Chrome Posted January 14, 2005 Report Share Posted January 14, 2005 Calif. schoolers told stripping can be lucrative Management consultant tells eighth-graders money to be made as an exotic dancer The Associated Press Updated: 10:25 a.m. ET Jan. 14, 2005SAN FRANCISCO - The principal of a Palo Alto middle school may not invite a popular speaker back to an annual career day after he told girls they could earn a good living as strippers. Management consultant William Fried told eighth-graders at Jane Lathrop Stanford Middle School on Tuesday that stripping and exotic dancing can pay $250,000 or more per year, depending on their bust size. “It’s sick, but it’s true,” Fried said in an interview later. “The truth of the matter is you can earn a tremendous amount of money as an exotic dancer, if that’s your desire.” Fried has given a popular 55-minute presentation, “The Secret of a Happy Life,” at the school’s career day the past three years. He counsels students to experiment with a variety of interests until they discover something they love and excel in. But school principal Joseph Di Salvo said Fried may not be back next year. The principal said Fried’s comments to the class came after some of them asked him to expand on why he included “exotic dancing” on his list of 140 potential careers. Fried spent about a minute answering questions, defining strippers and exotic dancers synonymously. According to Jason Garcia, 14, he told students: “For every 2 inches up there, you should get another $50,000 on your salary.” “A couple of students egged him and he took it hook, line and sinker,” said Di Salvo, who also said the students took advantage of a substitute teacher overseeing the session. “It’s totally inappropriate,” Di Salvo said. “It’s not OK by me. I would want my presenters to kind of understand that they are coming into a career day for eighth-graders.” That stripping advice wasn’t the only thing that riled parents. Di Salvo said one mother said she was outraged when her son announced that he was forgoing college for a field he loves: fishing. “He really focused on finding what you really love to do,” said Mariah Cannon, 13. Fried, 64, said he does not think he offended any of the students: “Eighth-grade kids are not dumb,” he said. “They are pretty worldly.” Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maren Posted January 14, 2005 Report Share Posted January 14, 2005 Fried spent about a minute answering questions, defining strippers and exotic dancers synonymously. According to Jason Garcia, 14, he told students: “For every 2 inches up there, you should get another $50,000 on your salary.” Nice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted January 14, 2005 Report Share Posted January 14, 2005 Can we be sure that this wasn't Dan Ackroyd reprising that SNL character of his? Buzz whathisname? Was Lorraine Newman there, too? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catesta Posted January 14, 2005 Report Share Posted January 14, 2005 Management consultant William Fried told eighth-graders at Jane Lathrop Stanford Middle School on Tuesday that stripping and exotic dancing can pay $250,000 or more per year, depending on their bust size. “It’s sick, but it’s true,” Fried said in an interview later. “The truth of the matter is you can earn a tremendous amount of money as an exotic dancer, if that’s your desire.” Sounds like this guy is spending too much time in the strip clubs and buying all the hype. What a crock of shit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maren Posted January 14, 2005 Report Share Posted January 14, 2005 The school's namesake must be rolling in her proverbial grave: Jane Lathrop Stanford (1825-1905) Although somewhat overshadowed by her husband Leland's grand accomplishments, Jane Lathrop Stanford made many significant contributions to the Palo Alto area in her own quiet way. After the death of their only child, 15-year-old Leland Jr., from typhoid fever while the family was traveling in Europe in 1884, Mrs. Stanford joined her husband in devising the detailed plans for the $20 million university that was to be built in their son's memory. While their dream of creating a complete education system from kindergarten up never fully materialized, Mrs. Stanford sponsored free kindergartens in Mayfield and Menlo Park as well as a school for young workers at the Stanford's championship horse stables known as the Palo Alto Stock Farm. Later, she would have a grammar school built on the university campus. Although the Stanfords supported prohibition to maintain a respectable environment on and around the university, neither was a teetotaler. In fact, they served alcohol to their guests and even owned large vineyards, wineries and brandy stills. In 1893, two years after the founding grant for Leland Stanford Jr. University was signed, Leland Stanford died, leaving his business affairs in turmoil and the viability of the university in question. His widow surprised nearly everyone when she resolved these financial dilemmas with skill and tenacity. Jane Stanford is widely credited with saving Stanford University from collapse. She also made one of the most important early contributions to women's rights by opening Stanford's doors to female students despite fierce criticism. --Peter Gauvin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randy Twizzle Posted January 14, 2005 Report Share Posted January 14, 2005 Can we be sure that this wasn't Dan Ackroyd reprising that SNL character of his? Buzz whathisname? Was Lorraine Newman there, too? E Buzz Miller and Lorraine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danasgoodstuff Posted January 15, 2005 Report Share Posted January 15, 2005 Maybe they should get a forty year old stripper with substance issues who lost custody of her kids to give them a more realistic view. The vast majority of strippers, etc. just don't make that big money. Doing what you love is a good goal, but there's more to it than just finding what you love... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ariceffron Posted January 15, 2005 Report Share Posted January 15, 2005 id throw down a 20 spot for an 8th grade lap dance- but theyd have to open an liqour-free club.