WORLD CUP 2006 / GERMANY

[J.A.W.]

He called me a terrorist. Well, whaaaah. None of these clowns would last a second in today's NBA. Maybe they're all just ultra-sensitive. That would help explain why diving and faking injuries is a way of life in professional soccer.

With regard to the sport's inability to make much headway in the U.S., Pat Buchanan related a clever aside on the McLaughlin Group last Friday night. He said soccer was like the metric system in short pants.

Up over and out.

These are the kind of remarks that give many non-Americans the impression that Americans regard their way of life as superior to others. Very condescending.

Edited July 11, 2006 by J.A.W.

[couw]

With regard to the sport's inability to make much headway in the U.S., Pat Buchanan related a clever aside on the McLaughlin Group last Friday night. He said soccer was like the metric system in short pants.

actually, the reason is that it's too difficult for simple folks

[J.A.W.]

With regard to the sport's inability to make much headway in the U.S., Pat Buchanan related a clever aside on the McLaughlin Group last Friday night. He said soccer was like the metric system in short pants.

actually, the reason is that it's too difficult for simple folks

[Brad]

As an American, I don't ask you to like football but these kind of stupid comments just show the rest of the world that we are ugly Americans. Americans seem to have a hang up with big scores but a low scoring game, be it football or baseball, creates its own tension. If you don't have anything to contribute, why bother?

[J.A.W.]

As an American, I don't ask you to like football but these kind of stupid comments just show the rest of the world that we are ugly Americans. Americans seem to have a hang up with big scores but a low scoring game, be it football or baseball, creates its own tension. If you don't have anything to contribute, why bother?

Excellent post.

[Brad]

As an American, I don't ask you to like football but these kind of stupid comments just show the rest of the world that we are ugly Americans. Americans seem to have a hang up with big scores but a low scoring game, be it football or baseball, creates its own tension. If you don't have anything to contribute, why bother?

Excellent post.

Unfortunately, it's more of an apology to the rest of the world.

[J.A.W.]

As an American, I don't ask you to like football but these kind of stupid comments just show the rest of the world that we are ugly Americans. Americans seem to have a hang up with big scores but a low scoring game, be it football or baseball, creates its own tension. If you don't have anything to contribute, why bother?

Excellent post.

Unfortunately, it's more of an apology to the rest of the world.

You don't have to apologize for something someone else posted; it's their responsibility, and it says a lot about them.

[Dave James]

I hate the shootout. Games should be decided on the field...especially at the World Cup level. I'm not sure how often the shooter scores, but it has to be at least 90% of the time. The goalie doesn't have a prayer. At least in ice hockey, it's a fair fight. If they insist on using penalty kicks to decide matches, why not move the shooting line back a ways and give the goalie a chance to actually react instead of just guessing. France was clearly the better team on Sunday, especially during the 10-15 minutes prior to the Zidane red card, but Italy wins on penalty kicks. Not good.

Up over and out.

[Dmitry]

Juego Bonito, motherf@#ker!

[scottb]

I happened to pass a TV on a sports channel and saw a couple of meatheads on a sports talk show. They obviously had no clue about football or the World Cup but there they were giving their expert sports announcer commentary about the final. They ended by saying that they were glad the World Cup was over and now soccer can go away for a while.

No wonder the average American doesn't understand or appreciate the beautiful game.

[mike casinghino]

i never realized that being the better team in the second half means that you deserve to win the game. yeah, france controlled the second half, but italy was the better team in the first half. for all the supposed domination by france,they only scored on a penalty kick,and italy had a good number of chances to score,especially in the first half.italy wins on penalty kicks,not good?until they change the rules,thats how it works,i don't get the "not good"?imo,there should be unlimited subs,and you should be able to reenter a game after being subbed for. then you would have fresh players out there all the time, probably more scoring chances,more action,more games decided in regulation,and no need for penalty kicks. and really now, get rid of all the dives pronto!i also take back calling zidane an idiot, i should have said it was an idiotic act.

