Jazzmoose Posted July 2, 2004 Report Posted July 2, 2004 Alexander said: Speaking of interesting takes on Mr. A and The Question, Moore's Rorchach is based on those characters. If I remember correctly, and odds are against it, the whole group was based originally on the sixties Charlton superheroes. It's been far too long since I've read the book, but I distinctly remember the owl-guy (can't even remember his name!) was based on the Blue Beetle, the hardcore military guy on Sarge Steel or whatever. Man, I can tell it's been years since I was into comics! Quote
chris olivarez Posted July 2, 2004 Report Posted July 2, 2004 I've heard mostly good things about this movie. I'm looking forward to seeing it. Quote
Alexander Posted July 2, 2004 Author Report Posted July 2, 2004 Jazzmoose said: Alexander said: Speaking of interesting takes on Mr. A and The Question, Moore's Rorchach is based on those characters. If I remember correctly, and odds are against it, the whole group was based originally on the sixties Charlton superheroes. No, you are quite correct. Moore had intended "Watchmen" to feature the Charlton characters (which DC had just acquired), but DC realized that at least half of the characters would be dead by the end of issue twelve, and they balked. Moore recreated the characters (and the series is the better for it, I believe). The Blue Beetle character you were trying to remember was Nite Owl (in both of his incarnations). Dr. Manhattan was based on Captain Atom. Honestly, I can't imagine "Watchmen" with the Charlton characters. It would have been interesting, but the original characters Moore created are much more compelling. Quote
Alexander Posted July 2, 2004 Author Report Posted July 2, 2004 Incidentally, Frank Miller used the Question in his recent Dark Knight sequel "DK2: The Dark Knight Strikes Again." The Question is shown debating with Green Arrow, which is pretty funny. Quote
Shawn Posted July 6, 2004 Report Posted July 6, 2004 Spidey brought in a whopping 180 million dollars in its first 6 days of release, breaking all previous records. I saw it on Friday afternoon and I must say that it's worth all the hype and then some! One of the most enjoyable films I've seen in quite awhile. Easily superior to the first film (which I also liked), this movie delivers on all the things that summer movies should. Characters...instead of caricatures. Special Effects that were good enough for me to not even think about them. (that's rare) Good performances all around, special kudos to Molina for playing a sympathetic villain. The real star of the show however is director Sam Raimi. Completely on top of his game, he does a magnificent job of balancing the human elements of the story and making them equally as important as the actions. Plus, he cuts loose a little more this time, there's more of the dark humor & wacky camera work of the Evil Dead films on display. The scene where Doc Ock escapes from the hospital is a scream! Look closely for the dumb redneck guy from Evil Dead 2 on the elevated train.... Quote
MartyJazz Posted July 6, 2004 Report Posted July 6, 2004 (edited) jazzbo said: Wonderful movie! Can't wait for 3! Well, I guess I'm not the demographic they're looking to please (in my late '50s). Took my wife and 12 year old daughter and wound up begging out within the first 45 mins. (Took in the first hour of "The Terminal" within the multiplex before my wife buzzed me to meet them outside). Don't know where to begin with the reasons I hated Spidey 2. SPOILERS I'm willing to suspend disbelief but don't tell me early on that an office has to order pizza from a pizzeria 44 blocks away in a crowded city. What is that about? Or that PP has to scrounge for bucks with the super powers he's got. I mean can't he find a way to make some bucks legally utilizing that advantage, shouldn't be too difficult. Or that KD's character, a successful actress in what appears to be a Broadway production, has her heart set on this vacillating nerd of a delivery man. How about Doc Ock whipping around an 80+ year old woman who survives this heart attack-inducing frenzy simply because she avoids being slammed into a building? Why is Molina's Doc Ock suddenly evil because he can't control his invention? Finally, how can normally intelligent people watch this shit at length? As for Roger Ebert''s 4 star rating and two thumbs up, someone ought to break his thumbs already. Edited July 6, 2004 by MartyJazz Quote
jazzbo Posted July 6, 2004 Report Posted July 6, 2004 (edited) Well Marty. . . it seems you didn't see the first one, and you don't seem to be a connoisseur of the Marvel Comics world. . . . This movie built upon the first one and was perhaps one of the best examples in cinema so far of the Marvel Comics world and attitude and philosophy. Anyway, the pizza thing. . . who knows. . . I'm not in NYC, I don't order pizza delivery, it's beyond me, it was entertaining, especially him coming out of the broom closet, and the receptionist not even wondering how or why! The Aunt May thing. . .well Aunt May is an established character who is a dual strong/weak person in the comic history and they are showing that pretty well in the films. . . . It's just how Aunt May IS, though she's more so in this movie possibly. It's character. . . it's poetic license, it's what storytelling is about. I I found it less hard to swallow than Zeta Jones reading books about Napolean, or that visa stamper being a serious Trekkie in The Terminal. But then I have a sense of Aunt May from reading Spiderman from 1963 to 1973 or so. . . . Spidey tried really early to make bread with his powers, and as a result his uncle, who was like a father to him, was killed. He seems under an obligation to use his powers responsibly and unselfishly. So he puts up with J. J.' abuses in order to get SOME sort of money from his webslinging. . . . Now the comic book history and the film history of MJ and Spidey DIFFERS. But in the first movie MJ and Peter knew each other a LOOOOOONNNNNNGGGGG time and the whole romance between them is one rooted in teenage pimply sensual awakenings, and the whole success of their romance is that Marvel bone they throw Peter now and then. . . the nerd with the heart and the willingness to stick to responsibility and duty gets an important perk! Gave hope to many of us nerds. As for the Doc Ock evil transformation: man, it's all about the sentient tentacles, don't you know? Doesn't that explain it clearly? The artificial inteligence of the metal tentacles took over his brain after the accident with the energy device. It's something no comic book reader would ever doubt would happen! I liked this film better than The Terminal, which I thought was lighter weight and a bit more fabricated, slick if you will. Edited July 6, 2004 by jazzbo Quote