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSngry Posted January 15, 2005 Report Share Posted January 15, 2005 Across the street from the jail would be a good place to put it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Wheel Posted January 15, 2005 Report Share Posted January 15, 2005 Maybe they should get a forty year old stripper with substance issues who lost custody of her kids to give them a more realistic view. The vast majority of strippers, etc. just don't make that big money. Doing what you love is a good goal, but there's more to it than just finding what you love... They may not all make a quarter million, but every story I've heard about girls stripping in Miami starts with "it was an easy way to put herself through college." With tuition through the roof, it sounds like a stripper can pay for 4 years of a $25000/year college with only a couple of years of stripping. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brownie Posted January 15, 2005 Report Share Posted January 15, 2005 In which grade are the girls being advised to try the oldest profession Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
connoisseur series500 Posted January 15, 2005 Report Share Posted January 15, 2005 I don't have a daughter, and I'd certainly be worried if one were to seek a stripping career for a period of time. But the $$$ to be made. The problem has to do with the mindframe necessary to untertake such an occupation. One would imagine that it could be indicative of other worrisome tendencies. If a girl goes into stripping then her resistance to going farther into related ventures such as prostitution might be lessened. That would be my greatest fear as a parent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
connoisseur series500 Posted January 15, 2005 Report Share Posted January 15, 2005 Now if public perception were modified and stripping becomes viewed as a legitimate and accepted career alternative, then it would be a great idea; and that counselor would be correct. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexander Posted January 15, 2005 Report Share Posted January 15, 2005 Being a Marxist, I can't help seeing things in terms of power. The fact that strippers may or may not be well-paid is beside the point. The point is that displaying one's naked flesh for money is an act of desparation and degradation. Individuals who strip are being exploited, no matter how good the pay. How much money is dignity worth? What about self-respect? It's not that a naked body is shameful, far from it. Our puritanical culture has, paradoxically, increased the monitary worth of naked flesh by covering it up. I've actually visited a strip club on a couple of occasions. In the first couple of cases it was because I was young and with friends who wanted to go there, but on the third and most recent occasion, it was simply to see what the big deal was about. Well, I don't know about other men, but I didn't find the experience erotic at all. In fact, it was quite the opposite. To see a woman put her self on display for a group of shabby looking men (none of whom looked all that interested in the first place) was really quite disgusting. A line from Alan Moore kept running through my head the whole time (about 15 minutes) I was there: "This is the only dance that's ever been going on. Pussy dance. Money dance. Poverty dance. Need dance." It was the first time I'd been in such a place in over ten years, and I feel no need to do it again... Anyway, yes it was extremely inappropriate to discuss such a thing with 8th graders. Point of fact, it would be equally inappropriate to discuss such things with 12th graders or even college students. Stripping isn't a profession. It's a last resort before homelessness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Gould Posted January 15, 2005 Report Share Posted January 15, 2005 Being a Marxist, I can't help seeing things in terms of power. The fact that strippers may or may not be well-paid is beside the point. The point is that displaying one's naked flesh for money is an act of desparation and degradation. Individuals who strip are being exploited, no matter how good the pay. How much money is dignity worth? What about self-respect? It's not that a naked body is shameful, far from it. Our puritanical culture has, paradoxically, increased the monitary worth of naked flesh by covering it up. I've actually visited a strip club on a couple of occasions. In the first couple of cases it was because I was young and with friends who wanted to go there, but on the third and most recent occasion, it was simply to see what the big deal was about. Well, I don't know about other men, but I didn't find the experience erotic at all. In fact, it was quite the opposite. To see a woman put her self on display for a group of shabby looking men (none of whom looked all that interested in the first place) was really quite disgusting. A line from Alan Moore kept running through my head the whole time (about 15 minutes) I was there: "This is the only dance that's ever been going on. Pussy dance. Money dance. Poverty dance. Need dance." It was the first time I'd been in such a place in over ten years, and I feel no need to do it again... Anyway, yes it was extremely inappropriate to discuss such a thing with 8th graders. Point of fact, it would be equally inappropriate to discuss such things with 12th graders or even college students. Stripping isn't a profession. It's a last resort before homelessness. That's really weak and a crock of shit, Alexander. And really, I had no idea that Marx and Engels gave marxist interpretation of erotic dance. But the most ridiculous statement you've made is this: Point of fact, it would be equally inappropriate to discuss such things with 12th graders or even college students. Stripping isn't a profession. It's a last resort before homelessness. This is such a crock its a joke. There are so many middle class women stripping ... do you think anyone believes its a "last resort before homelessness?" Give me a f-ing break. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Gould Posted January 15, 2005 Report Share Posted January 15, 2005 To be clear, I am not saying that stripping is never a last resort to homelessness. But to imply that every, or even a majority, of strippers are doing it due to extreme poverty is ridiculous. So, Alex, care to give us the Marxist interpretation of women who are adult film performers? I'm sure the marxist interpretion is fascinating. But you have to admit, its a unique industry, considering that women get paid thousands of dollars per week (or scene) but the poor men only get a few hundred dollars per money shot. Talk about being exploited! Those "stunt cocks" have to perform through multiple camera set-ups, with dozens of people watching, hot lights all around, and maintain their, shall we say, self-control, all for a few hundred dollars. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ariceffron Posted January 15, 2005 Report Share Posted January 15, 2005 YOURE A MARXIST?>!?! HOW OLD ARE YOU ANYWAY. IF YOURE BELOW THE AGE OF 70 YOURE AN IDIOT. IF YOU ARE OVER 70, I MIGHT BE ABLE TO SEE WHERE YOU COME FROM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
