Man with the Golden Arm Posted February 20, 2005 Author Report Posted February 20, 2005 not that it makes a bit of difference but i compared the cut "Hard Latin" to a take contained on a Motor Music Mad Soundtracks collection and the version from these mp3s is going at about 38 & 5/8. or maybe the CD is slower? Quote
Bill Nelson Posted February 20, 2005 Report Posted February 20, 2005 'Hard Latin' absolutely CLINCHES that it's Larry Young. Quote
Soul Stream Posted February 20, 2005 Report Posted February 20, 2005 'Hard Latin' absolutely CLINCHES that it's Larry Young. Where are you guys hearing "Hard Latin?" Do you have the LP, or is that available on the web somwhere. The idea that Larry Young plays on this album has got to be news to the Young discography. Quote
couw Posted February 20, 2005 Report Posted February 20, 2005 (edited) Hard Latin Edited February 20, 2005 by couw Quote
Jim Alfredson Posted February 20, 2005 Report Posted February 20, 2005 Hard Latin Wow. That definitely sounds like Larry. I think we have a winner. COOL! Quote
JSngry Posted February 21, 2005 Report Posted February 21, 2005 Hard Latin Wow. That definitely sounds like Larry. I think we have a winner. COOL! Yes to all! Quote
Soul Stream Posted February 21, 2005 Report Posted February 21, 2005 I really like this LP. Every song so far is a winner for me. Love hearing Larry in this context, sort of the Verve larger band stuff we got so much from Jimmy in the 60's. Except, sadly we're not hearing Larry for chorus after chorus. Would to have loved to hear Larry stretch out more on Hard Latin. Great song. Quote
Man with the Golden Arm Posted February 21, 2005 Author Report Posted February 21, 2005 you guys are goood! i was convinced it was Jimmy Smith. now be sure to load up that "New York Sweet". Zorn's 'Spillane' owes this one. it's wack! Quote
Man with the Golden Arm Posted February 21, 2005 Author Report Posted February 21, 2005 I really like this LP. Every song so far is a winner for me. ...and whoever jumps on one of those Mint- LPs and transfers them onto shiny silver has to share! Quote
scottb Posted February 21, 2005 Report Posted February 21, 2005 Forget the organ who is that on trumpet? Miles or Lee Morgan? Quote
scottb Posted February 21, 2005 Report Posted February 21, 2005 (edited) I think it's interesting how you can develop an ear for an instrument and different players' "voices." I can pick a lot of rock / blues guitarist out with just one note many times, jazz guitarists not quite so easily but I knew instantly this guy was NOT Grant. I'm getting better at the organ. I knew it wasn't Jimmy and that is was at least someone playing like Young. I'm getting better with trumpets. Byrd and Hubbard who varied their style a bit more can still trick me. Pianos, if it ain't Monk I'm stumped! Saxes are just as bad. But I keep listening... Edited February 21, 2005 by scottb Quote
Soul Stream Posted February 21, 2005 Report Posted February 21, 2005 I knew instantly this guy was NOT Grant. I wouldn't be so sure. That second song makes me think it might be him. He was in a transition period at this point where his style shifted somewhat. He might have been doing some different things he let go of, especially on that first cut. Of course it might have been someone like a Jimmy Ponder or Melvin Sparks- type who was very influenced by Grant. The guitar solos are so short and non-descript, it's just plain hard to tell. Quote
Guest Chaney Posted February 21, 2005 Report Posted February 21, 2005 (edited) HOLY CRAP! We seem to have lost Mister Buddwing! Now won't THAT be confusing to future readers of this thread! I have no clue on the organist, but here is a nice site on Kenyon Hopkins. Indeed! I thought I'd ask site owner Doug Payne for his input. With his permission... Hi Tony, No one knows anything for sure about these sessions. I’ve asked Universal (who doesn’t have any of the musician credits), Creed Taylor (who doesn’t remember the sessions – which may mean he had nothing whatsoever to do with them, despite the LP sleeve credit) and someone who researched Rudy Van Gelder’s recordings (he says he knows some session was recorded at Englewood Cliffs on those days – but he was unable to confirm it was these sessions). It’s possible that the NYC musician’s union (if there is one???) could have the detail – but I’ve never checked into it. I’ve actually always thought it was BOTH Larry Young (especially on “West Side Radio”) and Jimmy Smith on those sessions – regardless of styles that both were fostering at the time. I think there may have been someone else playing organ too (“Hard Latin” doesn’t sound much like LY, and a little less than usual for JS – but it could be Dick Hyman or Hank Jones, both of whom did a lot of session work for a variety of labels and