

Marcus Belgrave (trumpet -2,5,6) Houston Person (tenor sax) Jimmy Watson (organ -1) Sonny Phillips (organ -2,4/6) Jack McDuff (organ -3) Grant Green (lead guitar) Robert Lowe (rhythm guitar -2,5,6) James Jamieson (bass -2,5,6) Hank Brown (drums -1) Idris Muhammad (drums -2/6) Buddy Caldwell (congas, tambourine -2,5)

"Watt's Club", Detroit, MI, March 14 or 15, 1973

1.	Since I Fell For You
2.	Pain
3.	Angel Eyes
4.	Easy Walker
5.	Could It Be I'm Falling In Love
6.	Crazy Legs

 

Various Artists - Together - The Eastbound Jazz Years  (Beat Goes Public CD BGPD 071)

Houston Person (tenor sax) Jack McDuff (organ) Grant Green (lead guitar) Idris Muhammad (drums)

"Watt's Club", Detroit, MI, March 14 or 15, 1973

Lester Leaps In

 

By the way, here's a photo of Grant in my liner notes to Person's "The Real Thing."  Haven't seen this photo before, so thought others may not have seen it either.  I guess from the photo he's playing his D'Aquisto New Yorker on this live album.

Edited March 13, 2017 by monkboughtlunch

[monkboughtlunch]

Niko posted a link to these unreleased YouTube Grant Green alternate takes on another thread.  These were uploaded on YouTube by Joe Louis.  Check out the alternate takes from the Matador album:

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCJcWXaSyAKQKT5k9IoB_nhQ/search?query=grant+green

Edited March 13, 2017 by monkboughtlunch

[robertoart]

On 13/03/2017 at 0:48 PM, monkboughtlunch said:

Did anyone figure out if Belden was referring to an unissued Person date or if he was referring to "The Real Thing" LP?

I recently tracked down a mint copy of the Houston Person "The Real Thing" LP from 1973 (live material).  It's revelatory hearing Grant play some straight ahead type material in the 1970s instead of just the boogaloo material found on his own LPs from this era.   in the early 1990s, a compilation CD included an outtake from the live date -- Lester Leaps In.

It makes one wonder how much unreleased stuff form this live date exists.  It would be nice if the ownership of the Eastbound label would remix the source tapes and release the sets with Grant in full, unedited.

http://www.jazzdisco.org/grant-green/catalog/

Houston Person - The Real Thing  (Eastbound 2EB 9010)

Marcus Belgrave (trumpet -2,5,6) Houston Person (tenor sax) Jimmy Watson (organ -1) Sonny Phillips (organ -2,4/6) Jack McDuff (organ -3) Grant Green (lead guitar) Robert Lowe (rhythm guitar -2,5,6) James Jamieson (bass -2,5,6) Hank Brown (drums -1) Idris Muhammad (drums -2/6) Buddy Caldwell (congas, tambourine -2,5)

"Watt's Club", Detroit, MI, March 14 or 15, 1973

1.	Since I Fell For You
2.	Pain
3.	Angel Eyes
4.	Easy Walker
5.	Could It Be I'm Falling In Love
6.	Crazy Legs

 

Various Artists - Together - The Eastbound Jazz Years  (Beat Goes Public CD BGPD 071)

Houston Person (tenor sax) Jack McDuff (organ) Grant Green (lead guitar) Idris Muhammad (drums)

"Watt's Club", Detroit, MI, March 14 or 15, 1973

Lester Leaps In

 

By the way, here's a photo of Grant in my liner notes to Person's "The Real Thing."  Haven't seen this photo before, so thought others may not have seen it either.  I guess from the photo he's playing his D'Aquisto New Yorker on this live album.

Maybe Beldon misremembered Angel Eyes or Since I Fell For You as Dearly Beloved when he was doing the Lighthouse liners. That could be the explanation. It's seems like a long shot that he ever actually heard the complete Real Thing live sessions tapes if they still survive, but you never know. The other possibility, that there was an unreleased straight ahead Houston Person session seems to good to be true. 

[robertoart]

Hey, Bob Porter produced The Real Thing!!! Paging Mr Porter  

[hgweber]

any news on the 1974 (?) GG colour vid that GG jr was planning to release after the paris video? 

also, has anyone ever attempted to create a list which unissued items from grant have actually surfaced over the years? has anyone here ever heard the charlie rouse or gene harris session? 

 

[monkboughtlunch]

Given the extensive live performances Green gave in the 70s, I'm surprised no soundboards from club venues have surfaced.  In the new Bob Porter book, he mentions seeing Green perform a stunning version of John Coltrane's "Impressions" at a live venue in the 1970s.  

