Free America

[brownie]

Is Mohawk the Fontana date that Rudy recorded? I know that he did at least one of those NY Art Quartet sessions ...

Wouldn't a Mosaic Select be nice?

The Lord discography lists the session as having been recorded at Englewood Cliffs. The original Fontana vinyl does not mention either the recording data or a Van Gelder connection.

[clifford_thornton]

Mine does, and it's an original Dutch. Huh.

[Chuck Nessa]

Re: the Braxton disc

There´s a mistake (at least I think there is) in the liner notes by Phillipe Carles........................

Another error in one of the AEC notes saying the Mitchell, Bowie, Favors trio dates from 1968.

[Late]

The Burrell title grows and grows on you ... glad it made the cut.

[David Ayers]

Wouldn't a Mosaic Select be nice?

True. I love this material and it is a shame its not more easily available.

I think a series issue of those Fontanas in Marte Roling sleeves would sell like hot cakes, though it seems that licensing questions make this unlikely.

[Late]

... though it seems that licensing questions make this unlikely.

Agreed.

I've e-mailed Cuscuna twice about this very Mosaic Select (I think you gave me the idea, David). He said he'd love to (— though he made no mention about potential licensing troubles) ... but maybe now with the America title out ... chances are less likely?

I can't get too greedy. At least we have what we have so far ...

[Guest akanalog]

the dave burrell is good! as someone who doesn't care for most "free" stuff, i find this album to be very interesting and enjoyable. i think the reason is much of the record has steady and driving drums with much of the weirdness over the top. the drums are much less structured on most music i consider free (and dislike). but i would recommend this "after love" album to people who want to explore free music, but like me, don't want to be blown out of the water by all out cacaphonous assaults.

[Alexander Hawkins]

How is the version of 'People in Sorrow' on the Emergency 'Homage to Peace'? I think this is a beautiful tune - I'd really love to hear how it's done by a group other than the AEC!

It's beautiful. Sabu Toyozumi studied with the AEC, and has done the tune on his albums - namely, Message to Chicago (Trio).

←

I'll have to give it a listen! Imagine studying with those guys...

[Shawn]

Just picked up the Archie Shepp - Black Gipsy. AWESOME! The sound is great as well.

[ep1str0phy]

Just picked up the Archie Shepp - Black Gipsy. AWESOME! The sound is great as well.

It's a favorite of mine (esp. among the Shepp discography). I 'feel' it a lot more than the majority of his more revolutionary dates (which can come across as overwrought and histrionic). I'd put it above all the BYGs, actually (although I have a soft spot for "Yasmina...").

[sidewinder]

Just listening again to the 'Roswell Rudd' yesterday. Mighty fine session - typical classy offering from Roswell. Will have to work my way again through the Clifford Thornton, Al Shorter and the two Braxtons this weekend.

[Shawn]

What's the lineup on the Shorter album? How is it?

[sidewinder]

Alan Shorter 'Tes Esat' (March 11th, 1970 - Paris)

Alan Shorter - Trumpet and flugel

Gary Windo - Tenor

Johnny Dyani - Bass, flute, bamboo flute, piano, bells

Rene Augustus - Drums, bells.

It's pretty way-out, with some manic playing in particular by Windo. Not up to the standards of 'Orgasm' - will post further thoughts which arise later this weekend.

[ep1str0phy]

Alan Shorter 'Tes Esat' (March 11th, 1970 - Paris)

Alan Shorter - Trumpet and flugel

Gary Windo - Tenor

Johnny Dyani - Bass, flute, bamboo flute, piano, bells

Rene Augustus - Drums, bells.

It's pretty way-out, with some manic playing in particular by Windo. Not up to the standards of 'Orgasm' - will post further thoughts which arise later this weekend.

I do enjoy "Orgasm" more (that quote is going to come back to haunt me), if only for the reason that it's a more fully-realized, conceptually "coherent" album. Although "Tes Esat" has a lot in line with the BYG/Actuel school--explosive blowing, long-form composition, very free jazz-based improv--it's thematically and theoretically unintelligible--it just kind of goes. I would argue that "Tes Esat" is as much a 'leader's' album as "Orgasm" is--fully reliant on the idiosyncrasies of the 'top billing.' The difference is, the America session has less psychological nuance--it's practically mania from start to finish. It just grooves on 'daft.' That being said, the band kicks it in; although Shorter's horn is very much the nonentity (it's his spirit that shines), Windo (to quote a fitting description) "goes apeshit," Augustus provides some supple support, and Johnny Dyani is (typically) mind-blowing. I'll say it now and every day hence: Dyani was/is the 'New Thing's answer to Charles Mingus. There. Summary: fun and involving but but often impenetrable.

Edited March 11, 2006 by ep1str0phy

[clifford_thornton]

Tes Esat is majorly heavy, but I agree that conceptually it has almost nothing in common with the Verve date. Still, that Windo-Augustus duo that takes up a chunk of side one is absolutely insane. I think as far as drummers go, he's actually more integral to the 'success' of the record than might be first let on. His sense of rhythmic suspension holds the music wonderfully taut, even as the proceedings seem to be beyond control.

The Panther and The Lash is a motherfucker, probably next to the JCOA my favorite... uh... CT dates.

I like all the Americas, but I am a bit surprised that they only chose to reissue one Shepp. The Coral Rock - Pitchin' Can sessions are mighty good, if a bit looser than Black Gipsy or the date with Philly Joe.

Think I'm just reposting things I've said before about these, but they are all excellent, even the less excellent ones. Even if they were the "cheapo" alternative to BYGs when they came out in the '70s, I think a lot of the sessions jell a bit better than the Actuels.

[Shawn]

Coral Rock is awesome...Mr Sangrey turned me onto that one (along with about 10,000 other things).