[couw]

i never realized that being the better team in the second half means that you deserve to win the game. yeah, france controlled the second half, but italy was the better team in the first half. for all the supposed domination by france,they only scored on a penalty kick,and italy had a good number of chances to score,especially in the first half.italy wins on penalty kicks,not good?until they change the rules,thats how it works,i don't get the "not good"?imo,there should be unlimited subs,and you should be able to reenter a game after being subbed for. then you would have fresh players out there all the time, probably more scoring chances,more action,more games decided in regulation,and no need for penalty kicks. and really now, get rid of all the dives pronto!i also take back calling zidane an idiot, i should have said it was an idiotic act.

France dominated the midfield starting second half thru the extra time. That this did not result in many chances on goal is to be blamed on the Italian defense if you want to put it like that, although the French finish sure was to blame here and there as well. Throughout the first half, it was pretty much a stalemate with two teams standing solidly in the back et c'est ca. The Italian danger in the first half came from standard situations where at times the ref certainly helped some and at others it was obvious that the standard situation (corner shot) was all Italy played for -- it certainly became once it was clear that Barthez was staying on the line on those corner shots leaving it all to his defense. No one to blame there, but playing on defense and standards isn't exactly the tactic to win the hearts of the people. Italy was pretty much reacting for long stretches during the first half as well and nowhere near the game mode they played against the Germans where they were for once really making it all happen.

The unlimited subs idea is interesting and I have seen that floating around, but it would probably kill the game if one team is leading with only 10 minutes to go. We'd have a sub-fest then and lots of frustration. I've also seen the option of introducing the netball rule of dividing the team strictly between forward and defense to make the game more attractive. At least that would create more space and fewer 9-guy defenses.

And by the by, the failing strenght of the Italy midfield was also illustrated by Totti only hitting balls in standard situations. German television took a look at it and he hit his first "in game" ball towards the end of the first half. Where was he? Well, between defense and a couple of lonely forwards.

Edited July 11, 2006 by couw

[Brad]

I'm not sure I agree with the unlimited subs idea but I know that one of the US commentators mentioned about having an extra sub in overtime. I would probably make that two and perhaps extend the overtime to 45 minutes. There are probably ideas that FIFA could come up with if they have any creativity. Cited as a factor in going to PKs is the ability of the players to keep playing after 120 minutes. In Germany this was a factor because of the heat. This may not be the case in South Africa where I believe it will be early fall.

[Alexander Hawkins]

Unlimited subs, whilst it was permitted, absolutely killed many a friendly...

I like the idea of limitation, because it really tests the manager. Sven, for example, routinely failed. Mourinho, love him or loathe him, is, by contrast, a genius in this respect.

[J.A.W.]

Unlimited subs, whilst it was permitted, absolutely killed many a friendly...

Absolutely correct, it proved to disrupt teams and kill games. Not a good idea in my view.

[mike casinghino]

just thinking that there would be a lot more action,with fresh players, instead of everyone dragging by games end,with just a few subs.

[Alexander Hawkins]

just thinking that there would be a lot more action,with fresh players, instead of everyone dragging by games end,with just a few subs.

Yeah...It just seemed to - at the risk of sounding pretentious - kill the narrative of the game. Individual battles; one player overcoming the next by being fitter; one finally outfoxing the next (Pele managing to beat Moore *just that once* in 1970 etc.)...

I suppose that's why they only give boxers a minute, rather than a week, between rounds.

edit: well, that and it would piss off the crowd

Edited July 11, 2006 by Red

[J.A.W.]

Just saw on German TV (WDR text) that Jürgen Klinsmann has resigned as German "Team Chef".

It's now also on the BBC.

Edited July 12, 2006 by J.A.W.

[Son-of-a-Weizen]

You'll simply never convince me that a sport that allows its most serious games to be decided by PKs is a sport worth following. Not that anyone cares...

I agree. Instead of going to penalty kicks they should switch to overtime 'sudden death' like they do in hockey.

[J.A.W.]

You'll simply never convince me that a sport that allows its most serious games to be decided by PKs is a sport worth following. Not that anyone cares...

I agree. Instead of going to penalty kicks they should switch to overtime 'sudden death' like they do in hockey.

They had overtime sudden death in the knock-out stages of WC 2002, but it didn't work and they changed it back to the current, "old" system of penalties after overtime.

[Brad]

You'll simply never convince me that a sport that allows its most serious games to be decided by PKs is a sport worth following. Not that anyone cares...

I agree. Instead of going to penalty kicks they should switch to overtime 'sudden death' like they do in hockey.