22 hours ago, robertoart said:

Maybe Beldon misremembered Angel Eyes or Since I Fell For You as Dearly Beloved when he was doing the Lighthouse liners. That could be the explanation. It's seems like a long shot that he ever actually heard the complete Real Thing live sessions tapes if they still survive, but you never know. The other possibility, that there was an unreleased straight ahead Houston Person session seems to good to be true. 

The 15 minute previously unreleased outtake "Lester Leaps In" was published for the first time on a compilation compact disc in the early 1990s.  This suggests tapes of unreleased material from these live 1973 Person shows survived.  Who owns the Eastbound jazz label these days?

3 hours ago, hgweber said:

any news on the 1974 (?) GG colour vid that GG jr was planning to release after the paris video? 

 

There's a documentary being released I guess this year.  Maybe they will include it in that.  From the trailer, it looks like a bunch of talking head interviews from the late 90s conducted for the Sharony Andrews Green book.

 

Edited March 15, 2017 by monkboughtlunch

[monkboughtlunch]

Another question I have is about the 1969 London "Blue Mist" color video performance of Green, Burrell and Kessel.   Only "Blue Mist" is on YouTube.  How much exists from this entire show, and is there more videotape performance of Green from this date?  If so, anyone have a full setlist?

Edited March 15, 2017 by monkboughtlunch

[hgweber]

8 hours ago, monkboughtlunch said:

Given the extensive live performances Green gave in the 70s, I'm surprised no soundboards from club venues have surfaced.  In the new Bob Porter book, he mentions seeing Green perform a stunning version of John Coltrane's "Impressions" at a live venue in the 1970s.  

The 15 minute previously unreleased outtake "Lester Leaps In" was published for the first time on a compilation compact disc in the early 1990s.  This suggests tapes of unreleased material from these live 1973 Person shows survived.  Who owns the Eastbound jazz label these days?

There's a documentary being released I guess this year.  Maybe they will include it in that.  From the trailer, it looks like a bunch of talking head interviews from the late 90s conducted for the Sharony Andrews Green book.

 

i don't think the movie will contain any new footage. it will probably be not more than a documentary about writing the book (which wasn't very good tbh).

iirc GG jr had some sort of kickstarter campaign for the color funk video.

[monkboughtlunch]

10 hours ago, hgweber said:

i don't think the movie will contain any new footage. it will probably be not more than a documentary about writing the book (which wasn't very good tbh).

iirc GG jr had some sort of kickstarter campaign for the color funk video.

Yeah, the Sharony book was half-baked.

I think "GG jr" is really Greg Green and he goes by the stage name "Grant Green Jr" which must be odd as Grant Sr. has another son whose real name is Grant Green Jr.  I think Sharony was married to the real Grant Green Jr (not the older brother Greg who uses the Grant Green Jr. stage name).  Confusing.

Anyway, Greg Green's Facebook page (which is Grant Green Jr) had an update on the 1970s funk video back in 2015.  

For a couple of years, he's been charging money for a low resolution dub of the 1969 Paris video that he presumably doesn't own the rights to.  He sort of implies the money he is collecting is going to help him get this other 70s video.  That's cool if it happens.  But it's been two years.   Presumably, he isn't sharing the money he gets from the 69 clip with the other musicians in the 1969 clip or their families.  Unclear if he is sharing the money from the 69 video with his other brother (the real Grant Green Jr.)

The 1969 Paris video is great.  It would be awesome to see a professionally published higher resolution transfer from the source videotapes instead of Greg's Payloadz dub.  It would be cool if Cuscuna's Jazz Icons series or Resonance would publish a legit release of the 69 video.

Grant Green Jr

May 8, 2015 · 

 

I'm getting close to funding the new Grant Green funk video, This will be the final video, it was shot in 70's and in color with afros and bellbottoms, This has been one of my goals to get footage of him because was none and these two are the only that exist, as a youngster this is how I remember him playing, and going home to try to mimic him, These videos are rare there was no footage of him until these finds, So I'm asking my facebook friends to post this on your facebook page, I'm going to drop the price to the Grant Green Live in Paris to 5.99 to get this done and those who purchased the video leave a message at payloadz.com keyword Grant Green and I will send you the free audio the direct link is http://store.payloadz.com/go?id=2119321 here is another clip

 

Edited March 15, 2017 by monkboughtlunch

[hgweber]

49 minutes ago, monkboughtlunch said:

Yeah, the Sharony book was half-baked.

I think "GG jr" is really Greg Green and he goes by the stage name "Grant Green Jr" which must be odd as Grant Sr. has another son whose real name is Grant Green Jr.  I think Sharony was married to the real Grant Green Jr (not the older brother Greg who uses the Grant Green Jr. stage name).  Confusing.

