DVD/amp combos (media room in a small library)

[Rooster_Ties]

EDIT: OK, this thread started as just asking for suggestions for DVD/VCR combos, but it quickly devolved into my discussing all the audio/video issues I'm thinking about, in terms of this one small 'media room' in our house. We're planning to put a couch in the room, which is a small library just off of our living-room. We're NOT planning to have a TV in the living-room at all, actually. (Just in the library.)

Anyway, this first post is just about the DVD/VCR combo. But farther down in the thread, I started posting about how to handle the audio, re: AM/FM, stereo speakers, etc.

Overall budget is probably $500, and we've already got the TV part taken care of. And we could use a mini-bookshelf audio system I've already got, for the sound -- although a new one might be in order. (More discussion of that further down in the thread, from me).

-- Rooster T.

==========

(No longer looking at DVD/VCR combos, but here's what I said originally...)

Looking for a relatively inexpensive DVD/VCR combo, and preferably one that's gonna last, trouble-free, for at least 5-7 years. (My current VCR, now on it's last legs, was bought 'used' in 1991 --- so I don't think 5-7 years is too much to ask out of a brand-new DVD/VCR combo, correct??)

I might have probably already bought this here Sony DVD/VCR combo (for only $160)...

Sony Progressive-Scan DVD Player/4-Head Hi-Fi Stereo VCR Combo; Model: SLV-D350P

...except our own Spontoonious said to me earlier this week that his folks had recently bought the same model (or at least some Sony DVD/VCR combo, probably this model?) – and they had some major problems with it. They returned it, got a replacement, and had problems with it too. (In fact, he even thought they had problems with yet another replacement after that!!)

What's a good brand, that's not too expensive ($200 or less, or at least close to $200 or so), that's gonna last???

Any suggestions?? Either suggestions of good-brands vs. less-than-good brands (in general), or suggestions for specific models --- are equally welcomed!!

Thanks!!!

EDIT: FYI, I don't give a hoot about multi-disc DVD players, and the combo players seem cheap enough that as long as they last 5 years -- even if the DVD or VCR part goes out (and the other half still works), I feel I will have gotten my money out of them. My initial concern about getting a combo (instead of getting a separate DVD player, and VCR), was that half of it was bound to break at some point, and the repair costs would be more than the unit was even worth. But at only $160 to buy a new one, I guess I shouldn't care about repair costs.

Edited January 20, 2005 by Rooster_Ties

[Dan Gould]

I'd be interested to see any suggestions here, too, because I offered our old DVD player (gotten free with a DSL signup a year or two ago) to my brother but he said he was thinking about a DVD/VHS combo unit, but I don't think he ever made a decision.

Edited for clarity (D'oh!)

Edited May 14, 2004 by Dan Gould

[Rooster_Ties]

By the way, the Sony model wasn't the cheapest one available. Right or wrong, Sony seemed like a better brand than some of the other choices, so it seemed like paying what was only like $30 more (for a Sony), might have been worth it.

Then I heard Spontoonious' tale, and had second thoughts.

I'm will to pay more for quality. Just not twice as much.

[jazzbo]

I paid a big dollar, about two and a half, about two years ago for a Samsung that I have had going with no problems whatsoever. I enjoy having it because now with my previous vcr that stills plays back well but doesn't record, I can make copies of jazz vidoes. . .

[Kevin Bresnahan]

Sorry to say, but once you move out of Sony's EX line, build quality goes way down. Their VCRs have dropped in quality at an alarming rate. I used to buy Sony and Sony alone for years. The last VCR I bought died in about a year. The one before that was about 2 years. I am now on my second Mitsubishi unit. It's a Super VHS model and the picture quality is miles ahead of standard VHS.

As for combo players, I bought one for my mother-in-law's room last year. The first one was a Go Video player... that wouldn't play... right out of the box! I was shocked at that one. I looked at the Sony units and almost pulled the trigger but I did some research and remembered the trouble I'd been having with their VCRs and took a step back. I bought a Hitachi model. Other than it being a bit confusing (to her), it has been pretty good. I wouldn't rave about it.

