What happened to the clarinet?

[chris]

My understanding is that the clarinet has fingering similar to the saxophone and it was quite popular until Bop came around. Why'd it become so much less popular. Just circumstance or was there a technical reason? It really has a beautiful tone... maybe too smooth

[Jazz Kat]

It was too hard.

[Guy Berger]

The flipside is that it made something of a comeback with free jazz.

Guy

[Jazz Kat]

Check out Buddy De Franco.

[Michael Fitzgerald]

Read here:

http://users.bestweb.net/~msnyder/clarinet/clar1945.htm

Mike

[Bright Moments]

Check out Buddy De Franco.

no jk, check out david murray!

[Nate Dorward]

I don't play sax or clarinet but my understanding is that clarinet is much harder, especially the jump between the registers (it's not an octave as on saxophone but a tenth, if memory serves).

There are plenty of clarinettists from bop & onwards but the original poster is certainly right that it substantially lost ground to the saxophone in popularity.

[P.L.M]

I don't play sax or clarinet but my understanding is that clarinet is much harder, especially the jump between the registers (it's not an octave as on saxophone but a tenth, if memory serves).

Right but I think that the true reason is not a technical one, only than clarinet, in a context of a bop combo, had a too thin sound to compete with a trombone or a trumpet (imagine Gillespie with his trumpet and Parker with a... clarinet).

Aniway, clarinet play a role during the West-Coast era (cf. Jimmy Giuffre).

[AllenLowe]

nah, the damn thing is a pain in the ass....tough embouchre, and the most annoying thing is that the identical fingering represents two different notes in different octaves - I always got lost playing it - my favorite clarinetist, however, is Lester Young -

[John L]

my favorite clarinetist, however, is Lester Young -

Mine too. Why did Lester stop playing clarinet in the 1930s (other than that single very strange late Verve session)?

[Stereojack]

Why did Lester stop playing clarinet in the 1930s (other than that single very strange late Verve session)?

Perhaps the same reason Johnny Hodges stopped playing soprano sax?

[AllenLowe]

he actually did play it on a Verve in 1957 or 1958 I think - am I correct in this? If memory serves, it was on a date with Sweets Edison -

Edited May 5, 2005 by AllenLowe

[Jazz Kat]

Bill Smith! You can actually hear some radical clarinet playing with Dave Brubeck on his more recent, (circa 1985) quartets with his son Chris on bass.

[Guy Berger]

Why did Lester stop playing clarinet in the 1930s (other than that single very strange late Verve session)?

Perhaps the same reason Johnny Hodges stopped playing soprano sax?

Didn't Hodges stop playing ss because Duke wouldn't pay him as a "doubler"?

Guy

[JSngry]

The shape of a good clarinet tone is at odds with the shape of a good bebop line. One of'em's gonna get clipped, no matter how good the player or the line is. If it don't fit, don't force it. But some people did anyways.

Just my opinion.

[bertrand]

Is this bass clarinet also harder to play? Man, I love that thing, especially on Bitches' Brew.

Bertrand.

[Jazz Kat]

Harder? I dont think so. Same finguring right? Has to be. IN school the teacher picks the advanced clarinet players to try bass clarinet. It couldn't of been that much of a jump.

[AllenLowe]

it actually may be a bit easier because of the bigger sound bore - probably takes less breath control - just like it's easier to get a sound on the tenor sax than the alto -

Edited May 5, 2005 by AllenLowe

[Michael Fitzgerald]

An important difference between soprano and bass clarinet is that the bass clarinet has keys (like a saxophone) that cover the holes. On the soprano clarinet, there are no keys for the primary fingers and the fingers themselves have to cover the holes.

I agree with Allen about the air requirements.

Mike

[medjuck]

Wow. This same discussin is taking place (at length) on the Duke Ellington List Serve here my only contribution was:

"Tony Scott--Nuff Said."

[JSngry]

An important difference between soprano and bass clarinet is that the bass clarinet has keys (like a saxophone) that cover the holes. On the soprano clarinet, there are no keys for the primary fingers and the fingers themselves have to cover the holes.

I agree with Allen about the air requirements.

Mike

Yep.

[montg]

A couple of people have mentioned the thinning tone in the context of bop lines--why would the speed or the harmonic challenges of bop impact the tone? Just curious. I've tried to appreciate Buddy DeFranco, put his tone just sounds so grating to me. Like it's always thin and always a little bit sharp. I can't even listen to the Hampton/ DeFranco Verve sessions because of the SOUND of the clarinet. It really irritates me. And I normally love to hear the clarinet---I could listen to Edmond Hall all day. And Bechet had a nice sound on the clarinet on those few occasions when he put down the SS.

[Jim Alfredson]

Clarinet is a really sweet sounding instrument. I wish more people played it. How about an organ quartet with clarient, bass clarient? That would be cool!

[jazzbo]

Wow, how about REED organ and a couple clarinets?

[AllenLowe]

Best clarinetist I ever heard was Art Pepper - in Boston at Paul's Mall, circa 1977 or 1978, somebody gave him a clarinet between sets. He took it on stage, announced that he hadn't played one in ten years, and blew the hell out of it - liquid tone, swinging, great ideas - wow -