connoisseur series500 Posted January 15, 2005 Report Share Posted January 15, 2005 IF YOURE BELOW THE AGE OF 70 YOURE AN IDIOT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Fenohr Posted January 15, 2005 Report Share Posted January 15, 2005 Am i the only one here that actually knows an exotic dancer or stripper or whatever you want to call them. I have a friend here in town who did it for 22 years. She started at 18 and did put herself though college, receiving a degree in finance. She told me that she went on a few job interviews after she got her degree, but reolized she was making three or four times the money that these firms wanted to pay her. So she kept dancing. She told me right from the beginning she was smart enough to know that someday her boobs were going to start to sag and it would be over, so she invested her earnings in the stock market,CD's, T Bills etc. She retired at age 40 owning free and clear a house in one of the nicer sections (read that to mean expensive) of town and has no money worries for the rest of her life. She had a plan, worked it like a professinal and is now enjoying the rewards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
connoisseur series500 Posted January 15, 2005 Report Share Posted January 15, 2005 Interessting story. Nice to see it work out for someone. What was her social and family life like? Was it stable? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maren Posted January 15, 2005 Report Share Posted January 15, 2005 I know a number of women who have worked as strippers/go-go dancers. Also some in various other levels of the sex industry. Quite varied family backgrounds and results. I'm not judging the women who make money this way, but I think NONE of them would want some CEO type guy recommending it as the obvious career path to their 12-year-old daughters! (The power issue particularly applies to this GUY -- apparently he doesn't want these girls growing up to be management types who compete directly for his job! He'd prefer to patronize them as dancers, however lucratively!) One friend in particular earned a lot of money dancing, while at the same time commenting on the "profession" as a performance artist (one striking show of hers was called "Go-Go Girls Seize Control"). She also used the money to put her daughter through a private school that sheltered kids from mass culture... Quite Marxist of her (and I mean that in a GOOD way), to recognize and exploit the contradictions like that!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexander Posted January 15, 2005 Report Share Posted January 15, 2005 (edited) Exploitation is exploitation, pure and simple. Justify it however you like, but the fact is that sex performers are exploited horribly regardless of the industry (porn, stripping, etc.). I know you have some experience in the phone sex industry, Dan. You can't tell me that there was no exploitation going on there. When I was in grad school (getting my Master's in English), as a matter of fact, I worked as a graduate assistant to a professor who was writing a book on porn. I participated in several interviews with both actors and actresses who worked (or were still working) in the adult film industry, and I can tell you, these weren't bedtime stories. Most of not all of these people (men and women alike) came from backgrounds of abuse (sexual and otherwise). Many told hair raising stories of rape, drug addiction, extortion and worse. This went for men and women alike. Yes, I know that women generally make more money then men in adult films, but the MOST money is made by the producers who are the ones making money off of the misery of others. As a Marxist (and no, Marx didn't write about stripping and/or porn films per se, although he did address prostitution) my beef isn't with the morality of porn or stripping, but with the abuses of power and the havock it creates in the lives of those who are exploited. If a strip club were owned and operated by the women who stripped there (the workers own the means of production), I would have no objection to it. But you and I both know that if that ever happens, it is extremely rare. I do have some objection to the commidfication of sex and the objectification of women, however, but that's a subject for another discussion. Are there happy, well-adjusted porn stars? I'm sure there are. But the majority of the ones I came in contact with were not among them. BTW, I do know a stripper. I went to high school with a woman who wound up stripping to pay for school. She's not doing it now, and while she has few regrets about doing it, she does worry about what she's going to tell her kids about it in the future... Edited January 15, 2005 by Alexander Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ariceffron Posted January 15, 2005 Report Share Posted January 15, 2005 I WENT TO A SEEDY AMERICAN STRIPJOINT FOR THE 1ST TIME RECENTLY, WITH THE INTENT OF HAVING ONE OF THEM LAPDANCE DEALIES, BUT THEN AFTER 5 MIN. IN THERE I CAME BACK TO MY SENSES AND DECIDED ID RATHER GO GET SOME ROLLED TACOS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Red Menace Posted January 15, 2005 Report Share Posted January 15, 2005 Amazing!!! Such powers of invention!!! Such unflagging creative energy!!! When will he make his debut on American late-night??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Red Menace Posted January 15, 2005 Report Share Posted January 15, 2005 (edited) IF YOURE BELOW THE AGE OF 70 YOURE AN IDIOT. As I am now 87 years old, I fathom I make the "cut," as you Americans like to say!!! Edited January 15, 2005 by The Red Menace Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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