Stompin at the Savoy

I am no great shakes as a guitarist but having played since '68 I can recognize when somebody has paid some dues. I think Lowe is his own worst enemy and wrong about Remmler as well as unkind to a person who can't reply but I will stop posting here if that's what it takes for him to return.

Now I get it: calling somebody who was a professional musician "not a good guitarist" is not slagging them. Moreover, suggesting the reason she was not a good guitarist because of drug use - not trashing her! Pointing out that she played "wrong notes" there, there and there is also just not slagging her! I'm sorry, if all that is not slagging her, what is? What would it take to slag her? And of course if you actually listen to her, she is actually a pretty great player. She was gifted; IMO Lowe is not in her league.

Hmmmmm... yeah. I guess I never did come down hard on him about slagging Emily Remmler. (Shrug)

So what actually happened with Allen Lowe? I seem to have missed the final controversy. Now I feel bad for coming down so hard on him for slagging Emily Remmler...

I had similar experiences listening to VOA, BBC, Radio Nederlands etc. over shortwave back in the 80's. Conover had a ponderous way of speaking, presumably going so slow so non-native speakers of English could follow. I also enjoyed his Standards program. I remember a very good interview he played with pianist Bill Evans. I was also thinking today it's a shame they are closing it all down because the VOA always had good programming: they would suck them in with jazz and rock and then give them the news and discuss democracy. AFRTS was good too.

I've had some issues with Jim over confusion of fact and opinion, his superior attitude, absolutism, certainty of being in the right, overbearing approach - in short what bothers me most about him is he reminds me an awful lot of myself!

👍

This is one of my most-played Mosaic sets.

Ordered.

I suppose forgettable came up in the context of albums you don't really hate but listen to once only. I probably should have said 1 listen albums or something rather than forgettable. I've been thinking about this recently because a lot of the albums I own qualify as one listen albums. I don't know if there is anything to be learned from that other than stream the album if poss before buying?

How do you know he was popular? Wait a minute this is stupid. You are equating popularity with quality? That makes Taylor Swift into a genius musician. No, your Harlem was wrong? gambit is silly. I'm not going to dignify that with any further replies.

It doesn't make sense, Jim. You say he was once popular in Harlem. Sounds like hearsay to me. A performer can be popular, ie attract customers to a venue, without actually being popular among the entire local population. So that's bs. After that Columbia album he pretty much disappears. You have a point there and I cannot really solve it. I was using forgettable as the opposite of memorable. If you forget you bought an album that seems the opposite of memorable to me, therefore forgettable.

Do you really expect an answer to this question-begging nonsense?

OK I listened to this. It is certainly a much better record than other Morris recordings I have heard. The producer appears to have prevailed upon Morris to restrain his playing while other players solo and play only bass and quiet chords. They may have been going for some sort of pop or blues crossover and Morris' right hand is considerably simplified from what he played on the At Count Basie's Vanguard album a few years earlier. He still frequently holds down his fingers for several measures... The other players, Edmond Hall and a bunch of Basie alumni, are good and play well. Morris doesn't embarrass himself but also doesn't really excel either; the record is pretty good in spite of him.

OK I will check out the Columbia album.

Steve, you continue to make my point for me: earlier you claimed this was not a "humdrum" album but now you admit that "this is one of many non-desert-island discs". Let's tally up the score, eh? You totally forgot you owned this or what it sounds like. After listening to it again, you admit it isn't great (ie not a desert island disc). Your defense of Marlowe Morris amounts to: well, that's how organ jazz sounded in those days! Or "their styles may not strike a chord with all listeners today at ANY moment" and you include yourself in this group. This is hardly a ringing affirmation of how wonderful it sounds. Remember my post that you were reacting to? The things you are saying now are not terribly different from my initial reaction above: you forgot what it sounded like or that you owned it; you don't think it is a desert island disc; and admit a lot of people aren't all that impressed with Morris, including yourself. The fact is nobody is running out to complete their collections of pre-Jimmy Smith organ jazz. I am not aware of any Marlowe M fan clubs. Many of those players, including Marlowe Morris, were used to creating a wall of sound, had trouble adapting their solo playing to the needs of an ensemble and tended to overwhelm and muddy up what the other players were doing. The author of the Mosaic booklet admits as much about Morris in the booklet. In my opinion Morris is even worse than Basie or Waller on the organ, sounding like a cross between a carnival and a late 50's ice rink. But that's one man's opinion: don't let that stop you from spending your time lost in admiration of Marlowe Morris' organ recordings...

OK if you say so. But in the privacy of your own room, with nobody else around, please ask yourself how much time you have spent listening to Marlow Morris and how much time in future you see yourself spending listening to Marlow Morris. Right up there with Miles Davis, right?

Yeah, I know and don't much like Basie's organ playing or that of Fats Waller, who tutored Basie on organ. As a jazz instrument, the organ had not yet matured at this point.

When I single him out and listen to lines he is playing he seems alright to me. Maybe it's the instrument he is playing or the settings? It's pretty awful.

Yes, agreed. On the other hand we have Steve denying the album could be ho-hum but it turned out totally forgettable to him. I'm weird but I find this amusing!

Okay, so you got home from the store and discovered gee whiz, I already have a copy of this! You didn't remember listening to it or owning it. Isn't this the very definition of a forgettable album? By comparison, the Joe Newman album included earlier on the set, Joe Newman and His Band, is to me a memorable outing and on a different level as far as re-listen quotient.

Seems kind of pricey for a 240 page book. No doubt they will make up for that by having extremely small print. I hope they put out a kindle version.

Well I have listened to the other two Jimmy Rushing albums on this set: VRS-8505 Jimmy Rushing And His All Stars VRS-8513 Jimmy Rushing – Listen To The Blues Rushing and his all stars was actually pretty good and fit pretty well within the rubric of 'small group swing'. Listen to the Blues is a real stretch to be considered small group swing! When they start playing pentatonic electric guitar licks a la Chuck Berry its not a gray area. I think the set would have been stronger if they cut it off at 5 disks and only included the second of the Rushing albums: And His All Stars. Marlowe Morris' playing has not aged all that well. Even the fellow who wrote the notes was kind of apologetic about the Marlowe. The whole album - A Night at Count Basie's - is pretty forgettable. I liked hearing Basie talk. The music - eh. I'll probably never listen to it again.

In his autobiography Basie said something to the effect that Rushing had been pigen-holed as a blues singer but he actually had a background in jazz and pop song or something like that. So I was expecting more of a jazz bent here.