Another mystery jazz photo.

[Dmitry]

[brownie]

Wild guess: the alto player looks like Joe Harriott??

[DIS]

I don't know the personnel, but from the viewing the equipment and the setup, I'd guess that those pictured are part of a larger band from the 40's that featured the alto player, who might also have been the leader.

[brownie]

I don't know the personnel, but from the viewing the equipment and the setup, I'd guess that those pictured are part of a larger band from the 40's that featured the alto player, who might also have been the leader.

From the clothes the musicians have, this MUST be from the sixties.

[Michael Fitzgerald]

Disagree - unless it's a clarinet deceiving my eyes, isn't that a soprano in the background? In which case I'd say 1960s. Someone with keener fashion history sense than I can address the jacket length and buttons and the trouser tightness(!). Is the drummer wearing a turtleneck?

The racial makeup of the band does bring Britain to mind and is another strike against the 1940s.

The Val Wilmer photo of Joe Harriott on p.89 of The Illustrated Encyclopedia of Jazz by Brian Case & Stan Britt shows a similar left hand, both in physical shape and position.

The tent makes me think festival as do the unused instruments onstage.

Mike

[medjuck]

I saw Joe Harriot perform once and that picture does remind me of him. However that was almost exactly 40 years ago so-- to say the least- I can't say for sure.

[The Mule]

Obviously a different gig, but the trumpet player kind of looks similar to the guy in the mystery photo as well...

[catesta]

Disagree - unless it's a clarinet deceiving my eyes, isn't that a soprano in the background? In which case I'd say 1960s. Someone with keener fashion history sense than I can address the jacket length and buttons and the trouser tightness(!). Is the drummer wearing a turtleneck?

I'd have to agree, the clothes make me think 60's. I can't see the shoes, but I'm willing to bet they have zippers up the side.

[jazzbo]

Could be Kenny Wheeler trumpetin', could be Phil Seaman on drums. . . I'd say this is about 1965-6.

Edited June 28, 2004 by jazzbo

[Dmitry]

What makes you guys think it's Harriott [that'd be cool, but Im not sure we got the right guy here]? It's tough to mke out a face on this small photo, but the hair-styles are distinctly different, and I haven't seen a photo of him without a goatee...

[brownie]

Dmitry, it's very hard to see if the saxplayer has a goatee on your original photo. The hairline seems to point to Harriott. I stand by my first impression B)

[pepe]

Drummer does'nt look like Phil Seamen to me. And who's the bass player? Harriott often had Shake Keane on trumpet, but this is not him. Could it be Jimmy Deuchar? As for time period: Its probably an out door arena (nobody would like those stripes in their room) , and very little jazz was played out doors in the forties, so I guess sixties. Any out doors events in Britain back then. Bracknell?

[neveronfriday]

Dmitry, it's very hard to see if the saxplayer has a goatee on your original photo. The hairline seems to point to Harriott. I stand by my first impression B)

I think this the only jazz board on which musicians are identified by their hairlines.

That's why I love it here.

Cheers!

[couw]

another Joe Harriot pic...

(sorry, there's only a big list of photo credits in the back of my book, no details about what applies to which pic)

[brownie]

Dmitry, it's very hard to see if the saxplayer has a goatee on your original photo. The hairline seems to point to Harriott. I stand by my first impression  B)

I think this the only jazz board on which musicians are identified by their hairlines.

That's why I love it here.

Cheers!

Deus, I work in photos all day long. You'ld be surprised at the details that are being used for various identifications

[Michael Fitzgerald]

That last one is the Val Wilmer shot I mentioned before. See that left hand?

Mike

[couw]

That last one is the Val Wilmer shot I mentioned before. See that left hand?

just from that left hand, I suspected it was the Wilmer pic you mentioned.

[JohnS]

I don't think it's Harriott or Seamen or Deuchar or any of the other names mentioned. I'd be very surprised if it originates from the UK.

[Dmitry]

Dmitry, it's very hard to see if the saxplayer has a goatee on your original photo. The hairline seems to point to Harriott. I stand by my first impression B)

Brownie, the striped ceiling in many of these photos looks to be the same.

I should receive the photo in question in a few days, then I'll scan it and we'll all see who is who. If it's indeed Harriott I'll be amazed at your expertise, man.

But you guys are right, the left hand position on the photo in question and the other photos looks to be the same. Are the hand positions more or less unique to the sax players?

[JohnS]

Are there potted palms in the background? If so I'd say it was taken in dance hall rather than a festival.

[couw]

But you guys are right, the left hand position on the photo in question and the other photos looks to be the same. Are the hand positions more or less unique to the sax players?

I don't know that, but Harriot's hand strikes me as pretty big with long, not so slender fingers. His pinky looks huge.

[Michael Fitzgerald]

The stripes are indeed the same in several photos but NOT the one in question. Those are wider.

The hand position thing can vary. Certainly when playing above high C# and using the palm keys, you get that turn of the wrist, but what I was seeing was also the shape of the hand.

Wouldn't hold up in a court of law.

Regarding the UK: if not there then where? A black alto player leader with an all-white group would have been highly unusual in the US. But I can easily imagine it in the UK, supported by discographical evidence of the groups led by Harriott, Dizzy Reece, and others. Another possibility would be a visiting alto player as a single, working with a house band or a pickup band. But I'd still think UK based on the white guys.

The tent stripes have definitely been in UK festival photos from the 1960s - but have also been at US ones like Randall's Island.

I'll ask some of my UK contacts.

Mike

[Dmitry]

Well, it appears that this photo will remain a mystery.

The ebay seller I bought it from isn't a registered member any more and I'm out of $8.

PayPal won't do anything, since the transaction is over 30 days old, and eBay won't do anything because he's no longer registered.

I did get his phone # through eBay though.

I'm thinking let the sleeping dogs lie for $8.

What would you do?

[Christiern]

I'd let the dogs lie and enjoy the mystery aspect of the photo while not giving up my search for true identification..

[Dmitry]

I decided to have some fun with this guy. The $8 admission fee was paid, after all.

Cesar,

Either prove that the item was sent or you must return $7.98 to my PayPal account. I never received the item you claimed to have sent.

I know your name is Cesar Barreto,

your address is

405 S Federal Hwy

POMPANO BEACH, FL 33062

and your telephone # is

954-783-0871

If you don't refund the money to my PayPal account by tomorrow I will file a claim with the Internet Fraud Complaint Center (IFCC) which is part of the Federal Bureau of Investigations (FBI) as well as with the Pompano Beach Police Department.

Have a nice day,

Dmitry