What vinyl are you spinning right now??

[JSngry]

No, I just want a recognition of known facts, not unfounded speculation.

And not just here, but in life at large. 

This is bigger than you, bigger than me, and bigger than Max. 

[Rabshakeh]

8 hours ago, mjazzg said:

 Max Roach - Chattahoochee Red [Columbia, 1981]

Picked up for the country price of a couple of pints of beer in a dusty country town shop yesterday. What a terrific listen

Well done. No better feeling.

[Gheorghe]

20 hours ago, Pim said:

such a powerful live date this is. Clifford Jordan at his best. 
 

Speaking about Clifford Jordan: I’ve ordered the new P-Vine/Groove Diggers release of In The World in December 2022. It was supposed to be released in march but got postponed to September. It’s almost October now and still no sign of it. Anyone else here with that in pre order?

What a wonderful record. I bought it in the 70´s, but it has another cover, a colour photo of Max. It is on the America Label, which published most of Mingus´ albums. Since this album also has Cliff Joran and Mal Waldron, who had played many times with Mingus, at that time I really associated it with Mingus´ music, and actually it has some of that message. 

I love it, it´s one of my favourite records and about the same time I saw Roach live, one of the best musical experiences I ever had. 

On 10/1/2023 at 12:24 AM, Brad said:

I wonderful little album ! 

[mjazzg]

11 hours ago, Rabshakeh said:

These are some which I enjoy: 

Fernando Gelbard - Didi

Horacio Chivo Borraro - El Nuevo Sonido del Chivo Borraro

Jorge Lopez Ruiz - Bronca Buenos Aire

Jorge Lopez Ruiz - Viejas Raices

Matias Pizarro - Pelo de Rata

Quinteplus (Carlos Pocho Lapouble and Gustavo Bergalli) - Quinteplus

Great, thanks ever so much

[jazzcorner]

ARGO LP 623 [Japan 1983]  " Max" with  Max Roach / Hank Mobley / Kenny Dorham / George Morrow / Ramsey Lewis - rec. 1958

 

[clifford_thornton]

18 hours ago, JSngry said:

More than fair "enough", it's true. A simple business reality.

The only counter is an equal truth having to deal with Columbia trying to secure rights to reissue and failing, or proof that whoever the decider(s) were at Columbia explicitly gave direction to never reissue this.

I could believe either,but there is no evidence (or even claims) to support either.

I certainly do believe that Max got blacklisted in certain circles along the way, but check his deals with Bruce Lundvall along the way, which went from Columbia to Elektra-Musician to Blue Note. Records were released and have any of them seen actual reissue?

A fair question might be what shape the Roach estate is in? Do they trust anybody? Is there just too much for one(?) person to handle?

It is indeed a great legacy that could be made even greater, but...business needs to occur on a mutually agreeable basis.

 

 

Have these records been bootlegged? Bill Dixon leased the quartet with Shepp to Savoy, but it was reissued/booted numerous times over the years, starting with BYG in 1969. I'm sure Savoy/Lubinsky cared a lot less about following the contract than Columbia or Lundvall did.

[JSngry]

LFreedom Now has been bootlegged numerous times. 

Max's deal with Lundvall allowed Columbia allowed for a legitimate LP reissue.

Unless I'm forgetting something, that's been it for that one.

The ones with Harper...maybe the Horo was reissued but was that one legit? 

Otherwise, the small label stuff like Fluid have not been booted that I know of. The multiple Japanese labels, I don't know. 

[clifford_thornton]

Oh, I was just thinking about that particular Columbia deal. Sure, there are many reissues of varying legality of his output overall.

[JSngry]

IIRC, the Columbia deal resulted in:

• Live at the BeeHive (never a legit CD issue)
• a reissue of We Insist! (only even possible legit CD reissue has been on the latter-day Candid, and the legitimacy of that has been contested some).
• Chattahoochee Red Nope
• a M'Boom album (not sure if this was part of the deal or something else. This one has seen CD reissue for some reason.)

Then Lundvall went to Elektra-Musician gor a quick minute, which gave us

• Pure Genius Vol. 1 (never a legit CD issue, nor a Vol. 2)

And the, finally to Blue Note, where this was released:

• With The New Orchestra Of Boston And The So What Brass Quintet a one and done

Not a lot, all things considered, but it's all valuable. Gotta wonder how much has been left behind and what condition it's in.

I'm pretty sure that Maz's M.O. for all of his work post-Atlantic was to retain ownership of all the sessions, and then deal with each label on whatever terms worked for both parties. That might explain why the Soul Note stuff has been reissued and the Columbia hasn't. Or maybe not.

[clifford_thornton]

The Soul Note/Black Saint CAM reissues are a little confusing and I've heard that they aren't exactly adhering to the original contracts (or weren't at one point anyway). So whether the Roach estate has received anything from the boxed set is debatable.

my copy of We Insist! is a Japanese Victor LP from the 1970s. I don't know what the Victor license looked like but imagine it came from CBS, which owned Barnaby and the Cadence/Candid catalogs. 

[jazzcorner]

[Chuck Nessa]

For Von's birthday. Haven't played this in years.

