Elvin Jones - SKYSCRAPERS - vol.1-4 LP

[Dmitry]

Got 3 out of 4 this Sunday at a record fair. On Honey Dew. They look like semi-boots.

With George Coleman, Wilbur Little and Hannibal Peterson on a few tracks[same combo as on Enja's 1968 live cd].

Looks like these are from an early 70s performance at the Vanguard. Haven't played 'em yet.

[Big Wheel]

I just played these on my Vanguard radio program. Can't help you much, except that Jack Woker (who posts to rec.music.bluenote) agrees that these most likely fit into the gray-market category. Sound is pretty good, and the playng is fine. The date, if I had to guess, is close to that of the Enja recording.

[JSngry]

I bought one of those Elvin albums, got it home, opened it up, and it was a Nina Simone record instead.

The catalog listing on the back of the albums seem pretty interesting, though. Seems like I remember a Dizzy Reece thing, among others.

[ajf67]

Coincidence -- I just bought vol 2 and 3 at a used LP store this past weekend, and i was going to start the same thread. I've only listened to vol 2 so far, but the music is great. I think the sound is fine too. They do look awfully like bootlegs though. The cover "art" -- yes, in quotes -- would blow away anything in the 32 Jazz thread that was started elsewhere on this forum for worst album cover.

[Late]

Though Elvin's solos are very long on this series of records, I actually think they're some of his best. (I haven't heard Vol. 4.) It would be nice to have these records as a compact disc set. The music is well above average.

[felser]

As Late mentioned, I remember these being largely taken up with loooong drum solos.  Works for Late, doesn't really work for me.  YMMV.  I agree with all the other descriptions above.  But I would buy a CD set of them and skip the drum solos.

[chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez]

which is your favorite, is it like police acedemy where 4 is really #1.  I've been meaning to get these

[Mark Stryker]

I have Vol. 2 of the Honey Dew and the single volume that came out on Enja. Like 'em both, Every one sounds great.  All from the same stand at the Vanguard in March 1968. I think the Enja release was legit. What I can't remember is if the material is duplicated -- that is, if some of the Honey Dew selections overlap with the Enja release.

 

   Elvin Jones
Live At The Village Vanguard : Hannibal Marvin Peterson (tp-1) George Coleman (ts) Wilbur Little (b) Elvin Jones (d)
     Live "Village Vanguard", New York, March 20, 1968
Introduction    Enja (G)2036-2 [CD], (Jap)ENJ1016 [CD]
By George    Enja (G)2036, 2036-2 [CD], (Jap)ENJ1016 [CD]
Laura        -         -            -
Mister Jones (1)        -         -            -
You don't know what love is        -         -            -                ,
Musica Jazz/Enja (It)TIDE9134-2 [CD]
Talk (by Elvin Jones)    Enja (G)2036-2 [CD], (Jap)ENJ1016 [CD]
Note:    Musica Jazz/Enja (It)TIDE9134-2 [CD] titled "Elvin Jones".
All titles from Enja (G)2036 also on Enja (Jap)SHJ-6061, SFX-10708.

 Elvin Jones
Sky Scrapers Vol 1 : George Coleman (ts) Wilbur Little (b) Elvin Jones (d)
     Live "Village Vanguard", New York, March 1968 ?
A night in Tunisia    Honeydew HD6602
Blues inside out            

  Elvin Jones
Sky Scrapers Vol 2 : same pers
     Live "Village Vanguard", New York, March 1968 ?
Whew    Honeydew HD6603
Blues inside out            -
You don't know what love is            -      , Stateside (Jap)ISJ-80122
Body and soul            -

 Elvin Jones
Sky Scrapers Vol 3 : same pers
     Live "Village Vanguard", New York, March 1968 ?
Yesterdays    Honeydew HD6604
A night in Tunisia            -      , Stateside (Jap)ISJ-80122
Body and soul            -

 Elvin Jones
Sky Scrapers Vol 4 : Hannibal Marvin Peterson (tp) added
     Live "Village Vanguard", New York, March 1968 ?
Mister Jones    Honeydew HD6605
Raunchy Rita

 

[mjzee]

18 hours ago, felser said:

As Late mentioned, I remember these being largely taken up with loooong drum solos.  Works for Late, doesn't really work for me.  YMMV.  I agree with all the other descriptions above.  But I would buy a CD set of them and skip the drum solos.

I totally agree with Felser.  I owned, I think, 3 of them.  So boring.  It wasn't just the endless drum solos, it's that the trio format is so hard to make compelling.  Some can do it (Sonny comes to mind, of course), but most need an additional horn and piano to make it work.  If you cut out all the drum solos, I'm not sure you'd get an LP's worth of music from the 4 volumes combined.

