Miles Davis-Rated X: A serious question...

[mjzee]

Guy, thanks for that exerpt from the Paul Tingen book; it was very interesting. In terms of the sonic quality of Rated X (and pretty much the entire "Get Up With It" lp), I think a lot has to do with the technical limitations of vinyl. Each side of "Get Up With It" approaches or exceeds 30 minutes, which is way beyond what was generally thought to be the maximum time to put on a side to preserve sonic excellence (Frank Zappa thought it was 18 minutes a side). Once you start exceeding 22 minutes or so, you have to start making compromises (unless there are enough quiet passages on the side so that the grooves can be thinner there, allowing more space for the louder passages, which isn't the case on "Get Up With It"). I kinda thought that Miles and Teo were perversely pushing the envelope, and actually degrading the sound quality, whether with compression or whatever, to contribute to the overall impact of the music.

In short, I think one reason "Rated X" has such an impact is because of the murky sound quality - it really makes you strain your ears, asking "What's going on in there?" Other examples of these sonic games on "GUWI" include odd uses of echo (why so much echo on the organ, for example?) and extreme tape hiss (think of the break between the first and second sections of "Maiysha").

There were other such interesting sonic experiments with vinyl going on at that time. One example that jumps out is Lou Reed's "Metal Machine Music." Each side was exactly 16:01 (why?), except for side 4 which had no lead-out groove so it was either 16:01 or infinity, and the sound was extremely impenetrable, which made it sort of enjoyable.

[Guy Berger]

The big minus to me about this band (which, I'll agree, gets trashed unfairly sometimes) is that aside from Miles there aren't any really interesting soloists, just interesting textures.

I'll posit that having interesting soloists was not what that band and thatmusic was all about anyway. It was very much a group music, with the intent being to create a collective rhythmic organism, with overt soloing serving as an ornament, not as the tree.

Totally agree, but I think the advantage of the band with Cosey & Liebman (Fortune later) was that it combined the textural thing (which actually got a lot more advanced as time progressed) with interesting soloists. Whereas the '72 band only works on the textural level.

Guy

[JSngry]

Gotcha'. Agreed.

[dave9199]

I really like the unedited version of Shhh/Peaceful rather than the originally released version. It flows better.

[Guest youmustbe]

I was reminded reading this thread about the Eno comments on Miles that drove people on the old BN board maybe some of the same folks as on this board, mad.

Something to the effect that people don't like music made by Miles. They like Miles making music, i.e., they have a preconceived image of Miles and that's what they bring and hear, not the music itself.

I guess the chicken or the egg theory in Art.

[l p]

from what i remember, there is no trumpet on the studio version of rated x.

[David Ayers]

I haven't heard the CD of this album and I probably wouldn't care to. The CD remasters of many Miles LPs destroy much of the ambience with excessive brightness, as far as I am concerned. Get Up With It is a really moody album, and the (relative) murkiness of the proceedings is a big part of that.

Was Red China Blues really released as a single? Did it get to number one?

Edited January 24, 2005 by David Ayers

[sidewinder]

I think I recall hearing/reading somwhere that on one of Paul Buckmaster's visits to Miles in NYC he was in the studio recording 'Red China Blues' to the Wade Marcus backing track, after something of a layoff (Ferarri car crash recovery?)

[dave9199]

I think I recall hearing/reading somwhere that on one of Paul Buckmaster's visits to Miles in NYC he was in the studio recording 'Red China Blues' to the Wade Marcus backing track, after something of a layoff (Ferarri car crash recovery?)

It was around the time of one of his car crashes. And I don't think it charted very well, if at all, but I don't really know, that's just a hunch.

[Guy Berger]

I haven't heard the CD of this album and I probably wouldn't care to. The CD remasters of many Miles LPs destroy much of the ambience with excessive brightness, as far as I am concerned. Get Up With It is a really moody album, and the (relative) murkiness of the proceedings is a big part of that.

Was Red China Blues really released as a single? Did it get to number one?

I think Miles released several singles during the 70s. There's even a single edit of "Spanish Key".

Guy

[David Ayers]

There's even a single edit of "Spanish Key".

Wow...

[dave9199]

I got the Laswell cd. I'll have to listen to it some more, but there's a song on there called What If. Anyone know where this comes from?

[Brandon Burke]

I haven't heard the CD of this album and I probably wouldn't care to. The CD remasters of many Miles LPs destroy much of the ambience with excessive brightness, as far as I am concerned. Get Up With It is a really moody album, and the (relative) murkiness of the proceedings is a big part of that.

Agreed.

[Guy Berger]

I got the Laswell cd. I'll have to listen to it some more, but there's a song on there called What If. Anyone know where this comes from?

It's never been released outside of Panthalassa. IIRC Laswell found the tune (recorded on June 2, 1972) and asked something along the lines of "What if the guitarist is Pete Cosey?" (In reality it's John McLaughlin.) Hence the title.

Losin's discography says:

June 2, 1972 (1 item; TT = 7:17)

Columbia Studio, New York NY

Commercial for Columbia

Miles Davis Studio Group

Miles Davis (tpt); Carlos Garnett (ts); Chick Corea (synth); Herbie Hancock (org); Harold I. Williams (el-p); John McLaughlin (g); David Creamer (g); Collin Walcott (sitar); Michael Henderson (el-b); Jack DeJohnette (d); Jabali Billy Hart (d, perc, bgo); Charles Don Alias (cga, perc); Badal Roy (tabla)

What If (M. Davis-B. Laswell) 7:17

What If

12" LP: Columbia CK 67909

CD: Columbia CK 67909; Sony SRCS 8457

This music appears on Bill Laswell's Panthalassa but is otherwise unissued.

According to Paul Tingen and Enrico Merlin, the pre-Laswell music was probably recorded during the June 1 session and completed during an overdub session scheduled for June 2.

Guy