tooter

So here's the FINAL list. Not doing any more!!!! *Primary baritone players 1. 1910 Harry Carney USA* 2. 1910 Jack Washington USA* 3. 1911 Chuck Gentry USA* 4. 1911 Ernie Carceres USA* 5. 1916 Charlie Fowlkes USA* 6. 1918 Bill Graham USA* 7. 1920 Jerome Richardson USA 8. 1921 Jimmy Giuffre USA 9. 1921 Tony Scott USA 10. 1922 Cecil Payne USA* 11. 1922 Danny Bank USA* 12. 1923 Serge Chaloff USA* 13. 1924 Bill Perkins USA 14. 1925 Leo Parker USA* 15. 1925 Sahib Shihab USA* 16. 1926 Sol Schlinger USA* 17. 1926 Med Flory USA 18. 1926 Günter Kronberg Germany 19. 1926 Michel de Villers France* 20. 1927 Gerry Mulligan USA* 21. 1927 Bud Shank USA 22. 1928 Jay Cameron USA* 23. 1928 Jack Nimitz USA* 24. 1928 Lars Gullin Sweden* 25. 1928 Harry Klein UK* 26. 1928 Bob Efford UK* 27. 1928 Gene Allen USA* 28. 1928 Bob Gordon USA* 29. 1928 Pee Wee Moore USA* 30. 1929 Maurice Simon USA* 31. 1929 Joe Temperley UK* 32. 1929 Pat Patrick USA* 33. 1930 Pepper Adams USA* 34. 1930 Bill Hood* 35. 1931 Gil Melle USA* 36. 1933 Ronnie Ross UK* 37. 1933 Charles Davis USA* 38. 1934 Manfred Schulze Germany* 39. 1935 Abdul Al-Khabyyr Canada 40. 1936 Nick Brignola USA* 41. 1936 Werner Lüdi Switzerland 42. 1940 Hamiet Bluitt USA* 43. 1941 Ronnie Cuber USA* 44. 1941 Howard Johnson USA 45. 1941 Charles Tyler USA 46. 1944 John Surman UK* 47. 1944 Turk Mauro USA 48. 1945 Gunnar Bergsten Sweden* 49. 1950 Jim Hartog USA* 50. 1955 Marty Erlich USA 51. 1956 Gary Smulyan USA* 52. 1959 Claire Daly USA* 53. 1959 Alan Barnes UK 54. 1959 Scott Robinson USA 55. 1967 Stephen Schorn Germany* 56. 1968 Herwig Gradischnig Austria 57. ? Bob Gioga USA* 58. ? Tate Houston USA* 59. ? Jack Sharpe UK* 60. ? Roger Rosenberg ?* 61. ? Trevor Koehler USA* 62. ? Eddie de Verteuil USA* 63. ? Wolf Hudalla Germany* 64. ? Don Davidson ?* 65. ? Bob Leonard ?* 66. ? Perry White ?* 67. ? William Boucaya France* 68. ? Urs Blöchlinger Switzerland 69. ? Beat Blaser Switzerland 70. ? George Barrow USA* 71. ? Marty Flax USA* 72. ? Per Goldschmidt ?* 73. ? John Williams UK* 74. ? Chris Biscoe UK* 75. ? Musa Kaleem USA 76. ? Rune Falk ?*

can't find anything on Hudalla either. Schulze was born in 1934 AFAIK. Okay, call it that. List amended.

Expanded list of 50! *Primary baritone players 1. 1910 Harry Carney USA* 2. 1910 Jack Washington USA* 3. 1911 Chuck Gentry USA* 4. 1916 Charlie Fowlkes USA* 5. 1918 Bill Graham USA* 6. 1921 Jimmy Giuffre USA 7. 1922 Cecil Payne USA* 8. 1922 Danny Bank USA* 9. 1923 Serge Chaloff USA* 10. 1924 Bill Perkins USA 11. 1925 Leo Parker USA* 12. 1925 Sahib Shihab USA* 13. 1926 Sol Schlinger USA* 14. 1926 Günter Kronberg Germany 15. 1926 Michel de Villers France* 16. 1927 Gerry Mulligan USA* 17. 1928 Jack Nimitz USA* 18. 1928 Lars Gullin Sweden* 19. 1928 Harry Klein UK* 20. 1928 Bob Efford UK* 21. 1928 Gene Allen USA* 22. 1928 Bob Gordon USA* 23. 1928 Pee Wee Moore USA* 24. 1929 Joe Temperley UK* 25. 1929 Pat Patrick USA* 26. 1930 Pepper Adams USA* 27. 1930 Bill Hood* 28. 1931 Gil Melle USA* 29. 1933 Ronnie Ross UK* 30. 1933 Charles Davis USA* 31. 1934 Manfred Schulze Germany* 32. 1935 Abdul Al-Khabyyr Canada 33. 1936 Nick Brignola USA* 34. 1940 Hamiet Bluitt USA* 35. 1941 Ronnie Cuber USA* 36. 1944 John Surman UK* 37. 1944 Turk Mauro USA 38. 1945 Gunnar Bergsten Sweden* 39. 1950 Jim Hartog USA* 40. 1956 Gary Smulyan USA* 41. 1959 Claire Daly USA* 42. 1967 Stephen Schorn Germany* 43. 1968 Herwig Gradischnig Austria 44. ? Bob Gioga USA* 45. ? Tate Houston USA* 46. ? Jack Sharpe UK* 47. ? Roger Rosenberg ?* 48. ? Trevor Koehler USA* 49. ? Eddie de Verteuil USA* 50. ? Wolf Hudalla Germany*

Added too - full details here -good!

