Name some Blue Note cds you find overrated

[chris olivarez]

Are you referring to STANDARDS, released in '98? I kinda dig those sessions, even if, for the most part, they are more laid back than a typical Jimmy Smith session. Gotta love Kenny Burrell on these sides....

That could be the one and I apologize if I came off as harsh.No session with Jimmy Smith and Kenny Burrell is a waste-it just didn't do it for me. Honest differences of opinion seem to be the theme of this thread and that's cool. B)

[Ed S]

This has been one of the most interesting threads I've seen about Blue Note in a while. The fact that boardmembers are 'fessin' up and naming some of their least favorite BN recordings - many of them considered classics - and no arguments have broken out and no personal attacks have occurred makes it one of the best

That said, this thread is making me dizzy

[shawn·m]

Go isn't one of my favorites either. Dex spends too much effort chiseling his notes and the result sounds stilted. Yeah Ok, I'll give Thinking of Home yet another kidney punch. I guess times were changing and so was the music... but what a static, flacid stinker. Somehow I expected more from The Waiting Game, but on the other hand I enjoy Minor Move far more than I expected. All IMO, of course.

[Clunky]

A.T's Delight. is great, Dave Burns is interesting and although its nothing out of this world it's a worthy BN date.

I find some of Horace Silvers dates a bit tiresome, things like "Silvers Serenade" and "Tokyo Blues". His style was pretty repetitive and too many of his originals are too similar. It's probably more a phenomena of being recorded extensively rather than artistic stagnation. I do play these disc but only a few tracks at a time. Sides such as "Finger Poppin" and "Song for my father" , "Jody Grind" seem much fresher by comparison.

[Dave James]

Chris,

I think the "ballad heavy" Jimmy Smith you're referring to may be "Jimmy Smith Plays Pretty Just For You". I have this one. Not a good date. Sounds very harsh to my ears, although the tune selection is fine. "Cherokee" is another Smith date I can live without.

Although I have the Smith Mosaic, that's one that doesn't see the light of day very often. I realize that's probably as close to Blue Note blasphemy as one can safely come, but I just can't get into this one.

I am a fan of "Standards". Great Burrell.

Up over and out.

[Brad]

Folks,

In no special order, here's a list of some of the cds you all don't like, some of them apparently classics:

Blue Train

Something Else

Cool Struttin'

Page One

Undercurrent

Una Mas

Whistle Stop

Go

Stop and Listen

Open House/Plain Talk

LD + 3

Star Bright

Some of you also don't care for Herbie Nichols, Baby Face, George Braith, Jimmy Smith and probably a few others. I think somebody mentioned Hank Mobley, but I may be wrong about this.

This happens to be in my opinion a great bunch of recordings and artists, whether or not I find everyone to my taste.

I may not find all of George Braith's recordings to my taste but so what. That doesn't mean he didn't make a contribution (significant or otherwise) to the Blue Note catalogue. Soul Stream likes him as do others so that's enough.

Some of you think Go is smooth (I know, not Kenny G style) or he's trying too hard or whatever. That's nice. Maybe we're forgetting the Pres influence there. I think it's a classic and so did Dex. Must be something when the artist thinks that. But then again maybe not.

Look I know this was a thread to express what you like or didn't so we (including me) did. Fortunately, our opinions don't mean a hell of a lot. It's a big world and you can't please everybody with everything.

Thank goodness Alfred and Frank had a vision of what they wanted to record and that they did so.

[catesta]

Catesta, I still struggle with those two as well. They're probably not overrated, but I don't get pleasure out of listening to them.

Thanks Lon, I thought it was just in my ears.

[Soul Stream]

I have all the Jimmy Smith, and I have to say Open House/Plain Talk is the least played. I never dug it much either.

Funny how time changes things. I dug up this old thread and saw many things I wrote at the time and I've reversed myself. Open House/Plain Talk has grown into one of my favorite J. Smith Blue Notes.

[MagicAlex61]

I have to say that almost all of the "classic" BN output is above average and I have enjoyed them all in one context or another. The only one that I can think of that really turned me off was Jimmy Smith's PLAYS PRETTY FOR YOU.

Anyone else agree with that?

[clifford_thornton]

Maybe I posted on this thread before, I don't know and am too lazy to look.

I'll say the only BNs that I haven't kept were Hutcherson's Total Eclipse and a bunch of Jimmy Smiths. Everything else I've held onto, provided the vinyl wasn't wasted or whatever.

[JSngry]

I have all the Jimmy Smith, and I have to say Open House/Plain Talk is the least played. I never dug it much either.

Funny how time changes things. I dug up this old thread and saw many things I wrote at the time and I've reversed myself. Open House/Plain Talk has grown into one of my favorite J. Smith Blue Notes.

Two words, dudes - Ike Quebec.

[AndrewHill]

Some 'classic era' dates that never did it for me:

Lush Life-too many ballads, and what a shame not to do so much more with a cast like that

Rough and Tumble -dull and boring as some have said above

I'm Movin' On-no one seems really inspired on this one to me

Blue Hour-put me to sleep

Horace Scope-like some other Silver dates, just all start to sound the same to me-Jody Grind on the other hand, is an all together different affair!

[BruceH]

I usually find what I don't like today....I can't live without at some point in the future.

