Elmo Hope

[Alexander Hawkins]

Elmo Hope doesn't seem to get discussed much. I'd like to remedy the situation, but unfortunately, don't know that much about him myself!

Decided I'd start this thread yesterday whilst listening to his brilliant playing on Harold Land's 'The Fox'. Whilst this album is probably more often discussed re. Dupree Bolton or re. very fast tunes (the title track ), I love hope here.

Sort of a midway point between Bud Powell and Monk, whilst not derivative in any sense.

In fact, his playing really seems to foreshadow Andrew Hill's. A similar touch on the keyboard and jagged sense of melody. The similarity between the second track on 'The Fox' - 'Mirror-Mind Rose', I think - and 'Dedication' from Hill's 'Point of Departure', for example, in language and feel, is striking.

Anyway, opening the floor for an Elmo Hope discussion!

[king ubu]

I don't know that much about Hope either, but was lucky enough to find the old BN CD holding all his EMI (BN & Pacific Jazz, I think) recordings. A very nice trio session and a quintet with Frank Foster which is not as good as the trio in my opinion, but nice nevertheless. I guess these were two 10" LPs. Then there are 3 tracks with Stu Williamson and Harold Land Hope made for Pacific Jazz. One of those strange incomplete sessions which seems to have been spread over several compilations originally.

And I think your point in comparing Hope to Andrew Hill is very interesting. I don't know enough to know if it's a good or bad point from a technical viewpoint, but concerning sound and feeling they seem to have some things in common.

The only other Hope (besides The Fox) is his session with Sonny Rollins (Moving Out on Prestige) which is very nice, too.

The Memorial Album is the one with Coltrane, yes? If so, it is on CD! (go to the Fantasy page for more info)

ubu

Edited May 12, 2003 by king ubu

[Chuck Nessa]

The Memorial Album is reissued under its original title "Meditations". This is a fine disc, as is the Trio record on Contemporary.

[catesta]

[Brad]

The disc that Catesta posted is actually 2 sessions, Informal Jazz (it also includes Hank Mobley) and Homecoming. I'm not that familar with Homecoming but I have Informal Jazz and there is some fine playing on that date. I liked the juxtaposition between Coltrane and Mobley, and the rhythm section is obviously excellent.

The Trio and Quintet session on BN mentioned earlier is probably what's he's best known for and it is great hard bop. If you're going to own an Elmo Hope album, that's probably the one. I have some other Hope dates but none of them stand out in my mind as much as his BN dates do.

He was also good friends with Bud Powell and Monk. I think I read somewhere where they grew up together but I think Elmo Hope's trouble with the law kept him incarcerated for long stretches so that he didn't become as well know as his friends.

[Alexander Hawkins]

Thanks for these pointers - I'll have to try to track a couple down!

[Son-of-a-Weizen]

I haven't yet hit a Hope disc that I disliked. There's one I've been spinning lately called "Sounds From Rikers Island" from '63 or '64 that made it to cd in Japan (Century Records) in the late 80's and features a larger group including John Gilmore (ts), Fred Douglass (as), Lawrence Jackson (tp), Philly Joe, and a few others (even Earl Coleman belting out a couple of numbers that to my untrained ear aren't anything to write home about). This is certainly no RVG recording....but it swings along nicely and Hope sounds pretty good on tracks like "Ecstasy", "Trippin" and my personal favorite, "Kevin".

[mikeweil]

There is an excellent Elmo Hope Discography on the web, written by Noal Cohen.

The twofer LP All Star Sessions consisted of the Prestige Session known as Informal Jazz and the Riverside LP Homecoming with Blue Mitchell, Jimmy Heath, Frank Foster and Hope's bandmates from the Joe Morris R & B group, Percy Heath and Philly Joe Jones. Their trio title tune is one of the greatest improvised blues performances I have ever heard! Highly recommended! Available as Original Jazz Classics OJCCD-1810-2 with three bonus tracks. There is a CD issue of the Milestone twofer as well, but it omits one or two tunes from the Riverside LP and doesn't have the (very good) bonus tracks - the info on the Elmo Hope page at the Fantasy website is not quite correct as it does not mark all three bonus tracks on the Homecoming CD issue. Informal Jazz is available only on the All Star Sessions CD issue or in the Prestige Coltrane box set.

I consider the Blue Notes, the Riversides (there is a great solo/duo piano LP with his wife Bertha) and the Contemporary (ex HIFIJazz) albums the best. The Last Sessions are great, too.

Edited May 13, 2003 by mikeweil

[Alexander Hawkins]

The Memorial Album is reissued under its original title "Meditations". This is a fine disc, as is the Trio record on Contemporary.

Just trawled up this discussion because in the recent Mosaic sale I picked up the Contemporary 'Trio' album on vinyl.

This was an absolute revelation to me. He really was far more of an original than I had ever realised. Not only improvisationally, but compositionally. I am SO glad I bought this, and am now sure to get what I can.

Quite a lot to take in. Yesterday, I had my first proper exposure to Hope, Hampton Hawes, and Joe Albany. Maybe I ought to slow down!!!

[DrJ]

There was actually another fairly recent and quite lively discussion thread on Elmo Hope, that one had a lot of good information (some I posted about SOUNDS FROM RIKERS ISLAND, including excerpts from the liners, a lot more from other people). You might use the search function to dredge that one up, too.

I love Hope, have yet to hear a bad recording by him. I have been most recently digging the Celebrity and Beacon trio recordings after snagging Japanese LP reissues of both records. Short measure (each only about 30 minutes long) but I got a good deal and the sound quality is quite good given that the original session recordings are a bit on the thin and lifeless side.

Edited October 3, 2003 by DrJ

[.:.impossible]

Here 'tis:

Elmo Hope

[.:.impossible]

I could have sworn I posted on either/both of this threads... does anyone else notice posts go missing here and there?

[Guest youmustbe]

Elmo Hope is one of the small gems of Jazz.

Not a giant, (no pun intended, since he was very small physically), but totally original. The influence on Andrew Hill is interesting. I never asked Andrew about that, but when you listen to Elmo, especially on the Rikers album with Gilmore, you wonder.

Unfortunately, he was a junkie, and fell thru the cracks. Just the way it was back then.

The trio record on Hi Fi, which was reissued by Contemorary is one of my favorite Jazz albums.

[Brandon Burke]

Elmo Hope is one of the small gems of Jazz.

Not a giant, (no pun intended, since he was very small physically), but totally original. The influence on Andrew Hill is interesting. I never asked Andrew about that, but when you listen to Elmo, especially on the Rikers album with Gilmore, you wonder.

Unfortunately, he was a junkie, and fell thru the cracks. Just the way it was back then.

The trio record on Hi Fi, which was reissued by Contemorary is one of my favorite Jazz albums.

Agreed. Frank Butler is very impressive as well.

[JSngry]

Don't overlook Bertha Hope. Her stuff is happening!

[mikeweil]

Anyone got a pic of her Minor Music CD Between Two Kings? Can't find one on the web.

Edited October 4, 2003 by mikeweil

[JSngry]

No image of "Between Two Kings" available, but that's one of the best piano trio albums of the last 20 years, imo. Bertha is the real deal. All her stuff bears checking out.