Jim R Posted June 27, 2006 Author Report Share Posted June 27, 2006 In today's Telegraph: England Warned By Holland. Hmmm... not sure Holland need to call this to anyone's attention. Probably just their way of continuing to express their disgust, and not let people forget about it too quickly. England's players would do well to ignore Portugal's gamesmanship to the fullest extent, and hope for a decent ref. If they don't get a decent ref, then all bets are off. That's largely why it's hard to blame the dutch for getting into "the act" (I still have to put some blame on them, but one has to wonder what other choice they had). Clearly, that ref and his assistants did not see things well, or saw things and foolishly ignored them. The dirty play by Simao which I mentioned above (kicking van der Sar in the face when he knew he had no chance for that loose ball) is a perfect example. Come to think of it, van der Sar didn't play dead... he got up, ran to the top of the box with the ball, and delivered an elbow in the general direction of Simao's head. Way to go, Edwin! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexander Hawkins Posted June 27, 2006 Report Share Posted June 27, 2006 In today's Telegraph: England Warned By Holland. Hmmm... not sure Holland need to call this to anyone's attention. Probably just their way of continuing to express their disgust, and not let people forget about it too quickly. England's players would do well to ignore Portugal's gamesmanship to the fullest extent, and hope for a decent ref. If they don't get a decent ref, then all bets are off. That's largely why it's hard to blame the dutch for getting into "the act" (I still have to put some blame on them, but one has to wonder what other choice they had). Clearly, that ref and his assistants did not see things well, or saw things and foolishly ignored them. The dirty play by Simao which I mentioned above (kicking van der Sar in the face when he knew he had no chance for that loose ball) is a perfect example. Come to think of it, van der Sar didn't play dead... he got up, ran to the top of the box with the ball, and delivered an elbow in the general direction of Simao's head. Way to go, Edwin! All I'd say is that England have a brand of 'sportsmanship' all of their own...although - shhhhhhh! - don't admit it in this country - it's near enough a capital offence. p.s. Steven Gerrard dives with the best of them. 'Won' (what a horrible usage in this connection!) a disgraceful penalty in a warm-up match against the Hungarians. Kenny - well done to the Socceroos (I have an Aussie mate who was out at a couple of the games). Unlike many of the teams, I think they managed to transcend their reputation. Very physical, yes, but (by and large) fair. And, with all due respect, they showed what can be achieved by a squad with spirit, a good coach, but not necessarily that many gifted players (notable exceptions apart!). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexander Hawkins Posted June 27, 2006 Report Share Posted June 27, 2006 BTW, I think it's a real shame Essien isn't playing for Ghana...I think that really diminishes their chances. I know what you mean, Jim - I'd love to see Ghana win, but I never like teams like Brazil to go out! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
couw Posted June 27, 2006 Report Share Posted June 27, 2006 (edited) Brazil failed to impress me four years ago and they have yet to impress me in this tournament. Everyone was all over Greece for playing crap football two years ago, but I don't see Brazil doing it much differently. Their game is mainly focussed on not losing instead of on winning. Something Germany has always been scolded for. Thus far the only team that has consistently played to win in this tournament has been Germany. Oh, the irony. Surely Brazil has its world class players that are always good for some nice tricks. But do we really want to watch an entire game of boring defense in anticipation of one brilliant pass and a few of those tricks? I'd rather see a team working together to score instead of depending on the individual brilliance of a few and the mistakes of the other team. If you look at FIFA game analyses, you get a lot of "but in the end it was individual skill that won Brazil the game". Which is also why I am a bit puzzled by all the reactions of Brazil not having found its way into the tournament and yadda yadda. To me they continued where they left off, just that their star players haven't found their form yet. Four years ago it was Turkey and Germany playing the combination football dominating the midfield and putting pressure on the Brazilian defense. Not the other way around. Stuff like Argentina showed us against Serbia is simply not the modus operandi of the Brazilian team when their opponent is more than a pile of tired Japanese... Edited June 27, 2006 by couw Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexander Hawkins Posted June 27, 2006 Report Share Posted June 27, 2006 Brazil failed to impress me four years ago and they have yet to impress me in this tournament. Everyone was all over Greece for playing crap football two years ago, but I don't see Brazil doing it much differently. Their game is mainly focussed on not losing instead of on winning. Something Germany has always been scolded for. Thus far the only team that has consistently played to win in this tournament has been Germany. Oh, the irony. Surely Brazil has its world class players that are always good for some nice tricks. But do we really want to watch an entire game of boring defense in anticipation of one brilliant pass and a few of those tricks? I'd rather see a team working together to score instead of depending on the individual brilliance of a few and the mistakes of the other team. If you look at FIFA game analyses, you get a lot of "but