Drum Solo Vocalese

[king ubu]

that bols stuff, is that something like  this?

yup, that's it.

was this too amateurish and annoying for the King as well?

only listened to the first few seconds...

Those words to describe the rhythms (i.e. Teental), they relate to the number and subdivision of beats, if I remember right. It's looong back that I was a bit into this kind of things, though (ok, it can't be more than 7 years, but then those years have been so eventful it seems like decades...)

[couw]

that bols stuff, is that something like  this?

yup, that's it.

was this too amateurish and annoying for the King as well?

only listened to the first few seconds...

and then you hurried back to that crazy Korean site, right?

[king ubu]

that bols stuff, is that something like  this?

yup, that's it.

was this too amateurish and annoying for the King as well?

only listened to the first few seconds...

and then you hurried back to that crazy Korean site, right?

exaclty, to listen to the Carmen ouverture, sung in Korean

[7/4]

Those words to describe the rhythms (i.e. Teental), they relate to the number and subdivision of beats, if I remember right. It's looong back that I was a bit into this kind of things, though (ok, it can't be more than 7 years, but then those years have been so eventful it seems like decades...)

That's right.

[king ubu]

Those words to describe the rhythms (i.e. Teental), they relate to the number and subdivision of beats, if I remember right. It's looong back that I was a bit into this kind of things, though (ok, it can't be more than 7 years, but then those years have been so eventful it seems like decades...)

That's right.

And then the ragas are for moods, time of day, of year etc, right? If that's right, too, I at least retain a basic knowledge (and a couple of nice CDs, of course).

[mikeweil]

Each of the bols corresponds to a specific stroke on the drum heads, either on one head, left or right, or both combined. There are sixteen basic strokes, and the combinations, analogous to snare drum rudiments or melodic practice patterns, go into the thousands.

The term tal (pronounced tala in English with a very short closed "a" on the last syllable) describes the basic beat/accent structure in a rhyhmic cycle, which is heavily ornamented and embellished. There are lots of preconceived embellishments varying according to regional and personal styles. Many are composed and presented vocally by singing the bols before playing them on the drum. But beyong that, the bols and tala are learned by any musicians as well as singers and dancers as a rhythmic training - the level is much higher here than in any western training method I know of.

I happen to work on a review of a newly published book on tabla playing which serves a fine introduction even if you are not playing the specific instrument - the Indian way of structuring and counting time is superb.

David Courtney, Learning the Tabla

[bertrand]

I think Pete LaRoca's solo on 'Minor Apprehension' would be a good candidate for a vocalese treatment.

Bertrand.

[neveronfriday]

OK, I'm digging around my memory here.

If I'm not totally mistaken (this is from my less jazz-intensive years), I saw a film about Rashied Ali (Coltrane drummer, right?) once, on a German-French (or is that French-German?) cultural TV channel, ARTE.

It was some in-depth portrait (I hope I remember all of this correctly) and it confused me quite a bit ... the guy was doing this wild free stuff (fascinating, but for me, at the time, completely alien stuff), but I also recall distinctly that there was a drum number which had Martin Luther King's "I've got a dream" speech playing in the background. That "number" somehow stuck to me because I thought it was quite a nifty idea (and it was done very well, albeit in a mostly improvisational manner). And, didn't Art Blakey or someone of that class do something similar? I'll do some diggin' around in my collection this weekend.

Cheers!

P.S.: I'm not betting my life on the fact that it was a film about Rashied Ali, but I'm quite sure.

[7/4]

Those words to describe the rhythms (i.e. Teental), they relate to the number and subdivision of beats, if I remember right. It's looong back that I was a bit into this kind of things, though (ok, it can't be more than 7 years, but then those years have been so eventful it seems like decades...)

That's right.

And then the ragas are for moods, time of day, of year etc, right? If that's right, too, I at least retain a basic knowledge (and a couple of nice CDs, of course).

Yep. I took some singing lessions 1999-2000 to learn more about the music and bought a ton of CDs.

[mikeweil]

Courntey's website features a fine online introduction - highly recommended!

The second LP of Shakti, A Handful of Beauty, opens with Zakir Hussain and Vikku Vinayakaram doing a short exchange of bols.

[mikeweil]

P.S.: I'm not betting my life on the fact that it was a film about Rashied Ali, but I'm quite sure.

I remember (and have taped) a documentary arte made about Milford Graves - will have to check if it has that speech in the background.

