Benny Goodman at Carnegie Hall

[Christiern]

3 minutes or 30 seconds sound more plausible. I'll ask George and get back.

[Christiern]

Just heard back from George. 30 seconds is what he meant, the actual gap being 27 seconds.

[medjuck]

That's sounds more plausible. So is the 27 seconds on any cd? Was it on the original Lp release?

[gmonahan]

That's odd. I just clicked on it in your response, and it took me right there!

Try again.

BTW do I owe Barbara Woodhouse to you? If so, thanks and please note that I made the change. Which gives me an opportunity to test another link.

I hadn't visited the blog in a while, so I enjoyed returning to it. I haven't heard the Jasmine version of the concert. Despite its "provenance," I do like the Definitive version. The Schaap is indeed a horror.

gregmo

[The Magnificent Goldberg]

That's odd. I just clicked on it in your response, and it took me right there!

Try again.

BTW do I owe Barbara Woodhouse to you? If so, thanks and please note that I made the change. Which gives me an opportunity to test another link.

Worked this morning. Sometimes things are just odd. It was a message from your blog saying not found, not from the web saying page not found.

Yes, Barbara came from me

MG

[AllenLowe]

actually, Phil didn't engineer the reissue - Rosemary Woods did.

[Shrdlu]

I'm with Lon. I just enjoyed the concert. I think my copy is the Schaap one, but I can't be bothered to go look. I don't plan to listen to it again in the near future.

If there are sonic problems, I am blissfully unaware of them.

Boy, I'm glad I'm not Phil Schaap, or Orrin Keepnews or Leonard Feather. I've never met any of them, so yes, I don't know the whole story, but I don't really want to know. Can't they be forgiven for their weapons of mass destruction?

All I have are lots of nice memories of getting LPs and feeling good that Leonard had written the notes (always very good, too); buying a Riverside LP and seeing Orrin's name on there, and, much more recently getting some Columbia CD reissues that Phil had done (including the Miles and Gil, I think).

[Christiern]

Doesn't that little black book say that one reaps what one sows? Like many things in that book, it's on the money—Phil, Orrin and Leonard are (even in death re the latter) proving the validity of that tired old saying. That does not mean that they haven't done good things—some actually have.

[B. Clugston]

Just heard back from George. 30 seconds is what he meant, the actual gap being 27 seconds.

That makes more sense. I was wondering what they would have done for 30 minutes in that era? Benny suddenly goes altissimo followed by chanting?

[paul secor]

Phil Schaap gets knocked for including everything at times and now he gets knocked for not including 30 seconds.

[Brad]

Wonder what Rosemary Woods would think?

[Chuck Nessa]

To sum up, the Schapp version is needlessly noisy. Thanks for the extra material and shame for the end result. YMMV.

I don't care enough about the event to search a better version.

We should all thank Albert Marx.

[Harold_Z]

To sum up, the Schapp version is needlessly noisy.

True - but for us old farts that grew up when 78s were still around, 45s and lps were just emerging, and nobody in the family had a clue as to taking care of records - I think we have built in noise filters. Schaap's version doesn't bother me - and is way better than the previous sony cd reissue. Probably I would like the AVID if I already didn't have the Columbia.

[Christiern]

Schaap's version is so noisy that I actually wondered if he hadn't added some. Remembering a complaint that came in from the late Nick Perls and his so-called Blues Mafia when we released the first of the Bessie Smith double LPs: You shouldn't have removed the surface noise.

Perhaps Schaap should have spent more time listening to the music and less searching around for audience "atmosphere," coughs and sneezes.

[Harold_Z]

Schaap's version is so noisy that I actually wondered if he hadn't added some. Remembering a complaint that came in from the late Nick Perls and his so-called Blues Mafia when we released the first of the Bessie Smith double LPs: You shouldn't have removed the surface noise.

Perhaps Schaap should have spent more time listening to the music and less searching around for audience "atmosphere," coughs and sneezes.

I agree with all of what you say here Chris - It's just that the first Sony cd reissue was so horrendous (and I didn't have the original lp issues) - as were the first Sony reissues of the Louis Hot 5s and 7s. All that stuff was unlistenable. I was actually angry after buying them.

I have all of the Bessie Double lps. They sounded fine. I gave away the old "Bessie Smith Story" 4 lp set after getting the doubles, preferring the sound of the doubles. Now I wish I had kept them simply for collector value.

[BruceH]

Phil Schaap gets knocked for including everything at times and now he gets knocked for not including 30 seconds.

That bastard.

[Hoppy T. Frog]

Just heard back from George. 30 seconds is what he meant, the actual gap being 27 seconds.

That makes more sense. I was wondering what they would have done for 30 minutes in that era? Benny suddenly goes altissimo followed by chanting?

[Fer Urbina]

Hello everyone,

I'm comparing several issues of the Carnegie Hall concert regarding completeness, not so much audio quality (the Jasmine is way better than the Schaap), and I'm missing the Definitive and the newer 4-CD Avid issue. Could anyone send me mp3s of "Honeysuckle Rose" and "I Got Rhythm" from those two issues?

I've already compared the older Columbia CD, the newer Schaap and the Jasmine. So far I can tell you that the Jasmine also misses those 27 seconds from "I Got Rhythm".

Email is: fer_urbina[at]yahoo.com

Thanks in advance!

F

Edited May 4, 2010 by Fer Urbina

[mjzee]

Sent the Avid versions to you.

[Chuck Nessa]

Whatever. It was the first "pop band" to get into the hall. More interesting history than great music.

The concert is fine and is worthy of the best possible reproduction, but............

Not much different than the Beatles on Ed Sullivan.

[Christiern]

Strictly speaking, I think Whiteman beat Benny to it. That said, put the music in its historical context and you will find that it was better than it sounds to you now. This was more than just a historic concert, it was, in many ways, state of the art.

Can I interest you in Benny's autograph?

[Fer Urbina]

Sent the Avid versions to you.

Yes, many thanks for that! I've noticed those come from the 3-CD version. That I've already checked, and it seems to come from the LP (or the first Columbia CD issue).

The ones I need to check exactly are:

This (Avid AMBX 151), and

This (Definitive DRCD 11378_2)

I've tried to buy the mp3 from CDUniverse and it won't let me (I'm in the wrong country, apparently).

Thanks!

F

Edited May 5, 2010 by Fer Urbina

[Chuck Nessa]

Strictly speaking, I think Whiteman beat Benny to it. That said, put the music in its historical context and you will find that it was better than it sounds to you now. This was more than just a historic concert, it was, in many ways, state of the art.

Can I interest you in Benny's autograph?

Yeah, you can put it right here....

[Fer Urbina]

Whatever. It was the first "pop band" to get into the hall. More interesting history than great music.

The concert is fine and is worthy of the best possible reproduction, but............

Not much different than the Beatles on Ed Sullivan.

Perhaps not the best Goodman on record, but still there are moments that are remarkable (and even more so because of the special occasion), like Krupa's break on the first tune, Ziggy Elman's solo on "... Rockies", the very famous Jess Stacy solo on "Sing, Sing, Sing", or Lester Young's solo on "Honeysuckle Rose" (his first ever at the Hall?)

Avakian's remark about the missing half minute made me curious (Schaap's mistake there is quite something), and I'm trying to establish whether there's a single issue that is really complete (not taking into account the skip in Buck Clayton's solo on "Honeysuckle Rose").

F

Edited May 5, 2010 by Fer Urbina

[mjzee]

Up for curiosity. Did we ever determine which is the best sounding version?