in the end it was individual skill that won Brazil the game". Which is also why I am a bit puzzled by all the reactions of Brazil not having found its way into the tournament and yadda yadda. To me they continued where they left off, just that their star players haven't found their form yet. Four years ago it was Turkey and Germany playing the combination football dominating the midfield and putting pressure on the Brazilian defense. Not the other way around. Stuff like Argentina showed us against Serbia is simply not the modus operandi of the Brazilian team when their opponent is more than a pile of tired Japanese... Interesting...I *do* know what you mean about this Brazil side, but I feel that it is a change for the better from the 2002 side, which was much the same as the 1998 side, which was a change for the better from the 1994 side. I like this side more than the last two, because they were set up more for brute speed (similar in some ways to Arsenal at the moment) than for nice football. With the maturing of Ronaldinho, and the advent of Robinho, Kaka (the best of the bunch for my money) and Adriano, I think there's more flair in the side (though, as you say, it's yet really to come). I don't think this Brazil side is set up for defending (have any Brazil sides ever been equipped to defend?). When you're playing 4 - 2 - 2 - 2, and of the four, two are Roberto Carlos and Cafu (granted that both of these have become more competent defenders over the years), and of the backmost two, one is Juninho Pernambucano, I don't think the aim is to play defensively. I do agree that they haven't turned it on recently - the Japanese notwithstanding. However, I think the appearance of defence has more been to do with the fact that the front 6(!) have not retained the ball well, resulting in lots to do for the men at the back. I would add Argentina to Germany - I feel that they've set out to win where possible. Similarly Ghana. Possibly also Spain, but they had a shit group, let's face it . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dmitry Posted June 27, 2006 Report Share Posted June 27, 2006 Looks like Ukrainians are on a roll. Ukraine-Italy match promises to be a real bruiser!!! Do we get a 2 day football break now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.A.W. Posted June 27, 2006 Report Share Posted June 27, 2006 (edited) Do we get a 2 day football break now? Yep. The last two 2nd round games will be played today (Tuesday). Then there's a two-day break. The Quarterfinals will be played on Friday, June 30 and Saturday, July 1; the Semifinals on Tuesday, July 4 and Wednesday, July 5; the "losers' final" (3rd/4th place) on Saturday, July 8 and the Final on Sunday, July 9. Edited June 27, 2006 by J.A.W. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
king ubu Posted June 27, 2006 Report Share Posted June 27, 2006 Looks like Ukrainians are on a roll. Ukraine-Italy match promises to be a real bruiser!!! huh? they did even worse than the swiss, and the italians did pretty badly, too, I heard... Do we get a 2 day football break now? phew! that's why actually I'm glad the Swiss are out: I really hope Zurich will get back to normal life again now - it was a total madhouse for a week now, with public transport breaking down those nights them swiss didn't shoot any goals... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim R Posted June 27, 2006 Author Report Share Posted June 27, 2006 BTW, I think it's a real shame Essien isn't playing for Ghana...I think that really diminishes their chances. I had forgotten about that (last heard it mentioned in the U.S. / Ghana match). I wish I could remember what Essien's two yellows looked like. I must admit I was glad to see him get the second one, but I was biased at that particular time. Now I'm wondering whether he really ought to be in action today (and yes, that's another shot at the refs in the first round). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.A.W. Posted June 27, 2006 Report Share Posted June 27, 2006 Brazil 2, Ghana 0, with about 15 minutes left... A poor game, with bad defending and sloppy finishing by Ghana, and a very tired-looking, almost uninterested Brazilian team. (YAWN...) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.A.W. Posted June 27, 2006 Report Share Posted June 27, 2006 Brazil 2, Ghana 0, with about 15 minutes left... A poor game, with bad defending and sloppy finishing by Ghana, and a very tired-looking, almost uninterested Brazilian team. (YAWN...) Brazil now 3, Ghana 0 and down to 10 men - YAWN again... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexander Hawkins Posted June 27, 2006 Report Share Posted June 27, 2006 (edited) Yes, the Brazilians are getting roundly booed. If Ghana had some deadlier finishing, they would (might?) have won this game. I forget about Essien's cards. I seem to remember both were deserved, but neither particularly malicious challenges. Edited June 27, 2006 by Red Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noj Posted June 27, 2006 Report Share Posted June 27, 2006 At one point to these untrained American non-football watching eyes it looked like Ghana was dominating the ball, even though the score was 1-0 Brazil. However, when Brazil got the ball in Ghana's zone, the precision of their passes and savvy attack seemed to be overwhelming. Two steps ahead, those Brazilians. Must be experience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexander Hawkins Posted June 27, 2006 Report Share Posted June 27, 2006 At one point to these untrained American non-football watching eyes it looked like Ghana was dominating the ball, even though the score was 1-0 Brazil. However, when Brazil got the ball in Ghana's zone, the precision of their passes and savvy attack seemed to be overwhelming. Two steps ahead, those Brazilians. Must be experience. I think you're absolutely right. I agree, at 1-0 Brazil, Ghana were the better side. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.A.W. Posted June 27, 2006 Report Share Posted June 27, 2006 At one point to these untrained American non-football watching eyes it looked like Ghana was dominating the ball, even though the score was 1-0 Brazil. However, when Brazil got the ball in Ghana's zone, the precision of their passes and savvy attack seemed to be overwhelming. Two steps ahead, those Brazilians. Must be experience. I think you're absolutely right. I agree, at 1-0 Brazil, Ghana were the better side. They were indeed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Posted June 27, 2006 Report Share Posted June 27, 2006 I wasn't able to see the game for the most part (although I have taped it as I will be suffering from withdrawal tomorrow). I did catch the last few minutes and it seemed like Ghana had some chances but couldn't finish them off. On the other hand so did Brasil. So, assuming Spain gets through, what's the view on their possibilities? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
couw Posted June 27, 2006 Report Share Posted June 27, 2006 Brazil was really lame in the midfield again. About half of their passes went nowhere. Once Ghana got the ball, they did not really try to fight them off on the midfield, but instead went into their own half, rather close to the own PK area and buried themselves there. Then Ghana loses the ball and you see a fast counter attack with the waiting bunch up front coming into action. This kind of counter football is such an effing lame tactic and it is so frustrating to watch also for neutral public. Of course Ghana is to blame as well, they should have made some goals and should not have made those grave defensive mistakes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexander Hawkins Posted June 27, 2006 Report Share Posted June 27, 2006 I wasn't able to see the game for the most part (although I have taped it as I will be suffering from withdrawal tomorrow). I did catch the last few minutes and it seemed like Ghana had some chances but couldn't finish them off. On the other hand so did Brasil. So, assuming Spain gets through, what's the view on their possibilities? I like Spain a lot more for it than I would have done if you'd asked me before the Brazil game. True, the Brazilians 'did enough' - but, as with England, I'm beginning to wonder whether that's a bit of a convenient excuse, especially at this stage of the competition. If a betting man, I suppose I'd naturally go with Brazil still (bearing in mind Spain haven't really been tested yet), but given the right odds, I wouldn't pass up a fiver on the Spanish... When you say 'assuming' the Spanish get through, is that just that you'd like them to, or that you think they will? I just wonder whether the French mightn't have a shout... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Posted June 27, 2006 Report Share Posted June 27, 2006 I wasn't able to see the game for the most part (although I have taped it as I will be suffering from withdrawal tomorrow). I did catch the last few minutes and it seemed like Ghana had some chances but couldn't finish them off. On the other hand so did Brasil. So, assuming Spain gets through, what's the view on their possibilities? I like Spain a lot more for it than I would have done if you'd asked me before the Brazil game. True, the Brazilians 'did enough' - but, as with England, I'm beginning to wonder whether that's a bit of a convenient excuse, especially at this stage of the competition. If a betting man, I suppose I'd naturally go with Brazil still (bearing in mind Spain haven't really been tested yet), but given the right odds, I wouldn't pass up a fiver on the Spanish... When you say 'assuming' the Spanish get through, is that just that you'd like them to, or that you think they will? I just wonder whether the French mightn't have a shout... I think they will and they should but as a Spain supporter, I've learned never to expect too much and be over optimistic. They barely got by Ireland and should have beaten S Korea but thinking about it brings back bad memories. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Posted June 27, 2006 Report Share Posted June 27, 2006 Spain 1-0!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.A.W. Posted June 27, 2006 Report Share Posted June 27, 2006 (edited) Spain 1, France 0; penalty. The penalty was correct in my view (watched several repeats ), the Spanish player was tackled from behind. Well deserved, the Spanish are better. France are static and slow, especially in midfield, and they can hardly reach Henry, who must be feeling very lonely up front... Edited June 27, 2006 by J.A.W. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.A.W. Posted June 27, 2006 Report Share Posted June 27, 2006 A rare moment of French magic: 1-1, goal by Ribery. Poor defending by Spain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
couw Posted June 27, 2006 Report Share Posted June 27, 2006 This was another game that threatened to end in a tactic stale mate with strong and clever defense on both sides. That Spanish PK really broke it open. Now *this* is the kind of stuff we're watching to see! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.A.W. Posted June 27, 2006 Report Share Posted June 27, 2006 Half time: 1-1. Finally a game worth watching! Spain are the better side, but France improved a bit at the end of the first half. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Posted June 27, 2006 Report Share Posted June 27, 2006 (edited) Should be quite a second half. Looks like a generally clean first half. I'm shocked! Edited June 27, 2006 by Brad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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