Okay, I'll keep pondering the Shorter...in the interim, what are the other "must-own" titles in this series? I have the Waldron/Lacy as well.

Thanks gang.

[Head Man]

Coral Rock is awesome...Mr Sangrey turned me onto that one (along with about 10,000 other things).

Okay, I'll keep pondering the Shorter...in the interim, what are the other "must-own" titles in this series? I have the Waldron/Lacy as well.

Thanks gang.

I've not been disappointed with the four I bought:

Dave Burrell - After love

Clifford Thornton - The panther & the leash

Roswell Rudd - Roswell Rudd (The best!)

Frank Wright - Uhuru Na Umoja

In fact buying these led me on to discover further releases by the same and similar artists including one I have taken a great shine to : Sonny Simmons. Aaah, but that's a different story!

[ep1str0phy]

Tes Esat is majorly heavy, but I agree that conceptually it has almost nothing in common with the Verve date. Still, that Windo-Augustus duo that takes up a chunk of side one is absolutely insane. I think as far as drummers go, he's actually more integral to the 'success' of the record than might be first let on. His sense of rhythmic suspension holds the music wonderfully taut, even as the proceedings seem to be beyond control.

No doubt. What the hell happened to Augustus?

Edited March 12, 2006 by ep1str0phy

[ep1str0phy]

Coral Rock is awesome...Mr Sangrey turned me onto that one (along with about 10,000 other things).

Okay, I'll keep pondering the Shorter...in the interim, what are the other "must-own" titles in this series? I have the Waldron/Lacy as well.

Thanks gang.

I've not been disappointed with the four I bought:

Dave Burrell - After love

Clifford Thornton - The panther & the leash

Roswell Rudd - Roswell Rudd (The best!)

Frank Wright - Uhuru Na Umoja

In fact buying these led me on to discover further releases by the same and similar artists including one I have taken a great shine to : Sonny Simmons. Aaah, but that's a different story!

I really, really like "Black Gipsy," but it requires some concession to period tastes (aggressive as all hell, but really fist-pumping... in a '60's' sense). However, I think most would agree that the Art Ensemble of Chicago's "Phase One" is one of the finest in the America series--just blisteringly intense, joyful, compelling... heck, fun... one of the best in the AEC's whole catalogue, I'd argue.

Edited March 12, 2006 by ep1str0phy

[GregK]

I really, really like "Black Gipsy," but it requires some concession to period tastes (aggressive as all hell, but really fist-pumping... in a '60's' sense). However, I think most would agree that the Art Ensemble of Chicago's "Phase One" is one of the finest in the America series--just blisteringly intense, joyful, compelling... heck, fun... one of the best in the AEC's whole catalogue, I'd argue.

Yep. I agree about the Art Ensemble Phase One. I also really like the Braxton Donna Lee. I may go pick up the Frank Wright, too

[Guest akanalog]

i can't agree at all about the free america shepp disc being better than the BYGs. i think poem for malcolm and yasmina are both signifigantly better than black gipsy. coral rock is awesome and is definitely up with the other two. chicago beau really adds an annoying element to black gipsy and i think whereas the rhythm of the long track on coral rock becomes hypnotic, the bluesy shuffle thing gets boring and repetitive on black gipsy.

having heard some of the free americas (not the braxton solo one or the lacy or the waldron or the shorter though)-the emergency one is ok. would be better without the sax player and with more robustly heard bass. the rudd was ok. i like mohawk better. the sound was a deterrent for me-it just dulls the drum sound too much. the dave burrell is really interesting and unique sounding, as far as my listening experiences go and should be explored. i love the rhythm on the first track and haven't heard anything like it in "free jazz" before. the other braxton is good though i wish the longest song wasn't the more composed stiff thing that is the second track, though even that isn't bad. the bley is sort of annoying. he has an unpleasant touch on many synthesizers, IMO. phase one is probably good but too plinkety plink for me. i liked certain blacks a lot better. though i doubt many would agree. i liked the meatier drumming on that one. the frank wright is cool. it's interesting to hear art taylor take it out a bit and the compositions are surprisingly catchy. i liked the clifford thornton a lot though i think my enjoyment is fading. it is loose. maybe too loose. when it get going it is great-thanks to noel mcghie's drumming. i would also recommend his solo album "trapeze" though it is sort of spacey loose fusion and not free america-ish. i have avoided the waldron due to bad reviews (the lacy too) but i am interested in checking them out because i think mcghie is on at least the waldron one if people say they are good ones. oh i guess i also need to hear the fontella bass AEC one.

[jazzbo]

The Shepp, the Wright, and the Emergency are my favorites.

[clifford_thornton]

The Waldron-Lacy is great, actually. No problems there. Also, it is rather well-recorded, a touch above some of the others in quality (it IS a studio date, after all).

The Thornton, Certain Blacks, Emergency and the Wright are all other favorites of mine, as are the Rudd and Shorter. Of those, the Emergency has the most "misses" but that's part of it's charm.

I've never been that fond of the Burrell, though I like a lot of his other work. With the first piece, I kinda wish they had faded out the piece after the mandolin-cello duet, which is the high point of the record for me. The stew after that is unnecessary or should have been edited down. But who am I to say?

[clifford_thornton]

Tes Esat is majorly heavy, but I agree that conceptually it has almost nothing in common with the Verve date. Still, that Windo-Augustus duo that takes up a chunk of side one is absolutely insane. I think as far as drummers go, he's actually more integral to the 'success' of the record than might be first let on. His sense of rhythmic suspension holds the music wonderfully taut, even as the proceedings seem to be beyond control.

No doubt. What the hell happened to Augustus?

What happened to him? I was wondering more where the hell they found him!

[JSngry]