BTW, it goes without saying that to cram 2 players into one box for under $200, some shortcuts will be made. You would be much better off buying a separate player for each if only for better quality build. Also, if one of the players dies, you don't have to replace both. I'd bet a lot that the VCR croaks way before the DVD player. The really aren't making these things very well today.

Later,

Kevin

[PHILLYQ]

Rooster,

I've had a Samsung combo unit(I'm not at home right now so I can't tell you what model number) for about 18 months and it runs beautifully, no problems at all. I paid about $300 for it, but prices have gone down quite a bit since then and you could probably get a comparable model for less than $200 now. I record TV programs frequently(I love the Sopranos and I'm usually half-asleep by 9:00 P.M. on Sunday night, and I record cartoons for my son) and it records easily. The DVD on it is very good, too. I would heartily endorse a Samsung based on my own experience.

[Rooster_Ties]

Thread topic expansion alert!!!

I was originally leaning towards separate DVD and VCR units too, for all the reasons Kevin mentioned.

But, space turns out to be a little bit of an issue too. We've got a wall of built-in bookshelves in our library (which is only about 12 feet by 14 feet in size), and we want to put the TV and DVD/VCR in the bottom of the middle bay of three banks of shelves. Luckily, the shelves rest on pegs, and are adjustable, so we should be able to fit everything in, without taking away from very much book storage space.

Also, we're planning to include a couple small bookshelf-sized speakers, for stereo sound. (Don't care about Dolby Surround much, and we don't have space for all the extra speakers anyway. Simple stereo would be fine with us, and would be way better sound than we've ever had before anyway --- having only had crappy mono-TV's for years and years.)

Probably gonna use a very small "office-sized" low-end bookshelf stereo system (with aux inputs, RCA phono-jacks), in order to amplify the audio coming out of the DVD/VCR unit. It'll also give us AM/FM reception, and play one CD too (no audio cassette, but who cares - haven't touched one of those in years).

Yeah, I know, I know - the DVD will probably play CD's too. But I don't know how else to get AM/FM in that room?? -- PLUS, I'm gonna need some kind of amplifier for the audio coming out of the DVD/VCR anyway, so I gotta have something.

I even saw a very low-end bookshelf receiver the other day at Target (of all places), that was just two small bookshelf-sized speakers with an AM/FM receiver integrated into one of the speaker units. And it had standard RCA-type phono-inputs too for audio from an aux source --- for only like $50. Unfortunately it was some crappy brand (Emerson, I think), but it did at least make me think about looking around for something similar, only a better brand. And heck, for something like that (with no moving parts, other than the radio dial and volume control), I might even consider something like an Emerson (which I would otherwise avoid like the plague), for an application such as this. (And then I'd just use the DVD player for CD's in that room.)

Any overall suggestions for how best to do this whole deal, on a budget???

1. I've already got the a TV that fits into the shelf-space nicely.

2 . But in addition to needing the DCD/VCR combo, I would probably be wanting to buy a new (very inexpensive, meaning cheap, $150 or less) mini-bookshelf audio system (AM/FM, integrated amp, maybe with a CD-player, or maybe no CD-player since I have the DVD player in the chain). I do already have a nearly perfect bookshelf CD/AM/FM unit, but the CD-player door opens up -- so it wouldn't fit into the shelves as easily (since I need to worry about clearance for the CD door). It's one of those motorized doors that opens and closes (up), very smoothly. Great for a desktop (or in it's current use, on top of a dresser in our bedroom), but less good for being in an actual bookshelf.

OK, any minor details that I'm forgetting, in terms of all the input parameters of our room, the shelves, what I already have, and what I'm looking for???

The room is small, with typical old-house plaster-and-lathe walls, and medium carpet. I'm not a wonk about speaker quality and system quality in general (although I want stuff to last!!!), which I know is probably sacrilegious to many of you.

