Chrome Posted June 4, 2004 Report Posted June 4, 2004 More love for Richard Williams ... and how 'bout Cal Massey? His "Blues to Coltrane" disc is a definite winner. Quote
MartyJazz Posted June 4, 2004 Report Posted June 4, 2004 Well, it appears to me that the original poster to this thread meant to use the word "obscure" rather than "underrated". I can't think of any obscure ones who should be better known other than perhaps John Marshall whom I saw perform in a club some 15 years ago. Not aware of any CDs by him. As for underrated trumpet players, I nominate the following: Benny Bailey: BIG BRASS (Candid), a really fiery player in a 1960 session Bobby Bradford: I'm thinking of the two Flying Dutchman collaborations with John Carter (FLIGHT FOR FOUR and SELF DETERMINATION MUSIC), circa 1969 Valery Ponomarev: PROFILE (Reservoir), a '91 date with Joe Henderson Claudio Roditi: TWO OF SWORDS (Candid), a '90 date with a terrific version of the standard "Secret Love" Quote
brownie Posted June 4, 2004 Report Posted June 4, 2004 A few more: Dupree Bolton Jacques Coursil Don Ferrara Quote
catesta Posted June 4, 2004 Report Posted June 4, 2004 I have to agree with Richard Williams, and.... Johnny Coles Howard McGhee Tommy Turrentine Dizzy Reece Carmell Jones Oh hell, all the ones listed I know of are all good examples of underrated. I might add, Charles Tolliver and Lonnie Hillyer. Quote
king ubu Posted June 4, 2004 Report Posted June 4, 2004 Ted Curson Regarding Cal Massey - I think he's rather some sort of obscure player, odd man. He wrote great music, but I'm not sure he was a great trumpet player. I do like his one album, but then, that seems not enough evidence. Maybe I'm wrong, though - forgive me if so. ubu Quote
JSngry Posted June 4, 2004 Report Posted June 4, 2004 Some not yet mentioned: Bill Dixon, at least in some circles. The beauty of the blur... Hannibal - kind of a "one-trick pony" at times, but when that trick's working, look out! Don Ellis - never met a gimmick he didn't like (or use), but in spite of all that, a very exploratory, individual player. Ruby Braff - absolutely fearless when it comes to using silence in unexpected places and off-the-wall phraeology. Quote
couw Posted June 4, 2004 Report Posted June 4, 2004 Ruby Braff - absolutely fearless when it comes to using silence in unexpected places and off-the-wall phraeology. Quote
jlhoots Posted June 4, 2004 Report Posted June 4, 2004 (edited) Phil Grenadier (it did say "and beyond") Edited June 4, 2004 by jlhoots Quote
Eric Posted June 4, 2004 Report Posted June 4, 2004 Dupree Bolten Joe Gordon among the younger guys ... Eddie Allen (brother of Carl - has a nice string of records on Enja and Venus) Marcus Printup (his BN records are inconsistent, but the best parts are great) Duane Eubanks (brother of Kevin and Robin - love his albums on TCB) Philip Harper (where has the guy been - love his work with the Harper Brothers) Quote
mikeweil Posted June 4, 2004 Report Posted June 4, 2004 Doc Cheatham Emmett Berry Of the one mentioned: Richard Williams Marcus Belgrave Johnny Coles Ted Curson Michael Ray Charles Sullivan Ray Nance Don Ellis I agree that Cal Massey was a very good composer, but his trumpet chops leave too much to be desired, as can be heard on his sole Candid LP. Quote
A Lark Ascending Posted June 4, 2004 Report Posted June 4, 2004 I don't much like the idea of 'rating' players. Strikes me as a job for bean counters. Interpreting the title as players who are only noticed by a few and could be enjoyed by many more... Harry Beckett Henry Lowther Pino Minafra Quote
Brownian Motion Posted June 4, 2004 Report Posted June 4, 2004 Wilbur Harden Ray Codrington Al Aarons Quote
Pete C Posted June 5, 2004 Report Posted June 5, 2004 Sam Noto. I very much enjoy two of his mid 70's Xanadu albums - "Entrance!" and "Act One" (especially the latter). Indeed. If not for Schlitten he would have remained in total obscurity, rather than relative obscurity. He's also on a nice Kenny Drew date for Xanadu. Quote
Spontooneous Posted June 5, 2004 Report Posted June 5, 2004 (edited) How soon we forget... Buck Clayton Shorty Baker (and one more for Benny Bailey here.) Edited June 5, 2004 by Spontooneous Quote
