Ron S Posted February 2, 2005 Author Report Posted February 2, 2005 . . . and even if it is possible, it can be a royal pain. But Brad, I know alternates can be great to have, especially with people like Bird, but I was more curious about these particular alternate takes. E.g., it's possible Pepper's solos vary little from take to take on this particular CD, making listening to 3 or 4 in a row a bit tiresome. Any feelings on that? Quote
Brad Posted February 2, 2005 Report Posted February 2, 2005 (edited) I don't have those Japanese issues so it's hard for me to say but the Select will have very few. Actually, if I had the Savoys I wouldn't mind them. Edited February 2, 2005 by Brad Quote
Late Posted February 2, 2005 Report Posted February 2, 2005 Any feelings on that? Ron — for me, I can live without those alternate takes. This period of Pepper's playing (for me) just doesn't generate the excitement as do later periods. The music is fine, of course, but I don't find myself returning with any specific eagerness to check out the alternates. Instead of sleuthing out the Japanese edition, unless you're a fanatic or completist — which is perfectly allright in my book — I'd save the money and spend it on other recordings. 2¢ Quote
jazzbo Posted February 2, 2005 Report Posted February 2, 2005 Having all the alternates is NOT essential. They do differ from track to track but listening to all these in a row can be tedious. This is among my favorite Pepper however, so I'm glad to have them myself; what I do often with collections like these is program the first alternates to listen to one time, the masters another time, the second alternates the next time, etc. But you may well be served by the one cd from Atlantic/Savoy. Or those two separate older cds, which have slightly better sound (in my opinion at least). Quote
Brad Posted February 2, 2005 Report Posted February 2, 2005 Is it worth the extra money to go out and have these when you can have the US version (which is what I have) and save the money for something else. Probably not. They are, after all, alternate takes of the same song. So I agree with Late and Lon. If the question gets into the philosophy of pro and con on the idea of alternates take in general, I'm definitely on the pro side but I know others feel quite passionately on the con side, and it was either on this board or the BNBB that this very issue generated a lot of passion. Quote
skeith Posted February 2, 2005 Report Posted February 2, 2005 I think McMaster's 2002 remastering work on the Peppers for the Japanese market isn't so bad. I have all three SBJCs, and they sound pretty good to me. Nothing Addey-spectacular, but better than the original 80's U.S. reissues. More tape flaws are surfaced, but the drums (to my ears at least) are presented with more clarity. Some of those Omega tracks, remember, had fairly dubious sound to start off with. (Just my opinion, of course.) Some of the tracks — those with Perkins, for instance — will have perhaps been remastered more recently (2003?), as they weren't included in the Japanese reissues. I agree with Late on this. I thought the McMaster japanese versions were better sonically than the previous US releases. Quote
Son-of-a-Weizen Posted February 2, 2005 Report Posted February 2, 2005 The thought of listening to a series of back-to-back alts totally some 12.3 minutes, while perusing the newspaper and sipping a brew, is Heaven on Earth compared to watching 10 identical Ford, Chevy & Coors ultra-ultra-ultra-ultra-ultra-ultra lite ads crammed into a NFL game. Quote
Ron S Posted February 2, 2005 Author Report Posted February 2, 2005 So I agree with Late and Lon. You mean "jazzbo" is the same as "Lon" on the AAJ Board? I should have known they're couldn't possibly be more than one serious jazz freak in Austin. Quote
Ron S Posted February 2, 2005 Author Report Posted February 2, 2005 But you may well be served by the one cd from Atlantic/Savoy. Or those two separate older cds, which have slightly better sound (in my opinion at least). Are we all agreed that the 2 older CD issues ("Surf Rides" and "Two Altos") have better sound than the later "Discovery Sessions"? If so, I may end up with that bitchin' "Surf Rides" cover after all. Quote
jazzbo Posted February 2, 2005 Report Posted February 2, 2005 Ron, yes I'm that Lon (that spent years 2 to 11 in Philly!) from the BN Board. What? All of us agree on the sound of a cd? Not bloody likely! I do confess that I MYSELF however prefer by an edge the sound of the Savoy Denon series to those by Atlantic/Savoy. Personal preferrences, system differences etc. make that just my choice. Quote