soundtracks in NYC at the time – same with “Lunch Room”). Both LY and JS were recording for Verve at the time – and it seems likely that both could be on the session(s). I certainly think I recognize Kenny Burrell (and maybe Billy Butler too), Phil Woods and George Duvivier and possibly Grady Tate – however, I have no way to be sure of any of these guesses. Just my two cents – sorry I can’t solve the puzzle…I’ve certainly tried. Sorry it’s not too much help – but thanks for asking. Take care, Doug And opon my asking his permission to posts his comments here... Hi Tony, Sure, feel free to post my message. Guess it’s worth letting people know, though, that at least I checked with some of the people who would know if anyone would. By the way, Creed Taylor had another recording with a similar situation. On A&M, he recorded a group called the “Soul Flutes” with a mysterious person listed on the album jacket as “The Fluteman.” Many people insist this mystery mann is Herbie Mann, who was under contract to Atlantic at the time and had to assume a pseudonym – though he seemed to be free and clear to record an album with Creed several months earlier called “Glory Of Love” (Herbie was loaned out to other labels throughout his tenure at Atlantic in the 1960s). Creed, on the other hand, insists that the mystery man is Hubert Laws, who was also under contract – without loanouts – to Atlantic at the time. Now there may be a reason Creed insists it’s Hubert Laws…Creed and Herbie had a very nasty falling out and Herbie didn’t have too many nice things to say in public about Creed Taylor (which is probably what led him to start his own label, Embryo). That may be Creed’s way of denying the man his due. But, my ears tell me this so-called fluteman could be BOTH Herbie and Hubert. There is certainly more than one sound to the songs where this so-called one person is credited – and Herbie was pretty easy to pick out of a crowd at the time. It’s not so easy on some of these Soul Flute songs. Same with “Mister Buddwing” – truly a great piece of work, with obviously exceptional performances making it the album that it is. Take care, Doug Edited February 21, 2005 by Chaney Quote
Man with the Golden Arm Posted February 21, 2005 Author Report Posted February 21, 2005 HOLY CRAP! We seem to have lost Mister Buddwing! Now won't THAT be confusing to future readers of this thread! Well I guess I started something with only an limited life-span. At least the subject of the thread was the thread killer this time. Some great jazz zluething thus far and when Verve re-issues this we can make it an album of the week. Quote
couw Posted February 21, 2005 Report Posted February 21, 2005 okay folks, go here and download this stuff. Quote
Guest Chaney Posted February 21, 2005 Report Posted February 21, 2005 okay folks, go here and download this stuff. Thanks John! Quote
rostasi Posted February 21, 2005 Report Posted February 21, 2005 okay folks, go here and download this stuff. HOLY COUW JOHN! Thanks a bunch! rod Quote
JSngry Posted February 21, 2005 Report Posted February 21, 2005 Hard Latin What an INTERESTING result this link now produces! "Hard", yes, but hardly Latin! Quote
couw Posted February 21, 2005 Report Posted February 21, 2005 Hard Latin What an INTERESTING result this link now produces! "Hard", yes, but hardly Latin! fegh man, this stuff is pretty ... please help me out here, I cannot quite find the word... Quote
rostasi Posted February 21, 2005 Report Posted February 21, 2005 Hard Latin What an INTERESTING result this link now produces! "Hard", yes, but hardly Latin! WOW! WTF? Quote
couw Posted February 21, 2005 Report Posted February 21, 2005 okay folks, go here and download this stuff. HOLY COUW JOHN! Thanks a bunch! rod eyyyyy! my pleasure. Quote
rostasi Posted February 21, 2005 Report Posted February 21, 2005 your hard drive will be happy! Yeah! I see what you mean! My Hard Drive IS happy! rod Quote
mikeweil Posted February 21, 2005 Report Posted February 21, 2005 I found out that the Buddwing soundtrack was recorded in New York City on November 29, 1965 Don't know whether this is of any help, but Grant Green sole Verve LP with Larry Young was recorded May 26, 1965. Bruyninckx lists two unissued sessions recorded August 5, 1965 and September 1, 1965, but no personnel or tunes. So at least these musicians were associated with Verve at the time. Quote
Man with the Golden Arm Posted February 22, 2005 Author Report Posted February 22, 2005 okay folks, go here and download this stuff. HOLY COUW JOHN! Thanks a bunch! Quote
scottb Posted February 22, 2005 Report Posted February 22, 2005 Thanks Couw, Do you think this soundtrack has ever been listened to by so many people at one time in its history? Quote
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