Bob James

[Jazz Kat]

Please do it then. Jazz-Funk. Instrumental, no vocals.

OK, so "jazz-funk" and not necessarily "soul-funk":

There's a ton to recommend, but, for what I think may be your style:

how about starting here with this series

and sample the individual cuts on Amazon

and then just go from there out:

Blue Break Beats

Some cuts will have some vocals,

but they're just dressing.

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Thanks for that link! I'll surely look into it later. I'm going to bed.

[marcello]

back to Bob.  I always liked his "Rocksteady" arrangement  on "CTI Summer Jazz at the Hollywood Bowl" and his playing on Stanley Turrentine's "Cherry" is unobtrusive.

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Sorry, I just got the shivers.

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Is that related to the Heebie Jeebies?

[Brad]

In the mid 70s before I became interested in jazz, I was interested and had a few of his albums including Touchdown. Also had the George Benson, Earl Klugh, etc. kind of material. I don't think it's the kind of thing I'd want to listen to today but it was fun. At the time I thought it was jazz but I know better now.

[Man with the Golden Arm]

His early work with Grover Washington, Jr. is in the same vein, though the smoothish sax can bug at times.  Feels So Good, Mister Magic, Inner City Blues, etc.

I think that period of Grover is essential to hear the concepts of his post Prestige phase, esp FSG & MM. Certainly not as smooth as he would get, and maybe not smooth at all to me, - great grooves abound inside those Kudus.

[CJ Shearn]

aww I must have given Chuck a fever Seriously tho, "CTI Summer Jazz At the Hollywood Bowl" is one of my favorite albums, I grew up on it.

Edited September 29, 2005 by CJ Shearn

[clifford_thornton]

For me, Bob is good for one track an album.  On One, it's "Nautilus."  On Three, it's "One Mint Julep."  BJ4, "Tappan Zee."  Like JSngry, on Lucky Seven I like "Look-Alike." 

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...and "Wolfman" from Explosions.

[Jazz Kat]

In the mid 70s before I became interested in jazz, I was interested and had a few of his albums including Touchdown.  Also had the George Benson, Earl Klugh, etc. kind of material.  I don't think it's the kind of thing I'd want to listen to today but it was fun.  At the time I thought it was jazz but I know better now.

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What it jazz really though.

but more seriously,

I don't think of music as types of styles anymore. Yeah, the majority of stuff I listen to, people are calling jazz, but I wish we'd all just listen to music, and whatever we like...we like..

[Guest akanalog]

yo jk-

this bob james stuff you are diggin doesnt really hold up to repeated listenings. as noj rightly points out, there is like one classic banger per album. overall the albums are ok, but unless you are producing beats and looking for samples i think you will find, as i think everyone in this thread has, that this music is amusing and groovy-but it will get old quick because there is not much depth there. and there isn't supposed to be-this was commercial music. i see you are in new york-do you listen to the smooth jazz station? i mean i do sometimes. and i have a lot of these bob james albums on LP. i am not knocking them-but this was popular commercial music and as such isn't asking you for deep exploration. i mean i listen to some jean-luc ponty too and i was supporting that lenny white album last week that people dipped me for, but i mean it's music when you don't want to think. i bet this bob james will eventually lead you wanting something a bit more challenging. it is a good gateway to other things, though. and it is good for driving around in your friend's used cadillac smoking cigarettes going to a party.

hmmm-this is off topic sort of, but perhaps an album to check out is carla bley's "dinner music" which combines some people from her posse with some bob james posse people (actually i guess people from the band stuff). the stuff sort of vibe wins out mostly but it is interesting to hear.

[DukeCity]

yo jk-

this bob james stuff you are diggin doesnt really hold up to repeated listenings....  i bet this bob james will eventually lead you wanting something a bit more challenging.

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I completely agree, akanalog! I had some bob james sides in the '70s and they were enjoyable for what they are. I have saxophone students come to me and when I ask them who they're into I hear that they like (shudder) Kenny G. After I stifle my gag reflex, I encourage them to find out who his influences are. So they might learn about someone like Grover Washington, Jr. and then check out his influences to get to Stanley Turrentine, then back to Dexter. From there you can move forward to early Trane, etc. Like six degrees of separation, you can take almost any entry point or gateway, and get to some pretty happening and deep music in just a few steps.