Late Posted February 2, 2005 Report Posted February 2, 2005 Ron — if you can find them, I'd go for the Denons. (The ones with the yellow print on purple background for the spines.) That's a great series. Whenever I see that yellow-on-purple at a record store, I always do a double-take, and then check to see if I already have it. If you ever see Ronnie Ball's Savoy/Denon reissue, snag it! It's a good one. Quote
Ron S Posted February 3, 2005 Author Report Posted February 3, 2005 Ron, yes I'm that Lon (that spent years 2 to 11 in Philly!) from the BN Board. Then we're even, Lon (sort of)--I spent years 20 to 23 in Austin. B-) Quote
Ron S Posted February 3, 2005 Author Report Posted February 3, 2005 Just to make sure we really beat the crap out of this poor dead horse I'd like to make sure we're all talking about the same CD's. The later Savoy "Discovery Sessions" CD, which I think is the one Lon calls the Atlantic/Savoy CD (BTW, why?), is this one. And the so-called Savoy Denon CD's are this one and this one. Notice the negative comments on AMG about "Surf Ride" and the positive comments about the sound on "Discovery Sessions." Damn, this is confusing. Quote
jazzbo Posted February 3, 2005 Report Posted February 3, 2005 I call it the Atlantic/Savoy because it is an Atlantic distributed and parent copy Savoy reissue. . . . Don't mistake me, the sound on this one is fine, I just happen to like the remastering of the Japanese Denon engineers a bit more than that of Paul Reid III for Atlantic/Savoy. . . . Quote
Brad Posted February 3, 2005 Report Posted February 3, 2005 Just to make sure we really beat the crap out of this poor dead horse I'd like to make sure we're all talking about the same CD's. The later Savoy "Discovery Sessions" CD, which I think is the one Lon calls the Atlantic/Savoy CD (BTW, why?), is this one. And the so-called Savoy Denon CD's are this one and this one. Notice the negative comments on AMG about "Surf Ride" and the positive comments about the sound on "Discovery Sessions." Damn, this is confusing. You're killin' us (or trying to run up your post count). Get the bloody thing already or we'll be forced to take severe action :rsmile: Quote
Son-of-a-Weizen Posted February 3, 2005 Report Posted February 3, 2005 (edited) Live dangerously......get the Japanese 2-cd jobber w/all the alt. takes and be done with it. Don't make Brad mad. I wonder how long disc 9 on that forthcoming Stones "Singles 1968-71" box set will be? DISC 9: 1. Sympathy For The Devil 2. Sympathy For The Devil 3. Sympathy For The Devil 4. Sympathy For The Devil Edited February 3, 2005 by Son-of-a-Weizen Quote
Brad Posted February 3, 2005 Report Posted February 3, 2005 Live dangerously......get the Japanese 2-cd jobber w/all the alt. takes and be done with it. Don't make Brad mad. I wonder how long disc 9 on that forthcoming Stones "Singles 1968-71" box set will be? DISC 9: 1. Sympathy For The Devil 2. Sympathy For The Devil 3. Sympathy For The Devil 4. Sympathy For The Devil While you're at it, get both and then compare Quote
Ron S Posted February 3, 2005 Author Report Posted February 3, 2005 While you're at it, get both and then compare Why don't you just SEND me both and then I'll compare. Quote
Guest Chaney Posted February 10, 2005 Report Posted February 10, 2005 Looks like Pepper will soon be on its way: We are in receipt of your Mosaic Records/True Blue Music order for which we thank you very much. The following items will ship within the next 24 hours: Item Qty Qty Qty Expected Number Description Ord. Shp. Bck. By ---------- ------------------------------ -------- -------- -------- ------- - MS-015 MOSAIC SELECT- ART PEPPER 2.00 2.00 0.00 If any items are currently out of stock, they are listed below and back ordered items usually ship in 1 -2 weeks: Item Qty Qty Qty Expected Number Description Ord. Shp. Bck. By ---------- ------------------------------ -------- -------- -------- ------- - Thank you once again. Regards, Mosaic Records Quote
jazzbo Posted February 10, 2005 Report Posted February 10, 2005 Whoo woo! I ended up ordering this too. . . I don't quite have all the stuff. Rationalization #3 C, paragraph 2, item a. Quote
Ron S Posted February 10, 2005 Author Report Posted February 10, 2005 Whoo woo! I ended up ordering this too. . . I don't quite have all the stuff. Rationalization #3 C, paragraph 2, item a. That's some catch, that Catch-22. Quote
Ron S Posted February 10, 2005 Author Report Posted February 10, 2005 MS-015 MOSAIC SELECT- ART PEPPER 2.00 2.00 0.00 Hey, they're sending you TWO! One of those is MINE! Quote
Guest Chaney Posted February 11, 2005 Report Posted February 11, 2005 MS-015 MOSAIC SELECT- ART PEPPER 2.00 2.00 0.00 Hey, they're sending you TWO! One of those is MINE! Quote
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