ShowsOn

Err yeah, in a form that doesn't make it cost $350.

For anyone who wishes Sony Legacy would release the original mix of Bitches Brew on CD, please add your votes here: http://feedback.legacyrecordings.com/forums/6333-reissue-requests/suggestions/1104331-please-release-the-original-mix-of-miles-davis-b

It's possibly that the differences in quality are simply because the King reissues are using Sony's digital remixes, whereas these Masterworks reissues appear to be using the original mixes for the first time since the original vinyl releases. So Myers isn't just comparing different mastering, he is also comparing new digital mixes against the original RVG analog mixes. It doesn't really surprise me that the remixes would sound better, after all, improving the sound was probably why they were remixed in the first place. These recordings have a lot of compression on them, so by remixing you can immediately remove a layer of processing. Personally I think they should use whatever mixes sound best. But it seems that one way to justify a reissue program these days is to use the original mix, preferably by using the original master tape. Of course in the past advertising and promoting CD reissues as "digitally remixed" was considered an important selling point to motivate people to upgrade their vinyl copies! So it seems we have come full circle; now saying that the album was mastered from the original tape is considered what people should desire.

I won't be getting the box because I seem to have about 80% of the material on it already. I will definitely get the California Concert: The Hollywood Palladium release because I've wanted to hear that for a long time, and the fact it will be in the actual concert sequence and with bonus tracks is great. I am almost certain that most of the existing Legacy CTI reissues are remixes. It seems the gimmick with this release program is that they will be using the original master tapes, i.e. NOT remixes. I have some original RVG cut LPs of CTI albums, and I think they benefit from being remixed. But of course remixing means you aren't actually listening to exactly the same thing that was originally released. Maybe I'll pick up the new reissue of Red Clay just to see how it differs. But the way these albums were recorded - with a lot of compression and even sometimes distortion - I wouldn't be surprised if I prefer the remixed versions that I already have.

Sadly it looks like the next batch of Analogue Productions SACDs, including Herbie Hancock - Maiden Voyage and Lee Morgan's - The Sidewinder, has been delayed until October; exactly when, who knows.

It's possible that the new LPs were made from the original LP cutting master, i.e. a tape that is equalised for LP cutting and that is a generation down from the actual master tape. It's possible Legacy is just saving the original mix for ANOTHER CD reissue, perhaps the 50th Anniversary.

I don't understand why the 40th Anniversary version that costs $80+ couldn't include BOTH the re-mix and the best sounding version of the original mix! Hey, they could just make a digital clone of the Master Sound version if that is the best original mix version possible. I guess they could just be keeping the original mix for the 50th Anniversary...

I don't think it is the format that counts, it is the quality of the mastering. Sadly for Blue Note albums, the most easily available CD versions - the RVG editions - are also among the worst sounding due to the use of compression and treble boosting.

I completely agree. Removing wow and flutter from audio tracks is a standard digital processing technique that has been going on about the last half decade in film restoration. If you want a good example, compare the constant wow and flutter on the music of the original DVD release of the film The Robe (1953) with the amazingly improved track on the Blu-ray release of the same film. It was a very similar issue to Song For My Father. All existing prints and audio masters for some reason had serious wow and flutter throughout the entire musical score, but it was all removed by hours worth of manual digital processing. A firm in California named Audio Mechanics specialises in removing wow and flutter from entire film soundtracks: http://www.audiomechanics.com/ They would've been able to fix Song For My Father in a few weeks, when most of their film projects take months.

I'm very disappointed that the regular Legacy Edition won't include the Tanglewood set. To get that I'd have to buy the Anniversary Edition with the LPs that I don't even need.

Thanks for your advice, but I'm tough, I could handle being banned by a forum that censors posts for absurd reasons. It's the mastering that counts. If you get the Analog Products SACD of The Sidewinder, you'll probably like it a lot. It isn't exactly hard for the mastering to be better than the RVG CD.

Well that's just petty. There's just no need for such a personality cult, a bit of humility goes a long way...