In the meantime, JK, just enjoy whatever you're digging at the moment, and be open to checking out whatever comes. That's my 2 cents...

[Jim Alfredson]

Sounds to me like JK is a lot more open to things than a lot of people in this thread.

[rostasi]

Sounds to me like JK is a lot more open to things than a lot of people in this thread.

I think so too, but I also think that we're dutified

to tell him a bit of the history of these things.

Also, I think something like Sookie Sookie from Grant Green's Alive!

has a much heavier staying power when it comes to jazz-funk

than something from BJ.

[Michael Fitzgerald]

More open? I would say instead "less discriminating" - listeners who have decades of background have "been around the block" and have wisdom to see what is substantial and what isn't. Someone who is new to - food, let's say - thinks everything is wonderful. It's only after years of development that one can discern the subtle differences and discriminate between what is mediocre, good, excellent, and superb. Of course, some people never get there and they still eat at the Olive Garden and they still like it and think it's fine Italian.

Mike

[marcello]

More open? I would say instead "less discriminating" - listeners who have decades of background have "been around the block" and have wisdom to see what is substantial and what isn't. Someone who is new to - food, let's say -  thinks everything is wonderful. It's only after years of development that one can discern the subtle differences and discriminate between what is mediocre, good, excellent, and superb. Of course, some people never get there and they still eat at the Olive Garden and they still like it and think it's fine Italian.

Mike

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..... or: "A man has got to have his standards!"

[rostasi]

half-full, half-empty really.

[king ubu]

half-full, half-empty really.

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my can of beer is three quarters empty again, already...

[Free For All]

Someone who is new to - food, let's say -  thinks everything is wonderful.

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When I was a kid there were many foods I hated that I now love, and there were many foods that were kid-related that I now can't stand. My parents telling me "it's good for you" or "it's bad for you" didn't make a bit of difference; I had to figure it out on my own. You know, touch the hot stove after you were warned not to.

Listening to music was/is a similar journey. Many artists I didn't "get" when I was young I now love (like Monk and Mingus). Many of the things I listened to then I eventually grew away from. Once again, being told what I should and shouldn't like made no difference to me.

I did frequently seek advice from my peers, and this advice widened my musical horizons.

So I guess my point is that our young friends should be allowed their youthful indulgences without having to endure too much browbeating. We need to cultivate a new generation of jazz fans, and we don't need to be chasing them off with elitist attitudes. That being said, if JK or anyone else asks the membership what they think of a specific artist or recording, they should be prepared to hear honest opinions be they good or bad. And we owe them no less than an honest opinion.

Edited September 29, 2005 by Free For All

[rostasi]

half-full, half-empty really.

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my can of beer is three quarters empty again, already...

Dontcha mean one quarter full?

When you're young, you should be open.

When you start discriminating, you'll realize that you're no longer young.

[Michael Fitzgerald]

What I object to is the idea that if one person likes one of three things and someone else likes all three - the second person is called "open-minded" as if that's some kind of praise. And the first person is called "closed-minded" when it could be that the first person has the wisdom to discern between the three, rather than thinking all three are great. I'm not saying that's *necessarily* true, but when you consider the background and experience of the people, that should tell you something.

Just because one likes MORE stuff doesn't mean anything. What are the standards of evaluation? How are the judgments being made?

Mike

[king ubu]

Now my glass is emptily full.

I guess it's also a question of time. I mean, I'm still young, but at the same time I have enough things I want to do to realize that there are many other (possibly great) things that I will most likely never come around doing. Like, I could probably read twenty times as many books that I'd love to read than fit into one lifetime... same applies to music. There's a few thousand discs around, and I am constantly having huge piles of stuff I'd love to listen right now and right here... so why spend my time listening to stuff I don't really get much from? That, indeed has nothing to do with being open-minded or not.

