This board needs a clear mission statement

[Guest DizzySpells]

Hi,

I have an idea that there might be members here who are of my opinion, so I'm just going to come out and state, as bluntly as possible, some problems I've had around here lately:

a) Some valued members have left. In my eyes, those members were people who tried to uphold a certain level of courtesy that has gone out the window these past few months.

b) For people like me, this used to be a place to hang out where one could discuss things without someone dropping a big turd on either the topic or the poster. That has changed, and I think it should be obvious to many posters.

c) Some people who post here have turned this board into a dumping ground for their negativity and either instigate or watch gleefully the haunting of members, their opinions or their interests.

d) The board has lost its pleasant atmoshpere (excluding the political forum, which has basically stayed the same since its inception).

e) I think many posters are hurting Jim and his band, because a lot of the crap posted here is bound to fall back on a band trying to get a real start in the business. I think some posters should really spend some time contemplating if this is their own private dumping ground. I think it isn't.

f) We've had an influx of trolls or people of a similar character here who know they are trolling the board, more or less openly, and I think it is clear that they don't give a damn if the whole thing goes up in smoke.

g) I think some people who have remained silent and/or have kept their exchanges about this to PMs and E-Mail should speak up and voice their concern. It's about time.

h) I know an Internet board can be left as quickly (without too much regret) as one has joined up, but I DO NOT like seeing a circle of friends disappear who think it is better to just let some destructive people take over the board. I would like to see them stand up and voice their opinion.

Maybe I'm totally wrong here, but I think the way things have been developing here lately, we might well see this board shut down too eventually. I don't want that to happen, and if you don't either, I think it's about time you speak up.

...

Fire away.

[Big Al]

Honestly?

I think Jim should shut the place down. Give us all thirty days to find a new home to post, and then lock the doors for good.

I say this out of genuine concern for Jim's state of being, his health, his sanity, and his family. How can you run this place and NOT have some (if not a bunch) of this stuff affect you on a day-to-day basis? I sure wouldn't want that kind of responsibility, nor could I even fathom handling it.

This is still a great place, but ultimately it's Jim's place, and I would think that the human condition, no matter how tough or resilient, can only take so much of this abuse on a day-to-day basis.

[Guest DizzySpells]

Thank you!

[Robert J]

Mission Statement - A statement of the role, or purpose, by which an organization intends to serve its stakeholders. Describes what the organization does (current capabilities), who it serves (stakeholders), and what makes the organization unique (justification for existence). Mission statements always exist at the top level of an organization, but may also be set for different organizational levels or components.

Organissimo is not a corporation!

Jim spelled it out here

[king ubu]

to what Dizzy said!

[Guest DizzySpells]

Mission Statement - A statement of the role, or purpose, by which an organization intends to serve its stakeholders. Describes what the organization does (current capabilities), who it serves (stakeholders), and what makes the organization unique (justification for existence). Mission statements always exist at the top level of an organization, but may also be set for different organizational levels or components.

Organissimo is not a corporation!

Jim spelled it out here

Yes, but quite a few people are ignoring the rules.

And you know it.

[Guest DizzySpells]

to what Dizzy said!

Thanks!

[jazzbo]

I'm of divided minds about this. I really don't think anything more stringent than Jim's original policies are necessary. Or should be. And I don't think this place is making Jim's band smell. People won't expect the band to reflect ever attitude here.

Yeah, I've really been soured to a lot of the discussions here. Guess for me it started when people sort of stood around the corpse of Leslie Gourse and started kicking. Something started then that gains momentum and makes this place a lot less fun for me. BUT this place isn't BEHOLDEN to be fun for me, if it's not fun I participate less, that's the way things go.

I really regret the departure of some of the posters here and wish they would come back. Just coming back and stepping around the cowpies in the meadow would make this place better. They're being here and being them and avoiding the 20 car pileups. Most of all THAT is what I would like to see.

Edited March 17, 2005 by jazzbo

[Guest che]

Hi,

I have an idea that there might be members here who are of my opinion, so I'm just going to come out and state, as bluntly as possible, some problems I've had around here lately:

a) Some valued members have left. In my eyes, those members were people who tried to uphold a certain level of courtesy that has gone out the window these past few months.

b) For people like me, this used to be a place to hang out where one could discuss things without someone dropping a big turd on either the topic or the poster. That has changed, and I think it should be obvious to many posters.

c) Some people who post here have turned this board into a dumping ground for their negativity and either instigate or watch gleefully the haunting of members, their opinions or their interests.

d) The board has lost its pleasant atmoshpere (excluding the political forum, which has basically stayed the same since its inception).

e) I think many posters are hurting Jim and his band, because a lot of the crap posted here is bound to fall back on a band trying to get a real start in the business. I think some posters should really spend some time contemplating if this is their own private dumping ground. I think it isn't.

f) We've had an influx of trolls or people of a similar character here who know they are trolling the board, more or less openly, and I think it is clear that they don't give a damn if the whole thing goes up in smoke.

g) I think some people who have remained silent and/or have kept their exchanges about this to PMs and E-Mail should speak up and voice their concern. It's about time.

h) I know an Internet board can be left as quickly (without too much regret) as one has joined up, but I DO NOT like seeing a circle of friends disappear who think it is better to just let some destructive people take over the board. I would like to see them stand up and voice their opinion.