Thanks a bunch for any input anyone has for a cheapskate low-tech guy like me.

Edited May 14, 2004 by Rooster_Ties

[Kevin Bresnahan]

It sounds like you need to look into a receiver/DVD combo machine and couple that with a standalone VCR. As I said, DVD players are far more reliable than VCRs so this combination would likely save you some space while giving you the playback you want. I see that Crutchfield has a cheap Panasonic unit that would fit the bill here but I would look around. Panny's aren't the best these days.

Onkyo makes a really nice looking receiver/DVD combo unit but it's a bit expensive (around $550).

BTW, the best deals in this realm are for "home theater in a box" systems but that would mean getting 5.1 speakers and a combo receiver/DVD player which may be more than you want or need. Sony offers a whole bunch of these but like their other product lines, there is a question about the quality.

Later,

Kevin

[Rooster_Ties]

Thanks Kevin. Yeah, just moments ago I started looking at the low-end home-theater systems for the very first time.

I figured just a pair of standard stereo speakers was the way to go, since we didn't have much space.

OK, I'm really ignorant about multi-speaker set-ups for home-theater. My problem is that I really don't want wires running all over the place, and I suppose I'd have to have speakers in all four corners of the room, plus I guess the low-low-bass speaker in the back of the room too. So that's like three speaker-cables I'd have to run from the shelves up front, to the speakers in the back, right?? (Or I guess I could probably get some wireless system, but then you're talkin' probably a whole 'nother class of audio-products, so we're probably adding lots more $$$ to the base-system price.

Anyway, that's why I was thinking just regular stereo would be OK. (Like I said, we're used to old, mono-TV's. So even just stereo, with speakers farther apart than the width of the TV -- would be a big step up for us.)

Hadn't realized that there were integrated DVD/receivers before. That's definitely a good thought. Maybe I should run around to a bunch of audio-video stores, and talk to some (I shudder at the thought) salesmen!!!

Problem is, as cheap as I am, I know they're gonna wanna pump me up into getting some $2000 system, and I'm all about value for my $$$ (AND I'm CHEAP!!), so they really don't wanna talk to people like me usually.

[Rooster_Ties]

OK, any opinions about this small home-theatre system??

DVD/VCR/AM/FM, the whole thing in one box, plus all the speakers (not that I'm slap-happy about how to handle all those speakers, mind you).

Panasonic SC-HT810V

I only mention it, cuz it was the first DVD/VCR combo that seemed to have AM/FM as well, along with whatever amplification is necessary.

To tell you how green I am about home audio, in general, I've never (ever!) had a component system before, with a separate amplifier. I've always only ever owned integrated bookshelf systems (CD/cassette/AM/FM), or else just glorified boomboxes (when I was in college), and such.

So handle me with kid-gloves, and speak slowly.

Edited May 14, 2004 by Rooster_Ties

[Dan Gould]

Something to consider if you choose to approach the DVD player as also taking over CD audio responsibilities:

We received a home theater system for Christmas, and so my trusty CD changer first went into the closet and then, after we bought our townhome, into the music room.

However, I am less than thrilled with the audio playback capability of the DVD player. For one, there's no programming ability, so if I want to hear a few songs while I do the dishes, I'm SOL. Also, the time display is worthless-it either toggles time elapsed on the disc or time remaining on the disc, there is no track time capability.

Of course, I am generalizing from the home theater we got, whose brand escapes me at the moment, but I do suspect that since their purpose is home theater DVD, music capability is the last thing that gets consideration.

Basically, I do far more listening in the music room than the living room now-though I guess that's the point of havng the listening room ...

[neveronfriday]

Sorry to say, but once you move out of Sony's EX line, build quality goes way down.

Yep.

I have had several Sony products that just didn't cut it. One of their DVD players which had gotten rave reviews across the board, wouldn't play right out of the box, the replacement one had the same error, and the third one, the one I have now, gets regular fits, refusing to play a disc until its system is rebooted.