Anyway, Greg Green's Facebook page (which is Grant Green Jr) had an update on the 1970s funk video back in 2015.  

For a couple of years, he's been charging money for a low resolution dub of the 1969 Paris video that he presumably doesn't own the rights to.  He sort of implies the money he is collecting is going to help him get this other 70s video.  That's cool if it happens.  But it's been two years.   Presumably, he isn't sharing the money he gets from the 69 clip with the other musicians in the 1969 clip or their families.  Unclear if he is sharing the money from the 69 video with his other brother (the real Grant Green Jr.)

The 1969 Paris video is great.  It would be awesome to see a professionally published higher resolution transfer from the source videotapes instead of Greg's Payloadz dub.  It would be cool if Cuscuna's Jazz Icons series or Resonance would publish a legit release of the 69 video.

Grant Green Jr

May 8, 2015 · 

 

I'm getting close to funding the new Grant Green funk video, This will be the final video, it was shot in 70's and in color with afros and bellbottoms, This has been one of my goals to get footage of him because was none and these two are the only that exist, as a youngster this is how I remember him playing, and going home to try to mimic him, These videos are rare there was no footage of him until these finds, So I'm asking my facebook friends to post this on your facebook page, I'm going to drop the price to the Grant Green Live in Paris to 5.99 to get this done and those who purchased the video leave a message at payloadz.com keyword Grant Green and I will send you the free audio the direct link is http://store.payloadz.com/go?id=2119321 here is another clip

 

i'd be surprised if the paris video sold more than a few hundred copies (probably less). a youtube channel with unreleased GG has been mentioned upstream. mindblowing stuff for GG fans, the average view count is well below one-hundred for the gooden's corner session reel tunes. so i don't think GG jr is robbing anyone. still an official release would be nice, especially since the part with burrell and kessel does still exist afaik. 

any idea how to get hold of the "lester leaps in" eastbound track?

[Ken Dryden]

It was clear than Sharony Andrews Green was not very knowledgeable about jazz, as there were numerous mistakes within the text. It didn't help that a young, overly enthusiastic Grant Green fan included almost gushing commentary with every discographical listing. Some of the stuff Green recorded in his later years was pretty forgettable.

[monkboughtlunch]

Some more detail on the 70s funk TV footage.  Someone posted this on the Hoffman forum a couple of years ago:

"There's footage of Grant Green from 1976 when he was on the Gino Washington Show in Detroit on Channel 62. He was the special guest on that weekly show for about a month. GG Jr. is talking about releasing a video of a funk type concert of Grant's...hopefully that's the footage that he's talking about."

1 hour ago, hgweber said:

any idea how to get hold of the "lester leaps in" eastbound track?

The outtake is on a compilation CD produced in the early 1990s:    Together - The Eastbound Jazz Years  (Beat Goes Public CD BGPD 071)

[monkboughtlunch]

Here's a 1977 clip from the Gino Washington show to show the likely quality of the tape.  I guess Gino is sitting on a bunch of these old videotapes.  Green reportedly appeared on multiple episodes of the show in 1976.  I  would be cool if there is an interview with Grant on  those tapes in addition to music.

 

 

Edited March 15, 2017 by monkboughtlunch

[hgweber]

14 hours ago, monkboughtlunch said:

Some more detail on the 70s funk TV footage.  Someone posted this on the Hoffman forum a couple of years ago:

"There's footage of Grant Green from 1976 when he was on the Gino Washington Show in Detroit on Channel 62. He was the special guest on that weekly show for about a month. GG Jr. is talking about releasing a video of a funk type concert of Grant's...hopefully that's the footage that he's talking about."

The outtake is on a compilation CD produced in the early 1990s:    Together - The Eastbound Jazz Years  (Beat Goes Public CD BGPD 071)

thanks. i'll try and track it down.

[monkboughtlunch]

On 5/9/2006 at 5:27 AM, The Magnificent Goldberg said:

There's one more; his first recording.

 

Tommy Dean

Tommy Dean (org); Fred Lee (ts); Grant Green (eg); Hattuch Alexander (b);

Milton Wilson (d, bgo); Joe Buckner (voc).

Universal Recording, Chicago, October 23, 1956

 

56-562 Boogie Googie (part 1) Vee-Jay unissued

56-563 Boogie Googie (part 2)

56-564 Ain't No Justice

56-565 She Left Me Alone

56-566 Come On

 

That would be REALLY interesting to hear. I have a couple of 78s by Dean and his band swung like crazy!

 

MG

Would these unissued tapes have been torched in the 2008 Universal fire?  Or did Concord acquire Vee Jay records?