Maybe I'm totally wrong here, but I think the way things have been developing here lately, we might well see this board shut down too eventually. I don't want that to happen, and if you don't either, I think it's about time you speak up.

...

Fire away.

Not for the first time you make a great deal of sense.

Che.

[Guest DizzySpells]

Che, you're one of those I meant.

Sorry, but that's the way it is.

[Guest che]

Che, you're one of those I meant.

Sorry, but that's the way it is.

Like I said you make a great deal of sense.

Che.

[Guest DizzySpells]

Che, you're one of those I meant.

Sorry, but that's the way it is.

Like I said you make a great deal of sense.

Che.

Here's my first one of these.

Fuck off.

[Guest DizzySpells]

I'm of divided minds about this. I really don't think anything more stringent than Jim's original policies are necessary. Or should be. And I don't think this place is making Jim's band smell. People won't expect the band to reflect ever attitude here.

Yeah, I've really been soured to a lot of the discussions here. Guess for me it started when people sort of stood around the corpse of Leslie Gourse and started kicking. Something started then that gains momentum and makes this place a lot less fun for me. BUT this place isn't BEHOLDEN to be fun for me, if it's not fun I participate less, that's the way things go.

I really regret the departure of some of the posters here and wish they would come back. Just coming back and stepping around the cowpies in the meadow would make this place better. They're being here and being them and avoiding the 20 car pileups. Most of all THAT is what I would like to see.

Yep.

100%

[Guest che]

Che, you're one of those I meant.

Sorry, but that's the way it is.

Like I said you make a great deal of sense.

Che.

Here's my first one of these.

Fuck off.

My how the worm has turned, I am not sure why you told me to 'fuck off', as I had complimented you (twice) on your post.

I will refrain from writing to you the way you have just written to me.

I of course will not 'fuck off' nor will I respond directly to you again.

Che.

[Guest DizzySpells]

Che, you're one of those I meant.

Sorry, but that's the way it is.

Like I said you make a great deal of sense.

Che.

Here's my first one of these.

Fuck off.

My how the worm has turned, I am not sure why you told me to 'fuck off', as I had complimented you (twice) on your post.

I will refrain from writing to you the way you have just written to me.

I of course will not 'fuck off' nor will I respond directly to you again.

Che.

Hypocrite.

[king ubu]

Che, you're one of those I meant.

Sorry, but that's the way it is.

Like I said you make a great deal of sense.

Che.

nothing much to feel sorry about...

che: get real! you step in here, barely a month back, and now you're posting that you know our personalities and other nice things. And telling me I'm a blockhead after YOU went overboard with antisemite thoughts over here...

You know, long before you joined this group, we have had discussions of topics related to the shoah and to World War II and to Israel and its politics. These were always conducted in a civilised and friendly manner, everybody being careful as to not offend the others and searching for words and trying to express his notions in a thoughtful manner. This seems to have come to an end. You'd be lying if you want to maintain you DID post in civilised and friendly manner, and you'd be lying if you'd want to state that you are ringing for words on these difficult topics. Just shoot ahead, others will take care of the cleaning up later, huh?

[Guest che]

Che, you're one of those I meant.

Sorry, but that's the way it is.

Like I said you make a great deal of sense.

Che.

nothing much to feel sorry about...

che: get real! you step in here, barely a month back, and now you're posting that you know our personalities and other nice things. And telling me I'm a blockhead after YOU went overboard with antisemite thoughts over here...

You know, long before you joined this group, we have had discussions of topics related to the shoah and to World War II and to Israel and its politics. These were always conducted in a civilised and friendly manner, everybody being careful as to not offend the others and searching for words and trying to express his notions in a thoughtful manner. This seems to have come to an end. You'd be lying if you want to maintain you DID post in civilised and friendly manner, and you'd be lying if you'd want to state that you are ringing for words on these difficult topics. Just shoot ahead, others will take care of the cleaning up later, huh?

This is not the place to discuss this thread, I know it does not appear to matter to you, but it may do the the person starting the thread and those that have contributed to it.

Che.

[Guest DizzySpells]

Let's not pile on Che.

He's not the only one.

And, how about the people on the sidelines getting in on the discussion?

[Jim R]

Can somebody please enlighten me as to what the hell is going on around here? I know things have been bad in the politics forum (which I chose not to view); I know Aric has had another flare-up; and I know that there are a few posters here who like to be abrasive... but that's about all I know. I don't read every thread. I spend less time on this board (and bulletin boards in general) than I used to, because it was taking too much time away from the more important things in life.

Which members left? Did they announce their departure, or was it something that was discussed via PM's and e-mails? I've noticed the absence of certain members periodically, but that ebbs and flows, and I'm never sure it's permanent.

