Pat Metheny

[Guest che]

I came across his latest album this afternoon, I did not buy it I bought Greg Osby instead. Is it any good?

Che.

http://www.organissimo.org/forum/index.php...&hl=pat+metheny

Thanks for the link.

Che.

[CJ Shearn]

yes, its the best thing the PMG has released to date, and that is saying something.

[Guest che]

yes, its the best thing the PMG has released to date, and that is saying something.

Ok I'll be honest I have hundreds of jazz CD's and many more records, but I do not have one PMG CD or record

Che.

[JSngry]

The funny thing is, I find that a lot of the blues and early rock player's basic timbre, underneath the distrotion, etc., sounds closer to an accoustic guitar (well, a stell-bodied one, anyway - should we give consideration to that instrument as a "transitional" one in terms of how electric guitar tone was percieved/concieved?)) than does the typical jazz player's from roughly the same timeframe.

The more I think about this off-the-cuff comment, the more I wonder if maybe there's not more to it than just a convinient comparison. Think about it - the steel- (not stell ) bodied accoustic guitar was primarily a "rural" instrument, no? And that would mean that it would be more likely to be part of the "aural subconsciousness" of blues/country players than that of the (mostly) "urban" jazz players. So maybe, maybe, the residual memory of the instrument's timbre had an effect on wht came out of those musical culture electrically?

Just a thought, and evidence pro or con is welcome.

[Joe]

The steel-bodied or metal resonator guitar also provided amplification without electrification, IIRC.

Seems as if the guitar has always had to struggle a bit to be heard.

http://www.provide.net/~cfh/national.html

[JSngry]

And of course, the Dobro: http://www.provide.net/~cfh/dobro.html

[Guest che]

So it seems I am missing something here.

Che.

[Michael Fitzgerald]

Yet you keep talking.

[JSngry]

Mike, please don't feed the animals. It only encourages them.

I'd really like to hear what Mr. Lowe (and/or anybody else with a good historical background in the subject) thinks about the whole steel-bodied thing.

[Guest che]

Yet you keep talking.

Yes.

In order to learn and appreciate and not be bullied and convinced.

You know years ago I worked in a place in which there was one boss, one opinion and he shouted the loudest and spoke the most, infact he spoke daily on just about every subject you could imagine.

And some admired him and some did not. But he had so many opinions, that few ever thought of their own opinions, and therfore he continued to be the boss!

Now this place was a Psychiatric rehabilitation hospital.

This place is a discussion on the PMG, hey brothers wake up to the children of the revolution.

Che.

[7/4]

I'm thinking about it...

...trouble is, I think the evolution in guitar tone was a tech issue. Better and/or different instruments and amps were invented to solve problems that were thought to exist.

[Guest che]

Yet you keep talking.

So what would you recommend for a 'newbie' in the world of the PMG?

Che.

[7/4]

Yet you keep talking.

So what would you recommend for a 'newbie' in the world of the PMG?

Che.

starters:

solo and colaborations

Bright Size Life

Watercolors

New Chautauqua

80/81

REJOICING

QUESTION AND ANSWER

Duo with Charlie Haden:

BEYOND THE MISSOURI SKY

Group

PAT METHENY GROUP

OFFRAMP

[Joe]

FWIW, contemporary "free" or "non-idiomatic" improviser John Russell plays a 1936 steel-bodied Zenith, partially in homage both to Oscar Aleman and to Django Reinhardt.

His work is worth checking out. the vocabulary he employs owes a lot to Derke Bailey, but he also uses rock / McLaughlin-style dynamics. Or I would say so based on his playing on THREE PLANETS.

http://www.shef.ac.uk/misc/rec/ps/efi/musician/mrussell.html

[Guest che]

Yet you keep talking.

So what would you recommend for a 'newbie' in the world of the PMG?

Che.

starters:

solo and colaborations

Bright Size Life

Watercolors

New Chautauqua

80/81

REJOICING

QUESTION AND ANSWER

Duo with Charlie Haden:

BEYOND THE MISSOURI SKY

Group

PAT METHENY GROUP

OFFRAMP

I have non of these albums, so I am going out in the morning, which one should I buy?

Che.

[7/4]

Yet you keep talking.

So what would you recommend for a 'newbie' in the world of the PMG?

Che.

starters:

solo and colaborations

Bright Size Life

Watercolors

New Chautauqua

80/81

REJOICING

QUESTION AND ANSWER

Duo with Charlie Haden:

BEYOND THE MISSOURI SKY

Group

PAT METHENY GROUP

OFFRAMP

I have non of these albums, so I am going out in the morning, which one should I buy?

Che.

Try Bright Size Life. His 1st solo album from many years ago.

[Sundog]

There's no doubt that there is a commonly recognized jazz guitar tone. Allen did a real good job of describing it a few posts back. That mellow, round, treble rolled off, sound goes a long way in describing it. I believe the development of this signature jazz sound quite possibly has less to do with any advances in equipment, and more to do with meeting the ever increasing demands of playing the more harmonically demanding brand of jazz (bebop) that evolved over time.

As a rhythm player, it's much easier to cleanly navigate through the labyrinth of chord changes that bebop demands by rolling back the treble. There is much more margin for error, and if you are faced with the prospect of playing 2, 3, or even 4 different chords in a measure, a little "margin" is a good thing. Of course I could be completely wrong about all this!

[Joe G]

I just like the smoothness of having the treble rolled back. It makes it easier to play those lines. And chords.

[AllenLowe]

on the steel thing - well, historically I'm not a real expert on this stuff - I did once have a conversation with Eddie Durham, and he said the early resonator guitars were just, really, made in an effort to be heard above the band. I think the steel body follows this, and has a different kind of resonance from electrics. The early electric guitars strike me as basically just acoustic guitars with pickups stuck on them. As players got more serious and wanted to play louder, they dealt with things like feed back by narrowing the guitar body, than playing solid bodies (some of the smaller hollow bodies are referred to as "semi-hollow" and do, in my brief experience, have a very interesting sound with the right pickups).

Edited March 1, 2005 by AllenLowe

[Guy Berger]

I kinda get what Allen was talking about. I don't think it's a "rock tone" vs. "jazz tone" thing. A lot of people brought up McLaughlin in the 60s/70s vs. McLaughlin in the 90s. Another example that comes to mind is John Abercrombie. You listen to his playing on Gateway and Timeless, that's a beautiful, beautiful sound and it doesn't matter whether he's playing with a jazz sound or whether he's doing that crunchy rock thing. And then compare it to say, Homecoming, and both his "jazz" and "rock" sounds aren't nearly as good.

Guy