[Rabshakeh]

29 minutes ago, Chuck Nessa said:

For Von's birthday. Haven't played this in years.

I like the contrast. The first side is all expansive post bop workmanship. Then the second side starts with the Freemans kicking down the door and playing a song dedicated to Gene Ammons, that still manages to do more interesting things. 

[jazzcorner]

Jazz West  JWLP-6 - Jack Sheldon Quartet & Quintet - rec. 1955 & 1956 - Engineers: John Neal & John Kraus

This LP compiles the material of his first two 10" LPs JWLP-1 & JWLP-2

 

[BillF]

7 minutes ago, jazzcorner said:

 

 

👍

Now playing:

 

[jazzcorner]

Jugoton LSY 68095 - RTV Zagreb Bigband dir. by Miljenko Prohaska " Golden Hours" - rec. 1968to 1980
featuring guest appearances from the US: Art Taylor / Sal Nistico / Lucky Thompson / Johnny Griffin / Leo Wright / John Lewis / Kay Winding / Art Farmer / Ted Curson

Edited October 3, 2023 by jazzcorner

[optatio]

28 minutes ago, BillF said:

 

👍

[JSngry]

2 hours ago, jazzcorner said:

Jugoton LSY 68095 - RTV Zagreb Bigband dir. by Miljenko Prohaska " Golden Hours" - rec. 1968to 1980
featuring guest appearances from the US: Art Taylor / Sal Nistico / Lucky Thompson / Johnny Griffin / Leo Wright / John Lewis / Kay Winding / Art Farmer / Ted Curson

Apologies for not knowing about this band, but who were the arranger(s), please? 

[Gheorghe]

On 10/2/2023 at 7:50 PM, clifford_thornton said:

The Soul Note/Black Saint CAM reissues are a little confusing and I've heard that they aren't exactly adhering to the original contracts (or weren't at one point anyway). So whether the Roach estate has received anything from the boxed set is debatable.

my copy of We Insist! is a Japanese Victor LP from the 1970s. I don't know what the Victor license looked like but imagine it came from CBS, which owned Barnaby and the Cadence/Candid catalogs. 

I like mostly those Max Roach recordings that come very near to the Max Roach I saw live, that means quartet recordings, in the best case with Bridgwater, Harper, Workman, that was the best edition I heard. The later Calvin Hill and Odeon Pope stuff was good too, but the sound of Calvin Hill´s bass was not so natural like Reggie Workman´s sound. 
And I don´t know why Roach later started to use an electric bass. 

Other albums have to little similar to live music on it. I think I have one that has Roach with a quite atonal sounding String Quartet, that sounds much more like western abstract music. 

And the famous "Double Quartet", well some of it is nice sometimes, but , of course it´s my fault, but strings sounds somehow "funny" to my ears in most of the cases......

[HutchFan]

Now spinning:

Black Renaissance - Body, Mind and Spirit (Baystate, 1977)
2023 RSD reissue on Luv N' Haight

Buster Williams !!!

 

 

[mjazzg]

14 minutes ago, HutchFan said:

Now spinning:

Black Renaissance - Body, Mind and Spirit (Baystate, 1977)
2023 RSD reissue on Luv N' Haight

Buster Williams !!!

 

 

Everytime you, and possibly @Pim, post that I think I must get a copy, so thinking that again now

Meanwhile playing here, I only very recently discovered the existence of this early, possibly first, recording by Cassandra Wilson, so very pleased to get a copy

Cassandra Wilson - New Yorker In A Sentimental Mood [JAL Strato Sound, Japan, 1985]

And next

Azamiah - In Phases [Rebecca's Records, 2023 UK]

Edited October 4, 2023 by mjazzg

[Rabshakeh]

6 minutes ago, mjazzg said:

Everytime you, and possibly @Pim, post that I think I must get a copy, so thinking that again now

Meanwhile playing here, I only very recently discovered the existence of this early, possibly first, recording by Cassandra Wilson, so very pleased to get a copy

Cassandra Wilson - New Yorker In A Sentimental Mood [JAL Strato Sound, Japan, 1985]

Is it a Japan only thing? It looks like an inner sleeve. Interesting stuff.

7 minutes ago, mjazzg said:

And next

Azamiah - In Phases [Rebecca's Records, 2023 UK]

How is this one?

[jazzcorner]

17 hours ago, JSngry said:

Jugoton LSY 68095 - RTV Zagreb Bigband dir. by Miljenko Prohaska " Golden Hours" - rec. 1968to 1980

Apologies for not knowing about this band, but who were the arranger(s), please? 

Well  thats ok  noone can know everything ..... and I dont have  myself  details of the Zagreb RTV

bigband except some translated linernotes. I do  like big band music from  all european countries beside the  USA bands 

Pl. see the attached scan probably it helps a bit. Arrangers are not listed. BTW jazz behing "the Iron Curtain" at these times were a rarity for the western collectors.

.

 

 

[mjazzg]

Irreversible Entanglements - Protect Your Light [Impulse, 2023]

[Rabshakeh]

3 minutes ago, mjazzg said:

Irreversible Entanglements - Protect Your Light [Impulse, 2023]

The new one! How is it on first listen?