I think people take all of this WAY too seriously sometimes. And I might add, the less seriously we all take it, the less of a hassle we're creating for Mr. Alfredson, who doesn't deserve to have to deal with a bunch of petty, meaningless nonsense.

[catesta]

I think people take all of this WAY too seriously sometimes. And I might add, the less seriously we all take it, the less of a hassle we're creating for Mr. Alfredson, who doesn't deserve to have to deal with a bunch of petty, meaningless nonsense.

Agree.

[Guest DizzySpells]

Can somebody please enlighten me as to what the hell is going on around here? I know things have been bad in the politics forum (which I chose not to view); I know Aric has had another flare-up; and I know that there are a few posters here who like to be abrasive... but that's about all I know. I don't read every thread. I spend less time on this board (and bulletin boards in general) than I used to, because it was taking too much time away from the more important things in life.

Which members left? Did they announce their departure, or was it something that was discussed via PM's and e-mails? I've noticed the absence of certain members periodically, but that ebbs and flows, and I'm never sure it's permanent.

I think people take all of this WAY too seriously sometimes. And I might add, the less seriously we all take it, the less of a hassle we're creating for Mr. Alfredson, who doesn't deserve to have to deal with a bunch of petty, meaningless nonsense.

Yes, but that amounts to ignoring things and making life even more difficult for Jim.

I think it's time we actively help, that we say what we think and take a stand (gosh, how dramatic).

What you are suggesting is that we actually leave the dirty work to Jim! And that life will just regulate this board. Not bloody likely.

And, I'm tired of hearing that we, who care about this board, spend too much time here, don't have a life and ignore other important things around us. That's BS and a standard line thrown around this board all the time trouble flares up. The people I know on this board and some who have left have a life and decided to spend some of their time here.

That time is being soured.

I know you meant this differently than I read it, but ...

[Jim R]

I never said we should "leave it all to Jim". I don't even know what "IT" is. I'm serious. I don't obsess about this board and who's saying what about whom. I asked you (or anybody else who cared to) to enlighten me as to what the big problem is that we're talking about possibly shutting the board down!! I also asked which members left. I don't even know who "Dizzy Spells" is, to tell you the truth. I guess you changed your handle?

I stand by my opinion that sometimes people are taking all of this too seriously, AND spending too much time here. That's fine if you disagree, but then again, maybe you need to stand back for awhile, take a deep breath, maybe go outside.

[Guest DizzySpells]

I never said we should "leave it all to Jim". I don't even know what "IT" is. I'm serious. I don't obsess about this board and who's saying what about whom. I asked you (or anybody else who cared to) to enlighten me as to what the big problem is that we're talking about possibly shutting the board down!! I also asked which members left. I don't even know who "Dizzy Spells" is, to tell you the truth. I guess you changed your handle?

I stand by my opinion that sometimes people are taking all of this too seriously, AND spending too much time here. That's fine if you disagree, but then again, maybe you need to stand back for awhile, take a deep breath, maybe go outside.

Well, if you don't know what's been going down here, why do you even participate in this thread? Spend some time here and read around. Not difficult ... you can do that while I take a break. B-)

[jazzbo]

It's quite true, some people are spending too much time here. I may be the bulk of the some (sum) peoples myself! Though I do spend LESS time here I admit it is hard to tell.

ONE poster who has left and is very missed is Hans (J. A. W.)

[Dr. Rat]

I'm of divided minds about this. I really don't think anything more stringent than Jim's original policies are necessary. Or should be. And I don't think this place is making Jim's band smell. People won't expect the band to reflect ever attitude here.

Yeah, I've really been soured to a lot of the discussions here. Guess for me it started when people sort of stood around the corpse of Leslie Gourse and started kicking. Something started then that gains momentum and makes this place a lot less fun for me. BUT this place isn't BEHOLDEN to be fun for me, if it's not fun I participate less, that's the way things go.

I really regret the departure of some of the posters here and wish they would come back. Just coming back and stepping around the cowpies in the meadow would make this place better. They're being here and being them and avoiding the 20 car pileups. Most of all THAT is what I would like to see.

I have mixed feelings as well. I don't think there is anything that management can do about our situation here.

I think that there are indeed some provocateurs here--and I don't think it matters whom I think they are. Some of you probably think I am a provocateur (and I do hope I'm spelling that right).

But that someone should post this thread as a plea for civility and then telll someone to fuck off is symptomatic of our problem.

I'm not being moralistic about this, I understand the temptation and the hostility completely--I've picked a couple of fights here myself.

BUT, I think the solution to the bad atmosphere is for the people who value courtesy to practice it avidly, even when they don't feel like it, even when they have contempt for the person they are showing it to. Because courtesy is not a show of respect to the person who receives it primarily. It is a show of respect for yourself and for the whole of the forum.

So the solution isn't to leave or to castigate the bad people, it is conduct yourself in the best manner you are able to.

I sound like Bambi's mother, I know. But it's the only way I think.

--eric