Added to the list - see below. Couldn't find a year of birth for Wolf Hudalla and not sure right on Manfred Schulze - 1930?

That's redressed the imbalance of Europeans, which was very much in favour of the UK, and more to go I see. I was certainly aware that continental Europe was under-represented and was thinking of adding Flurin Casura as nobody from Switzerland yet Have I got the details right? I ran into a bit of language difficulty.

I've added a few doublers but very far from all - takes too long. But here's the list as it stands now. *Primary baritone players 1. 1910 Harry Carney USA* 2. 1910 Jack Washington USA* 3. 1911 Chuck Gentry USA* 4. 1916 Charlie Fowlkes USA* 5. 1918 Bill Graham USA* 6. 1921 Jimmy Giuffre USA 7. 1922 Cecil Payne USA* 8. 1922 Danny Bank USA* 9. 1923 Serge Chaloff USA* 10. 1924 Bill Perkins USA 11. 1925 Leo Parker USA* 12. 1925 Sahib Shihab USA* 13. 1926 Sol Schlinger USA* 14. 1926 Michel de Villers France* 15. 1927 Gerry Mulligan USA* 16. 1928 Jack Nimitz USA* 17. 1928 Lars Gullin Sweden* 18. 1928 Harry Klein UK* 19. 1928 Bob Efford UK* 20. 1928 Gene Allen USA* 21. 1928 Bob Gordon USA* 22. 1928 Pee Wee Moore USA* 23. 1929 Joe Temperley UK* 24. 1929 Pat Patrick USA* 25. 1930 Pepper Adams USA* 26. 1930 Bill Hood* 27. 1931 Gil Melle USA* 28. 1933 Ronnie Ross UK* 29. 1933 Charles Davis USA* 30. 1935 Abdul Al-Khabyyr Canada 31. 1936 Nick Brignola USA* 32. 1940 Hamiet Bluitt USA* 33. 1941 Ronnie Cuber USA* 34. 1944 John Surman UK* 35. 1944 Turk Mauro USA 36. 1945 Gunnar Bergsten Sweden* 37. 1950 Jim Hartog USA* 38. 1956 Gary Smulyan USA* 39. Circa1966 Claire Daly USA* 40. ? Bob Gioga USA* 41. ? Tate Houston USA* 42. ? Jack Sharpe UK* 43. ? Roger Rosenberg ?* 44. ? Trevor Koehler USA* 45. ? Eddie de Verteuil USA*

Interesting read, marcello - thanks for the reference. I can't see any mention of baritone in there so is it safe to say he is a doubler? I've left the * out for him. Got year of birth from there though. Nationality is another source of confusion - lots of these players have moved around. For instance, Bob Efford was born in the UK but has of course been in the USA for a long long time now. Ronnie Ross was born in India but counted as UK for the list.

There's an entry at AMG but no details. Google produces nothing at all. Added to list but can you supply any more info? Nationality? Year of birth? What kind of salute? Anything like Billie's?

Another 1928 (PWM)! Trying to look up movie.

Well, okay, but only those who made a real impact or the list could become kilometres long.

Found this site which gives a lot of names of baritone players. I was gratified to find that the Ronnie Ross link there leads to our website. Too many names to list them all though - haven't heard of most.

Another one I thought of - Bill Hood.

Gene Allen already there, Jack, but Jack Washington is a new name to me. Must look him up. One of the earliest? He was with Basie 1936-43 and rarely had an opportunity to solo, with Pres and Hershel in the band ..... I added Gene Allen because you didn't have a year of birth for him. Jack Washington rejoined Basie after the war, 1946-49. Has a nice feature piece "Lopin'" rec. 5/21/47 for RCA Victor. I beg your pardon! I missed the birth year. Will correct the list now.

Gene Allen already there, Jack, but Jack Washington is a new name to me. Must look him up. One of the earliest? He was with Basie 1936-43 and rarely had an opportunity to solo, with Pres and Hershel in the band ..... There was mention before here of Charlie Fowlkes and whether he soloed with Basie. I don't think the answer to that question has emerged, has it? He would have been playing alongside the two Franks?