Sony has turned into a cheapo consumer products manufacturer, and only their top-of-the line products are still worth it.

For myself I made the decision never to buy Sony again, especially because their service (or service partners) here in Germany were just shite.

Depressing, because in the past, Sony was affordable quality. Today it's mostly overpriced crap, considering the money spent on units that don't perform (at all).

Cheers!

[Rooster_Ties]

So, if not Sony, then what brand(s) can be trusted on the low-end (price-wise)??

Or do you pretty much get what you pay for, regardless of brand??

[wolff]

I'd get a $99 VCR and a $99 DVD. Keep them seperate. I bought my DVD player at Blockbuster for $89 and it's worked great. At the prices you are looking at do not sweat it.

In wall speakers are an option or get small speakers with wall brackets. This could work nicely in your small room, and leave room for a subwoofer. You would run wire under carpet or in the wall or behind molding.

[Aggie87]

Rooster -

Just caught up with this thread. About a month ago I purchased the Sony unit in your original post. I wanted an inexpensive combo player (<$200), and figured the Sony would be the best of the bunch.

Well, the VCR played fine, but the DVD player seemed to have problems playing any DVD. I'd load one, and it would literally take about 4-5 minutes to read it. I couldn't figure out if I was supposed to be pushing some button on the remote to get it to read (faster). Whether it was defective, or just a design flaw, I didn't like it, and returned it.

Basically went with the concept that wolff espouses, separate inexpensive players. Picked up a Sony VCR for about $80, and the Pioneer DVD player that also plays SACDs (for about $150), both at Best Buy.

[Jazzmoose]

You know, when it comes to brand name quality, I really have to wonder whether any big name is worth it in video. Best VCR I ever had was a cheapie Goldstar that lasted ten years and looked great. Beat the heck out of the fancier brands I had before and have had after. Maybe it's all just a matter of luck, I don't know.

[wolff]

Many mass market/cheap items have same inards with different face plates..

[Johnny E]

Any comments on this RCA Home Theater System would be much appreciated.

[Kevin Bresnahan]

Any comments on this RCA Home Theater System would be much appreciated.

Power, power, power... that's all this unit has going for it. I would bet my bottom dollar that the little speakers sound like doo-doo regardless of the wattage but as I say with any stereo speaker purchase, you must go and listen to this before buying. My guess is that you will walk away. BTW, 150 Watts for a powered sub may sound like a lot but take it from me, it ain't.

FWIW, RCA's quality has been atrocious for years. This unit may be better... who knows... but still, I wouldn't bet on it.

As bad as people seem to be knocking on Panasonic, they still seem to be one of the best in the "bang for the buck" department. If CC is your preference, this Panny seems like a pretty good one. Note that the sub has 220Watts... much more likely to be what you need. As an added bonus, it has a built-in DVD player. Panny's DVD players have a pretty good rep. It's also progressive scan. Best Buy has pretty much the same unit, minus the DVD at this URL.

Later,

Kevin

[Johnny E]

Thanks Kevin, that's very helpful.

[Rooster_Ties]

OK, I still haven't bought anything yet -- but this one's got my attention at the moment.

Anybody have any opinions about this model?? It's on sale this week at Nebraska Furniture Mart (here in KC) for only $204.

The main things I like about it are that it plays both DVD's and CD's, and is a combined "bookshelf" system, with an integrated amp. Plus, it appears to have an AM/FM tuner built-in too (a definitely plus). I don't give a rat's ass about the cassette deck, but hey - if I never use it, who cares??

Having an integrated unit, especially one that doesn't take up too much space, is a definite plus -- since this is going in a small room, a library to be exact (about 9 by 11 feet in size). I'd like to devote one corner of a single shelf to the unit, with speakers right in the bookshelves on either side (probably with the unit and one speaker side-by-side, far on one side -- and then the other speaker far on the other side).

I don't really care if the CD part is programmable or not, since I rarely program CD's all that much.