Yeah deleting that thread is just typical of the censorial policy of the forum. But it gets even stupider, I posted this link on the SH forum: Which contains the following quote: I posted that link in the the following thread concerning the mastering of the Lee Morgan - Sidewinder SACD, where Steve claimed that he found the master tape that hadn't been used since the original vinyl. Well, here is the thread, it has been deleted: http://www.stevehoffman.tv/forums/showpost.php?p=3742233&postcount=1

Yes, you've got to own one of these SACDs before you know exactly how screwed up the RVG CDs are.

More Analog Productions Blue Note SACDs now up for pre-order here: http://store.acousticsounds.com/index.cfm?get=results&orderby=13&ComingSoon=true&categoryID=4 Of course they will be cheaper in other stores like CDPacific.com if they can ever actually get them in stock.

I think that sometimes the perception of a collapsed stereo spread is a side effect of the compression. For example, on the RVG Blue Train SACD, there is more compression on the right channel than the left. This makes that channel louder, which is perceived as a narrowing. Maiden Voyage is in the second batch of Analog Productions releases, so I doubt it will come out for about another year. They're only half way through the first 25.

I agree that Maiden Voyage is one of the better RVGs, but I'm certain that the stereo spread has been narrowed. I know some people like that because it makes it sound more modern, but personally I hate it. The stereo spread should be left as is. It is a historical fact that stereo recordings were made that way early on, and it shouldn't be messed with.

Probably after October this year. It isn't one of the first 25 which will be released between now and October: http://www.audiowavemusic.com/AudioWaveMusicFlyer.html Save $3 a month, by the end of the year you'll have enough cash for it. The two I'm really looking forward to are Herbie Hancock - Takin' Off and Horace Silver - Cape Verdean Blues. On the Analog Productions side, I can't wait for Herbie Hancock - Maiden Voyage.

I hope Joe Harley will reply with some answers. But he has indirectly answered some of your questions on the Steve Hoffman forums. For example, in this post concerning finding the original master tape of Out to Lunch he mentions this: Incidentally, Harley says that there will be an AudioWave CD of Out to Lunch mastered from this master tape for the first time ever. Many Blue Note master tapes were copied and thrown out, so the only existing master tapes are copies (those copies should be called masters because they are all that is left to master from!). Steve Hoffman mentioned this in this thread concerning finding the original Lee Morgan - Sidewinder master tape, which was considered lost and has never been used for a CD release of the album.

I finally received a copy of Joe Henderson - Page One, and it sounds fantastic. Finally a Blue Note where the bass cuts through instead of sounding like it was off in a different room! By my calculations the first track on the RVG CD has about 5 dB of compression applied! That's even more than the RVG Blue Train SACD. The graph below compares Blue Bossa on the CD layer of the AP, and the RVG CD after both have been WaveGained to the same perceived loudness. Obviously the RVG has had the dynamic range completely destroyed. Especially annoying is how heavily the limiter is used during the saxophone solo. The channel narrowing is bad enough, but the heavy limiting is what really kills the sound of the horns. And the really sad thing, it is actually one of the BETTER sounding RVG CDs I own! Well, I did own it. I sold it on eBay.

Anyone picked up any more of these SACDs? Joe Henderson - Page One, Hank Mobley - Caddy for Daddy and Ike Quebec - Bossa Nova Soul Samba have all started shipping from audiophile retailers. All three are on Acoustic Sounds' top 10 SACD list: http://store.acousticsounds.com/cat/4/SACD I'm still waiting on my copy of Page One to ship from CDPacific.com that I ordered in the first week of August!

Thanks

Could you post the number on the hub of the playing side of the CD. That would make it possible to differentiate between the flawed and corrected pressings. You'll probably need a magnifying glass in order to read the numbers.

I would be more excited if someone other than RVG did the mastering. They can still call them RVG Editions, but just get someone who doesn't use any compression and treble boosting.

Yep, just turn the volume control up. Blue Train sounds really good. I only have a cheap SACD layer, I've listened to it mostly via my computer or via my iPod so I listen to the CD layer which sounds excellent.