couw Posted July 6, 2004 Report Posted July 6, 2004 jazzbo said: Well Marty. . . [...] you don't seem to be a connoisseur of the Marvel Comics world. . . . his judgement seems to be spot on though: it's riddled with flawed logic and frantic storylines Quote
couw Posted July 6, 2004 Report Posted July 6, 2004 jazzbo said: But that IS the Marvel World! indeed! so "how can normally intelligent people [take] this shit at length?" Quote
jazzbo Posted July 6, 2004 Report Posted July 6, 2004 It's all about fantasy. I don't know anything about normally inteligent people! I liked that there were three potential new villains introduced this time around: Harry Osborn, Jamiesons son, and Professor Connors. Was that Stan Lee that pushed that woman out of the way of falling stuff briefly when May and Ock and Spidey were tearing up that clock? Quote
Shawn Posted July 6, 2004 Report Posted July 6, 2004 Yep, that was him...here's his "character's name" from IMDB. Stan Lee .... Man Dodging Debris Quote
jazzbo Posted July 6, 2004 Report Posted July 6, 2004 Thanks! That will pad his resume nicely. . . . Quote
jazzypaul Posted July 6, 2004 Report Posted July 6, 2004 Alright, I get how Harry is obviously going to be the next hobgoblin, and JJ's kid now has an axe to grind, but why would you think professor connors? Quote
jazzbo Posted July 6, 2004 Report Posted July 6, 2004 Because in the history of the comic books Prof. Connors becomes "The Lizard." Jamieson's son becomes a sort of villain several times due to his spaceflights. Quote
jazzypaul Posted July 6, 2004 Report Posted July 6, 2004 got it. sorry, my ignorance shows. I was always a Punisher, Hulk and Thor kid. Was into Spidey when I was really little, but by the time I was a dressed in black, listening to speed metal, sporting a huge fro, it was all about the Punisher. Quote
BruceH Posted July 6, 2004 Report Posted July 6, 2004 Jazzmoose said: On the other hand, I'm unfamiliar with Moore's Dark Knight shit. Unless you mean Miller's Dark Knight shit. Still, I'll take issue #6 of The Watchmen over any other standard format comic book ever printed... I'm one of the few people who doesn't like Miller's Dark Knight shit. But I agree on Watchmen; in fact, I'll take all the issues up to and including the jailbreak one. The ending is lame but the rest is pretty amazing. Most of Moore's endings are lame though. Quote
BruceH Posted July 6, 2004 Report Posted July 6, 2004 Shawn said: Characters...instead of caricatures. Special Effects that were good enough for me to not even think about them. (that's rare) Good performances all around, special kudos to Molina for playing a sympathetic villain. The real star of the show however is director Sam Raimi. Completely on top of his game, he does a magnificent job of balancing the human elements of the story and making them equally as important as the actions. Plus, he cuts loose a little more this time, there's more of the dark humor & wacky camera work of the Evil Dead films on display. The scene where Doc Ock escapes from the hospital is a scream! Look closely for the dumb redneck guy from Evil Dead 2 on the elevated train.... And what about the supercilious usher that keeps Peter Parker out of the theater? Wasn't he in some B-movies? I saw it Thursday and and had a great time. On the down side it had a few slow spots that could have been tightened up a bit, but they were a long way from being a dealbreaker for me. It was more of an extension of the first movie than a sequel, which was great. Better FX didn't hurt either. And a better villain! The naysayers seem to be complaining that a movie version of a comic book is using comic book logic, comic book situations, even comic book characters and science. I'm shocked, SHOCKED...! Hey, this isn't serious drama. Does it succeed as a cinematic translation of a comic? Yes. Does it remain true to the original Spiderman material? For the most part, yes, given some necessary updating and inevitable fiddling. Is it fun to watch? I think so, if taken on its own terms. Hmmm, $180 million on the first weekend. How are those producers going to eat??? Quote
Shawn Posted July 6, 2004 Report Posted July 6, 2004 (edited) The usher in the theater was Bruce Campbell...who was the star of Raimi's Evil Dead trilogy, he shows up in most of Raimi's other films as well. Also, the car that belonged to Peter Parker's uncle in the first film (seen in part 2 as well) is the same make/model as the one used as the primary car in the Evil Dead trilogy...and Raimi makes sure that it has at least a cameo appearance in all his other movies. Edited July 6, 2004 by Shawn Quote
BruceH Posted July 6, 2004 Report Posted July 6, 2004 Shawn said: The usher in the theater was Bruce Campbell...who was the star of Raimi's Evil Dead trilogy, he shows up in most of Raimi's other films as well. Aha! I thought he looked familiar (even though I haven't seen any of the Evil Dead films.) Quote
Shawn Posted July 6, 2004 Report Posted July 6, 2004 Evil Dead II is one of the funniest movies ever...highly recommended. Quote
jazzbo Posted July 7, 2004 Report Posted July 7, 2004 So who does one think the next villain will be for Spiderman 3: The Lizard? The Goblin? Jamieson? OR Jamieson as Man Wolf: Some unholy combination of two or three of these badasses? I personally would rather see Electro, the Shocker, Mysterio, Sandman. . . ! Quote
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