Yes, good additons to the list, brownie, but if we are including only primary instrument baritone players, would you say Perk should be there? I would have thought tenor his main instrument. But I will put him in pending further guidance! Perkins played baritone on a number of albums but, yes, his main instrument was tenor. Now that I see what you had cooked for your BFT meal, I feel sorry at having stayed out. Looks like a mighty fine compilation Okay, I'll strike him from the list then. I wonder if multi-instrumentalists themselves would agree always with our assessments of what is their primary. Perk is perhaps clear enough but how about, say, Marty Erlich? Does he qualify as a primary baritone man? And Jimmy Giuffre? Tenor again? Or clarinet? Thanks for your remarks about BFT#36, brownie. Expect a PM on this subject!

Yes, good additons to the list, brownie, but if we are including only primary instrument baritone players, would you say Perk should be there? I would have thought tenor his main instrument. But I will put him in pending further guidance!

1931 Gil Melle USA 1926 Sol Schlinger USA 1922 Danny Bank USA Why did I miss all of these????

Gene Allen already there, Jack, but Jack Washington is a new name to me. Must look him up. One of the earliest?

It always was! stereojack said he thought I played the baritone and I did, just once - one gig. Too heavy for my weak frame so I stuck to tenor.

Okay, Mike - hell of a job - dates of birth! This is only the list of baritone players for whom it is their primary instrument. Some gaps for dob's and even countries. 1928 was a popular year. If anyone can come up with more names, please supply all details. Some from my original list omitted - i.e, Jean Eteve who does not seem to be primarily a baritone player I now see. *Primary baritone players 1. 1910 Harry Carney USA* 2. 1910 Jack Washington USA* 3. 1911 Chuck Gentry USA* 4. 1916 Charlie Fowlkes USA* 5. 1918 Bill Graham USA* 6. 1921 Jimmy Giuffre USA 7. 1922 Cecil Payne USA* 8. 1922 Danny Bank USA* 9. 1923 Serge Chaloff USA* 10. 1925 Leo Parker USA* 11. 1925 Sahib Shihab USA* 12. 1926 Sol Schlinger USA* 13. 1926 Michel de Villers France* 14. 1927 Gerry Mulligan USA* 15. 1928 Jack Nimitz USA* 16. 1928 Lars Gullin Sweden* 17. 1928 Harry Klein UK* 18. 1928 Bob Efford UK* 19. 1928 Gene Allen USA* 20. 1928 Bob Gordon USA* 21. 1928 Pee Wee Moore USA* 22. 1929 Joe Temperley UK* 23. 1929 Pat Patrick USA* 24. 1930 Pepper Adams USA* 25. 1930 Bill Hood* 26. 1931 Gil Melle USA* 27. 1933 Ronnie Ross UK* 28. 1933 Charles Davis USA* 29. 1936 Nick Brignola USA* 30. 1940 Hamiet Bluitt USA* 31. 1941 Ronnie Cuber USA* 32. 1944 John Surman UK* 33. 1945 Gunnar Bergsten Sweden* 34. 1950 Jim Hartog USA* 35. 1956 Gary Smulyan USA* 36. Circa1966 Claire Daly USA* 37. ? Bob Gioga USA* 38. ? Tate Houston USA* 39. ? Jack Sharpe UK* 40. ? Roger Rosenberg ?* 41. ? Trevor Koehler USA* 42. ? Eddie de Verteuil USA* 43. ? Sayyd Abdul Al-Khabyy ?*

Sure, Al. I thought you might be getting one from a US participant but then when no comment from you materialised.... Send me a PM as to where to send it. Pity, though, could have done with your input Will be in the mail tomorrow, Al. How's that for service? Lucky I haven't yet deleted from hard drive.

Phew! Passed inspection by the boss man then? So here’s the list of baritone players that I thought of, Mike, off the cuff and without hesitation (almost)! They all play (or played) the instrument as their primary as far as I know. No particular order. 1. Gerry Mulligan 2. Ronnie Ross 3. Harry Carney 4. Charlie Fowlkes 5. Serge Chaloff 6. Sahib Shihab 7. Gary Smulyan 8. Charles Davis 9. Nick Brignola 10. Jack Nimitz 11. Ronnie Cuber 12. Lars Gullin 13. Gunnar Bergsten 14. Jean Eteve 15. John Surman 16. Claire Daly 17. Bob Gordon 18. Harry Klein 19. Pepper Adams 20. Bob Gioga 21. Bob Efford 22. Tate Houston 23. Cecil Payne 24. Leo Parker 25. Joe Temperley 26. Mario Rivera 27. Jack Sharpe 28. Jim Hartog 29. Gene Allen 30. Pat Patrick 31. Hamiet Bluitt I’m sure more could be added. And then there’s a very long list of those play as a double or dabble on the instrument 1. Bill Perkins 2. Jimmy Giuffre 3. Al Cohn 4. Zoot Sims 5. Tubby Hayes And on and on….

Sure, Al. I thought you might be getting one from a US participant but then when no comment from you materialised.... Send me a PM as to where to send it. Pity, though, could have done with your input

Sorry, typo on 8 - edited. Perk on bari, not tenor. Good to hear you liked it, Red.