[jazzbo]

I haven't heard these, but as an Elvin Jones fan and a former drummer I might find them more interesting than others do. . . .

[Mark Stryker]

2 hours ago, mjzee said:

I totally agree with Felser.  I owned, I think, 3 of them.  So boring.  It wasn't just the endless drum solos, it's that the trio format is so hard to make compelling.  Some can do it (Sonny comes to mind, of course), but most need an additional horn and piano to make it work.  If you cut out all the drum solos, I'm not sure you'd get an LP's worth of music from the 4 volumes combined.

Even as hyperbole, this is terribly misleading as it relates to the individual records. On Volume 2, there are four tracks totaling 44 minutes. Elvin plays exactly one drum solo that lasts 3:30. On the Enja LP, there are four tracks totaling 42 minutes. Elvin plays two solos -- one lasts 4 minutes and one lasts 90 seconds, plus another 30 seconds of Elvin's portion of a single minute of trading choruses on the blues with Coleman. 

Certainly, Volume 1 has different propotions. Out of 37 total minutes, Elvin plays a 21-minute solo on "A Night in Tunisia." (out of 29 minutes total for the track), and on the remaining 7-minute blues, he plays a 90 second solo, plus a little trading.

I don't have enough info on Volumes 3 and 4 to pass on any details. 

Some may find these records boring -- your mileage may vary and all that -- but to repeat what I said earlier, my view is that everyone plays great on the stuff I've heard and Coleman in particular is at his most adventurous. I'd  recommend Vol. 2 to anyone for a great window into what Elvin was playing on a nightly basis in 1968 and how much freer George was sounding just four years after "My Funny Valentine" and "Four and More.". 

 

 

Edited March 18, 2019 by Mark Stryker

[JSngry]

"Laura" from the Enja LP is, perhaps, my favorite George Coleman solo, period.

[chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez]

yea this is good info here im into elvin drum solos but not at $34.99 each.  If i can find these for $3/ea ill be made

[felser]

45 minutes ago, Mark Stryker said:

Even as hyperbole, this is terribly misleading as it relates to the individual records. On Volume 2, there are four tracks totaling 44 minutes. Elvin plays exactly one drum solo that lasts 3:30. On the Enja LP, there are four tracks totaling 42 minutes. Elvin plays two solos -- one lasts 4 minutes and one lasts 90 seconds, plus another 30 seconds of Elvin's portion of a single minute of trading choruses on the blues with Coleman. 

Certainly, Volume 1 has different propotions. Out of 37 total minutes, Elvin plays a 21-minute solo on "A Night in Tunisia." (out of 29 minutes total for the track), and on the remaining 7-minute blues, he plays a 90 second solo, plus a little trading.

I don't have enough info on Volumes 3 and 4 to pass on any details. 

Some may find these records boring -- your mileage may vary and all that -- but to repeat what I said earlier, my view is that everyone plays great on the stuff I've heard and Coleman in particular is at his most adventurous. I'd  recommend Vol. 2 to anyone for a great window into what Elvin was playing on a nightly basis in 1968 and how much freer George was sounding just four years after "My Funny Valentine" and "Four and More.". 

 

 

Not sure why the ENJA LP is being used to refute comments about the Honeydew content.  I own the ENJA CD and like it fine.  And Honeydew Vol. 1 is 60% drum solos, so not sure how the comments become hyperbole. 

[Mark Stryker]

12 minutes ago, felser said:

Not sure why the ENJA LP is being used to refute comments about the Honeydew content.  I own the ENJA CD and like it fine.  And Honeydew Vol. 1 is 60% drum solos, so not sure how the comments become hyperbole. 

"If you cut out all the drum solos, I'm not sure you'd get an LP's worth of music from the 4 volumes combined." Do the math. About 7 percent of Volume 2 is taken up by drum solos. If you cut out all the drum solos from Volume 2, you'd have a 40-minute LP -- that's before considering any of the other records.

I only brought up the Enja recording because it came from the same batch of music, but, yes, to the extent it reflects directly on the Honey Dew LPs and the amount of drum solos, then it is, of course, irrelevant.

 

[felser]

5 minutes ago, Mark Stryker said:

"If you cut out all the drum solos, I'm not sure you'd get an LP's worth of music from the 4 volumes combined." Do the math. About 7 percent of Volume 2 is taken up by drum solos. If you cut out all the drum solos from Volume 2, you'd have a 40-minute LP -- that's before considering any of the other records.

I only brought up the Enja recording because it came from the same batch of music, but, yes, to the extent it reflects directly on the Honey Dew LPs and the amount of drum solos, then it is, of course, irrelevant.

 

Fair enough.

[Mark Stryker]

47 minutes ago, JSngry said:

"Laura" from the Enja LP is, perhaps, my favorite George Coleman solo, period.

A great one, yes.