I'm planning to get a separate el-cheapo VCR, and pipe it in the back of this unit. Edit: Looking more closely at the back-pannel, it looks like there aren't aux-inputs for video (best as I can see, anyway). Hmmmm.... Guess I'll have to have an A/B switch for the a/v from this unit vs. the a/v from the el-cheapo VCR. Or does anybody have any better ideas about how to handle this?? I suppose I could also route the video from the DVD player through the VCR, and on to the TV --- maybe.

Link: Panasonic 5-Disc DVD/CD Micro System with Progressive Scan and 3-Way Speaker System - Silver with wood grain (Best Buy listing)

Link: Panasonic - 5-Disc Progressive-Scan DVD Home Theater System (same thing at Nebraska Furniture Mart)

The specs at the Best Buy site seem to be a bit more complete.

Edited January 20, 2005 by Rooster_Ties

[Leeway]

Perhaps a bit off topic, but my wife was watching one of those rehab/remodeling shows on HGTV -- I think it was "Renovation Generation"-- and my attention was caught by the words "media room."

The house belonged to a doctor and his wife. The renovation must have cost hundreds of thousands of dollars. The doctor wanted a media room, so renovated the basement. Besides all the usual goodies like a big flat-screen TV, etc, get this, he had a wall containing at least a dozen (quite possibly more, there were too many to count while the camera panned) McIntosh top of the line amps. All you could see were those cool glowing blue Mac amp lights. Doc said he liked to crank it WAY up. I would guess he had $75,000 in stereo equipment, minimum. I don't know what kind of speakers he had.

As Fitzgerald said, "The rich are different from you and me." I believe it was Hemingway who reputedly said, "yeah, they're richer!"

[Rooster_Ties]

My "media room" is gonna have a 10-15 year old TV in it, plus (probably) the $204.00 DVD/Amp unit two posts above this, plus an el-cheapo VCR that'll probably run me $60.

And I'm sure I'll be reasonably happy with the results. Nothin' fancy, but certainly adequate for my needs – at least for the next 5 years or so.

By then, there’ll be some new “mega-DVD” format, and HDTV’s all over the place (and much cheaper ones too, at that) – so I figure why should I invest a whole lot in bleeding-edge stuff now.

Edited January 21, 2005 by Rooster_Ties

[neveronfriday]

... get this, he had a wall containing at least a dozen (quite possibly more, there were too many to count while the camera panned) McIntosh top of the line amps. All you could see were those cool glowing blue Mac amp lights.

Those are some damn expensive disco lights.

I guess the mystery speakers must have cost an equal amount because it would be a shame to drive anything but the best speakers with these.

And, $75.000 doesn't come near what a setup like that would cost (just think about the amount of money invested in cables alone to get the best out of it) ... unless he got a discount for buying a whole production run.

My guess is that he was driving speakers and subs with mono-blocks, maybe even doing some decent bi-amping. If you include the speakers for a setup like that (all asuming that he went with better ones in a surround sound setup) we're talking way above 100.000 dollars, probably more than twice as much, all depending on the discounts he got.

If you do run a setup like that, acoustics become a major problem and lots of money has to go into making a room acoustically suitable. Besides that, you need more than ... and so on.

I've seen a setup similar to the one you're describing (at an audio fair in Frankfurt, Germany) and the price tag came close to a million Euro, all told.

Crazy, but if you do play a THX disc through this it would probably sound all the alarms at the Pentagon.

And in Peking.

Cheers!

[Leeway]

Deus, I probably did underprice it. The host of the show asked the good doctor, "Don't the neighbors complain when you turn it up?" This despite the fact that the house was on a generously-sized, wooded lot. He responded, that he could only do so because it was in the basement, o/w it would be too loud. I have never seen a bank of Mac amps like that; those blue meters were mesmerizing.

Doc, if you happen to frequent this board sometime, and see this thread, I want to come over and play some Blue Notes on your stereo