Man, you said it!!! Not always true, but often enough to give one pause...

[sal]

What fun its been revisiting this thread! And I still think "Page One" ain't all that...

[Son-of-a-Weizen]

I'm replacing LD+3 with Adam's Apple.

[JETman]

Alot of Jimmy Smith, including Plays Fats Waller released earlier this month. I find it to be one of the most boring Blue Notes I have in my collection.

[king ubu]

Yes, Smith did a few too many, I guess... some are terrific (Groovin' at Smalls, Crazy Baby), some are good to great (all the sessions with horns I've heard, maybe with the exception of "Rockin' the Boat" which I'd rate as fine, but not great), but some are quite lacklustre (Movin On and the other one done just a day before or after, with Quentin Warren in Grant Green's place - or is Movin' on the one with Warren? Either way the one with Green doesn't do much for me). One I'd not rate as highly as many here seem to is "Home Cookin'". And also "Prayer Meetin'" never did much for me, which is weird since I love "Back at the Chicken Shack" and like "Midnight Special" quite some, too (but not as mcuh as "Back at.." which happened to be among my first ten jazz CDs).

[mikeweil]

I, too think, that quite a few of Jimmy Smith's Blue Notes (and perhaps some later recordings) suffer from "controllitis" - it all sounds to me as if he was after something he never quite achieved, contrary to my favourite competitor, Don Patterson, who always sounds perfectly at home in the respective setting.

Listening to all of those Blue Note hard bop dates can easily become too much of a good thing. That's why I reduced my collection to those that I consider essential - but I wouldn't call the others overrated. There are some that I think one can live without, like Sonny Clark's first quintet date, which I find uninspired, some of the Jimmy Smiths, but this is a purely subjective matter.

[mikeweil]

I bought Smoke Stack and Black Fire expressly to 'get' Andrew Hill, and it didn't work. Others I think are OK but don't love:

Maiden Voyage

The Sidewinder

Minor Move

The Sermon

Gravy Train (come to think of it, I find Lou Donaldson slightly boring)

Interesting selection - and I tend to agree on some of these:

- Minor Move: I wouldn't have dared to mention one of those rare Tina Brooks dates - but RVG marred the sound by recording the ride cymbal too closely, and obviously they all wanted to show the shy and fledgling Brooks where the hammer hangs;

- The Sermon: that stuff takes off much better when listened to in recording order; in general I think the great Smith/Turrentine pairing never was exploited to its full potential die to Smith's "controllitis";

- The Sidewinder: most of these dates with a boogaloo tune sound a little too much like they were after a hit;

- Maiden Voyage: well, Herbie to me always sounds more relaxed and chance-taking on other people's dates;

- Lou Donaldson you either like or not;

- Andrew Hill, so it sounds to me, took recording dates as a forum for experimentation, and not all of them yield great results, although all are interesting.

Edited September 27, 2008 by mikeweil

[king ubu]

which is Clark's first quintet date - not "cool struttin'" I hope?!

[mikeweil]

which is Clark's first quintet date - not "cool struttin'" I hope?!

No - it's "Dial 'S' for Sonny" I was talking about. Somehow it doesn't jell ... it may sound heretic, but to me the top Sonny Clark album is the trio date on Time Records!

[BillF]

- The Sidewinder: most of these dates with a boogaloo tune sound a little too much like they were after a hit;

Yes, but that's only one out of five or six marvelous tracks! Rightly regarded as a classic, IMHO.

[mikeweil]

- The Sidewinder: most of these dates with a boogaloo tune sound a little too much like they were after a hit;

Yes, but that's only one out of five or six marvelous tracks! Rightly regarded as a classic, IMHO.

Agreed. If you compare how much more groovy Eddie Harris' hit tunes are, which are the model for these, at least to my ears ... The Sidewinder is the best, but e.g. Caramba is like a soft core version of Listen Here incl. the piano vamp.

[king ubu]

which is Clark's first quintet date - not "cool struttin'" I hope?!

No - it's "Dial 'S' for Sonny" I was talking about. Somehow it doesn't jell ... it may sound heretic, but to me the top Sonny Clark album is the trio date on Time Records!

Ah, I see... but that one's a sextet, with Fuller on trombone in addition to Mobley and Farmer (and Ware, Hayes). I would have been quite amazed to see "Cool Struttin'" in this thread (well, maybe it's been mentioned above, I didn't re-read it all).

The Time trio is the last Clark I got (I still miss the Uptown though), and hm, it's fine, but the BN "Sonny Clark Trio" is likely my top Clark, with Chambers/Philly Joe doing a terrific job. The "Standards" disc on the other hand never did much for me.

As for Lee Morgan... I love some of his albums (including "Rumproller", which is one of the typical "Sidewinder" re-trials), but while I have all or most, I'm not sure I can even tell them all apart... "Sidewinder" I love, though (also "Search for the New Land", but that's likely his most atypical album anyway, and then "The Procrastinator"!)

[Dan Gould]

Funny but I am far more inclined to listen to any Jimmy Smith BN record with horns ahead of the straight trio recordings, and wouldn't overrate any of them. I definitely agree on the Movin' On disc and the Fats Waller. Nothing special. Glad I heard the Waller one long ago and didn't have any need to revisit it when it was reissued this year.