They had overtime sudden death in the knock-out stages of WC 2002, but it didn't work and they changed it back to the current, "old" system of penalties after overtime.

The only thing that would work is probably a replay of the game but in this age of tv, that just won't happen. Sudden death isn't a good option. I don't like it in American football and I like it less here.

[skeith]

I happened to pass a TV on a sports channel and saw a couple of meatheads on a sports talk show. They obviously had no clue about football or the World Cup but there they were giving their expert sports announcer commentary about the final. They ended by saying that they were glad the World Cup was over and now soccer can go away for a while.

No wonder the average American doesn't understand or appreciate the beautiful game.

Well as an average American, I think it is a beautiful game -potentially. But maybe not this World Cup and I think plenty of the Europeans on this board have been saying the same thing.

I watched about 10 games from start to finish.

I defer to others on this board, especially the Europeans, whom I am sure know more acbout soccer than I do, but I see nothing beautiful in De Rossi's elbow to the face of Brian McBride and all the blood on his face. And I think a lot of Americans see nothing beautiful in the rather frequent diving we have been treated to. My god, we see these guys diving when there has not even been any contact. Say want you want about the NFL, but when a guy gets taken off the field in a stretcher, he's not coming back to the game. Here in this World Cup, how many guys go off the field in a stretcher as if they are about to die, and they are back in the game 2 minutes later?

I think the overall impression of the soccer games in this World Cup is that too many of the games are decided by penalty kicks resulting from rather questionable penalties which certain players seem to be looking for, rather than playing the game. A prime example of that was the Italy -Australia match, where it certainly appeared that the Italian player purposely tripped over the Australian to get the penalty kick. The officials deciding what is and what is not a penalty seem to be inconsistent from game to game.

And like some on this board, I lamented the red card to Zidane, and I think that if he was taunted by Italian players with derogatory comments about his ethnicity, well that just sucks. Sure Zidane should not have lost his head - but I am more sympathetic to him when I hear about these circumstances.

Finally, I do think that goals scored on penalty kicks (whether in the shootout at the end or even during the game) just aren't as impressive as the goals scored during regular game. They just seem easier to me to score as long as the goalie goes the wrong way. That goal Italy scored during the game was more impressive than ZIdane's penalty kick, but they detract from it all with their constant faked penalties.

[B. Clugston]

You'll simply never convince me that a sport that allows its most serious games to be decided by PKs is a sport worth following. Not that anyone cares...

I agree. Instead of going to penalty kicks they should switch to overtime 'sudden death' like they do in hockey.

I don't like penalty kicks deciding a game, either. But with sudden death, the game could still end on a successful penalty kick.

[scottb]

You know the whole gripe about the stretcher is bogus. They stretcher them off to get them out of the way so the game can resume without them until they are ready to rejoin the action.

In the NFL if a guy goes down the game comes to halt, he limps off the field with the aide of 3 athletic trainers and it takes about 5 minutes. He then sits on the sideline for a possesion or two, a few commercial breaks, a few official timeouts not to mention the "regular" stopping of the clock, getting attention, icepacks, wraps, injections, whatever until he is ready to reenter if he can. And by the way, his team is allowed to replace him immediately.

While I'm at it, what's the gripe about not knowing when the game will end? With 2 minutes left on an NBA clock can you honestly tell me within 10 minutes how long that game will last? How about a baseball game? How long are those 9 innings going to take? Who cares?

If you don't care for soccer, fine. Don't watch it. Why feel the need to try to say a sport is inferior to another or a sport is stupid just because you don't understand it?

[Dave James]

You'll simply never convince me that a sport that allows its most serious games to be decided by PKs is a sport worth following. Not that anyone cares...

I agree. Instead of going to penalty kicks they should switch to overtime 'sudden death' like they do in hockey.

Soccer played at the highest level is a great sport, but it's not without some serious, systemic problems. Inconsistent to downright shoddy refereeing, penalty kicks, shootouts, diving etc. Hockey realized that they had some of the same kind of problems before last season and with the impetus provided by one of their own, ex- Red Wing, now Ranger Brendon Shanahan, went to the mattresses and reinvented itself. Is soccer so tied to tradition that it considers itself above some serious, introspective self-evaluation? One would hope not.

Up over and out.