[king ubu]

Courntey's website features a fine online introduction - highly recommended!

That's almost like a flashback! Thanks for the link. That's all the stuff I tried to play back when...

[mikeweil]

You're welcome! B-)

Now if you had kept on practicing then, you wouldn't be sitting in front of your computer screen getting flashbacks ... ... I tried it too, but the many hours of practice needed ..... a friend of mine only managed to stick to it, he told me, by smoking some grass so his resistance was lowered. But this had the negative side effect that he was playing too soft - when he took lessons with Trilok Gurtu he always was told "I can't hear you, I can't hear you .....

[king ubu]

You're welcome! B-)

Now if you had kept on practicing then, you wouldn't be sitting in front of your computer screen getting flashbacks ... ... I tried it too, but the many hours of practice needed ..... a friend of mine only managed to stick to it, he told me, by smoking some grass so his resistance was lowered. But this had the negative side effect that he was playing too soft - when he took lessons with Trilok Gurtu he always was told "I can't hear you, I can't hear you .....

Funny story! I suppose to *really* learn it, you'd have to grow up playing from childhood. I started when I was around 16 or 17 and tried for maybe two years, but didn't have nearly as much time as one would need to make any advancements.

However, having seen Zakir Hussain play (in really nice small venues in Zurich) was a great experience. Him together with Hariprasad Chaurasia -- musical heaven!

[7/4]

Hariprasad Chaurasia

He's amazing.

[neveronfriday]

I remember (and have taped) a documentary arte made about Milford Graves [...]

Could very well be. Graves would fit the images I still have in my head.

Man, that's quite some years ago I first saw that.

Cheers!

[JSngry]

I also recall distinctly that there was a drum number which had Martin Luther King's "I've got a dream" speech playing in the background. That "number" somehow stuck to me because I thought it was quite a nifty idea (and it was done very well, albeit in a mostly improvisational manner). And, didn't Art Blakey or someone of that class do something similar?

Max Roach. On CHATAHOOCHIE RED.

So I guess that the answer to the original question is "no"?

[Michael Fitzgerald]

The field is wide open, Jim. Knock yourself out. Of course, it will take a couple of years for them to establish the Grammy category for it, so don't expect immediate public recognition.

Mike

[JSngry]

Well, ok, but if I can't be famous right away, why bother?

Seriously, what I'm curious about is this - Jon Hendricks did that great thing on "Joy Spring". Max played a very melodic solo on that one. Why didn't Hendricks go ahead and put some words to that as well?

Think you can lick it? Get to the wicket. Buy you a ticket. GOOOOOO!

[mikeweil]

Seriously, what I'm curious about is this - Jon Hendricks did that great thing on "Joy Spring". Max played a very melodic solo on that one. Why didn't Hendricks go ahead and put some words to that as well?

Real strange, knowing Hendricks started out as a drummer (and abandoned the instrument after hearing Roy Haynes ....).

[JSngry]

Played a gig Saturday night in FW, a fundraiser for Campfire (formerly "Campfire Girls" for all you fellow old farts). Part of the deal was an art auction. This being Fort Worth and all, the has a cattle-type auctioneer running the show. You know, the type who you could slow down to half-speed and still get dizzy listenoing to them.

This guy was introduced as "the dean of Fort Worth auctioneers", and once he got going, I was fascinated - this guy was rolling off his chants (or whatever they were) faster than I'd ever heard anybody speak in my life. A few minutes into the first item, and it hit me - this guy was sounding like a Buddy Rich solo with words! I mentioned this to the trombone player, who had actually worked in one of Buddy's later bands, and after a second of two of a blank look, like he didn't get it, he started convulsing in laughter. "YES!", he started saying repeatedly.

So it can be done, I'm comvinced. Somebody just needs to write hipper lyrics than "gimmeabidgimmeabidwhosthemangonnagimmeabidtwofittynow".

[7/4]

Somebody just needs to write hipper lyrics than "gimmeabidgimmeabidwhosthemangonnagimmeabidtwofittynow".

It's high speed rapping!

[JSngry]

Dude, I kid you not - that's exactly what it was.

[7/4]

Dude, I kid you not - that's exactly what it was.

perfect for drum 'n' bass aka jungle.

(I don't know if you're familiar with the term, I still hear it in commercials.)

[JSngry]

Yeah, I'm familiar with the term. And the style.

I'm tired, but I'm not dead. Besides, my radio still works.