[Jazz Kat]

yo jk-

this bob james stuff you are diggin doesnt really hold up to repeated listenings.  as noj rightly points out, there is like one classic banger per album.  overall the albums are ok, but unless you are producing beats and looking for samples i think you will find, as i think everyone in this thread has, that this music is amusing and groovy-but it will get old quick because there is not much depth there.  and there isn't supposed to be-this was commercial music.  i see you are in new york-do you listen to the smooth jazz station?  i mean i do sometimes.  and i have a lot of these bob james albums on LP.  i am not knocking them-but this was popular commercial music and as such isn't asking you for deep exploration.  i mean i listen to some jean-luc ponty too and i was supporting that lenny white album last week that people dipped me for, but i mean it's music when you don't want to think.  i bet this bob james will eventually lead you wanting something a bit more challenging.  it is a good gateway to other things, though.  and it is good for driving around in your friend's used cadillac smoking cigarettes going to a party.

hmmm-this is off topic sort of, but perhaps an album to check out is carla bley's "dinner music" which combines some people from her posse with some bob james posse people (actually i guess people from the band stuff).  the stuff sort of vibe wins out mostly but it is interesting to hear.

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Yeah I am kind of getting tired of Two already. Another album that I absolutely loved when I first bought it, but now is getting boring is George Benson's Breezin'.

But then ther are the albums that are kind of in the same catogory, but I never tire of. I really don't know how people are going to respond to this thing, but Chuck Mangione's Alive is probaly one of my favorite albums. I first got that album when I was eight. I really didn't like it for the same reasons I like it now. It's very fusion influenced. A bit more "dirty," "raunchy," and and funky than most his later albums. I think every musician on that album was at the top of their game.

Somebody just told me they relate Chuck Mangione with Kenny G. That is fucking ridiculous! Yet on the other hand he tells me Spyro Gyra are good musicians and can read.

Chuck Mangione was a great writer. Some of his songs are abosultely beautiful, and I will defend to my grave that he is not a smooth jazz musician. Back to that album, Alive. 1972 with Gerry Niewood, Tony Levin, and Steve Gadd. A kick ass version of St. Thomas, High Heel Sneekers, Chuck's awesome 12 minute suite 60 Miles Young, and his other tune Legend of The One Eyed Sailor. I don't get why he lost his rep after he went from playing with Art Blakey, to playing a more fusion influenced type of music. I guess Chuck is just special to me. I played on stage with him when I was 8, and he was one of my first musicians I actually loved and called my favorite before I got into bop and such.

[rostasi]

...That, indeed has nothing to do with being open-minded or not.

Exactly! I don't know if anybody is saying that being open

is the same as liking more stuff -

at least that's not what I was saying or insinuating.

They are two different concepts.

One can (and should, I believe) be open to ideas, concepts and eventualities

and I hope that we don't all bow down to some "standard of evaluation."

Judgements are made using a complicated web of personal experience.

Being aware of that when presented with conflicting ideas is the springboard to

expanding knowledge.

[rostasi]

JK:

That Alive album from Mangione and, especially, Together

were two albums that I really liked growing up

(tho he took some strange detours on Together).

Both have great versions of Sixty Miles Young.

I think that for the mid-70's A&M stuff, he, for whatever reason,

became more sugar-coated.

I've wondered about this general 70's transition into sentimentalism...

I guess the money was coming in for some of these guys

and you had Klemmer making "sexy" songs

and Mangione making mushy sap and James making fop-funk

and Corea wanting to "communicate" with his pixie crap and so on...

Guys that really could of continued building on their inventiveness

just seemed to drop the ball or maybe

they just began putting little acorns and spray-paint on them a la Martha Stewart.

[Jazz Kat]

I still love all Mangione's music. The Feels So Good album is actually quite good, for me. Journey To A Raimbow has got some nice tunes on it. It's his late 80's stuff that I loathe.

[Aggie87]

I still love all Mangione's music.

...

It's his late 80's stuff that I loathe.

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Make up your mind!

[JSngry]

I've wondered about this general 70's transition into sentimentalism...

I guess the money was coming in for some of these guys

and you had Klemmer making "sexy" songs

and Mangione making mushy sap and James making fop-funk

and Corea wanting to "communicate" with his pixie crap and so on...

Guys that really could of continued building on their inventiveness

just seemed to drop the ball or maybe

they just began putting little acorns and spray-paint on them a la Martha Stewart.

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My guess is that their favorite Beatle was Paul...