PHILLYQ Posted June 5, 2004 Report Posted June 5, 2004 Philly -- Charles Sullivan played in pit orchestras on Broadway from 1981-95, according to the notes for his nice 1996 Arabesque album, Kamau, with Craig Handy, Kenny Barron, Rodney Whittaker, and Victor Lewis. (Kamua Adilifua is Sullivan's new name; don't know what he's doing now that he's left the Broadway field.) I heard him with that Sonny Fortune band, too. He sounded -- to borrow a phrase someone once applied to Jean-Pierre Rampal -- like he was using bottled air; when did he breathe? A remarkable player, and if memory serves, a fair bit more fiery in-person with Fortune than he is on the Arabesque album, good though it is. BTW, Sullivan brings to mind another bottled-air guy, Carl Saunders. Definitely underrated, perhaps because he's such a great trumpeter player technically that you tend to think that he can't be that much of a thinker -- but at his best, I think he is. Thanks for the update, Larry. Ted Curson- I saw him at a street festival many moons ago on 52nd Street in NYC- he was excellent! Quote
Brownian Motion Posted June 5, 2004 Report Posted June 5, 2004 Well, I'll surely agree with Shorty Baker. But Buck? That cat was the most recorded trumpet of the swing era, 'ceptin' Roy. How about Shad Collins, Emmett Berry, or Ernie Royal? Snooky Young? Quote
Brownian Motion Posted June 5, 2004 Report Posted June 5, 2004 It's time for my annual plug for Jimmy McPartland, who was capable of a lot more than many of his records indicate. In particular I'll single out a date with Marion and her bassist and drummer, and a guitarist, Jimmy Raney I think, playing Hoagy Carmichael's music. Fine, sensitive playing. Quote
chris olivarez Posted June 5, 2004 Report Posted June 5, 2004 Carmell Jones,Jon Faddis and Oscar Brashear. Quote
king ubu Posted June 5, 2004 Report Posted June 5, 2004 Thad Jones! I know he is pretty well known, but: he is known as a composer, bandleader, arranger, whatever, but he was one HELLUVA trumpet player! His Blue Note dates are too early to fit into this thread, but his occasional solo with the Jones-Lewis band is enough to secure him an almost-giant status, in my opinion! Monster chops, and even more taste. ubu Quote
cannonball-addict Posted June 5, 2004 Report Posted June 5, 2004 I second the motion for Oscar Brashear and Benny Bailey. But what about Eddie Henderson!?!??!?! The man is the sickest former doctor on the scene - one of the baddest cats out there without much recognition at all. I recently saw him with Tim Armacost. I also have to give a shoutout to my boy, trumpeter Eddie "E.J." Allen. Bad Mo-Fo! He is currently eading a "heavy" rehearsal big band at the musicians union in Manhattan that plays mostly original and new music. He also plays frequently in a band called Rhythm Ignition. He has worked with people such as Muhal Richard Abrams, Louis Hayes, Mongo Santamaria (six albums), David Gilmore, Bobby Previte, Lester Bowie's Brass Fantasy, Cyrus Chestnut, Charlie Persip (as a member of Persip's 80s big band called the Superband). Most don't know this outside New York's musicians but Eddie is drummer Carl Allen's older brother. My ears are always open Matt Quote
paul secor Posted June 5, 2004 Report Posted June 5, 2004 Don Joseph. Wish there was more to hear from him than his Uptown album and a few appearances with the Gerry Mulligan Concert Jazz Band. Forgot about Don Joseph. Thanks for the reminder, Brownie. The Uptown LP is a fine one. He also has a few good solo spots on Chuck Wayne's String Fever CD. Quote
Larry Kart Posted June 5, 2004 Report Posted June 5, 2004 Sorry to sneak beyond the time frame, but two of this guy's greatest albums were recorded in the '60s, or maybe the late '50s. Charlie Shavers. Yes, he had a taste problem at times, but when he was on -- my God! The albums are as a sideman: "Hawk Eyes" under Coleman Hawkins' name (the fours on the title track!) and Hal Singer's "Blue Stompin.'" Both originally on Swingville; the former's on OJC and the later may be too. Quote
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