Big Beat Steve

I systematicalloy removed the price stickers too. But when I buy a secondhand one today that still has its "New record" price sticker (underneath the current secondhand sticker) from a local record shop (that I spent lots of money at from 1975 to its demise in the very early 2000s) I will leave it on too. For old times sake ... And for much the same reason I also retained the price stickers from Dobell's in London (usually attached to the rear of the sleeve) that were still in place on some LPs I bought secondhand in London throughout the 90s. Reminds me of all the recods I was unable to afford there during my Easter Holiday stays in London in 1975 to 1977 when I was still in school.

Haven't tried lighter fluid yet but I found that hot air from a hair drier works very well to soften the glue of the sticker enough so you can peel it off without pulling off chips of paper from cover surface at the same time. However, in recent months I was faced with the sticker problem in almost all of its embodiments. In August of last year my favorite local used record shop got in a huge jazz LP collection, and I bought quite a load from that collection over time (including 2 weeks ago at another clearout sale). However, the previous owner had had the nasty habit of sticking a paper-based sticker almost the size of a letter address sticker (with the number of the record in his collection inscribed on it with felt tip pen) in an upper corner of each and every LP. And these stickers had aged rather poorly and differently over time (with no apparent link to the time they had been left on the sleeves, judging by the numbers). On some the glue had dried and the stickers literally fell off, leaving just some whitish powdery residue on the sleeves (that scrapes off with your fingernail if you insist long enough). Some stickers peeled off nicely, leaving hardly any marks, whereas others (more stubborn ones) had to be warmed with a hairdryer or treated with a bit of water mixed with dishwasher fluid to come off well enough. But some resisted any attempts at warming or treating with fluids. So the only solution (that would not damage the cover surface itself) I was able to come up with was to lightly wet the stickers with water and then rub their paper layer off with my thumb. Primitive, and you have to insist yet be careful (particularly when it's a U.S. cardboard sleeve). But it eventually worked and just left some fairly invisible marks of almost-dried glue. Still figuring out how to get rid of these final remnants ...

One more (mentioned now to tip the scales a bit in favor of the distaff part of the artists mentioned ) : Former big band vocalist June Richmond! Apparently forgotten enough in her country of origin by the mid-70s to see her name misspelled as "June Richman" by the oh so enthusiastic compilers and annotators of the Joyce label (whose LP-5001 - "Count Basie`s Jubilee" - I just spun). @Niko: Yes - Rhoda Scott was big in France. Most of her discography originated there. Lou Bennett also was a household name. Not to be confused with Benny Bennet who worked with various jazz notables in France in the 40s and 50s, but later shifted towards popular Latin sounds.

Never mind ... blues is part of jazz! 😄

I DON'T particularly like flute in jazz but I do like the "Nuts about ..." Sam Most LP.

Thanks for the link. Interesting to listen in.

That "expat jazzmen" thread of 2019 is good but seems to live mostly on fairly "recent" memories (maybe often based on personal exposure by the forumists?). Most of the names do not seem to go back beyond those featured on the "Americans in Europe" Impulse LPs. Yet the trend (particularly among Black jazzmen and women, and going well beyond Coleman Hawkins and Benny Carter who spent several years in Europe in the 30s) started MUCH earlier (which is saying something about a certain societal climate ...). Though some by force of circumstances were forced to return back to the US at the outbreakof WWII. Here are those that come to mind offhand (but the list is not chronological - some came to Europe in the 30s (sometimes in the 20s), some came after WWII): Sidney Bechet ! Arthur Briggs Harry Cooper Big Boy Goudie Herb Flemming Willie Lewis Garnet Clark Spencer Williams Valaida Snow Leon Abbey Freddy Taylor Inez Cavanaugh Peanuts Holland ...

Google does not yield any results for the word "Claudehopper" in connection with "Claude Thornhill". But another online search that led me to the DAHR website shows that a tune named "Claudhopper" was recorded on 2 March 1959 (Woellmer was on trumpet at this session according to the DAHR site) and released on this LP: https://www.discogs.com/de/master/1463148-Claude-Thornhill-And-His-Orchestra-Dance-To-The-Sound-Of-Claude-Thornhill-And-His-Orchestra Probably one of Thornhill's less memorable efforts when (according to various biographies on him) he certainly was past his progressive prime and had settled in a more conventional dance band routine. I recently picked up a copy of his slightly earlier "Plays for Dancing" LP. Nice enough as a document of its times but hardly in a league with his 40s recordings. And I have little reason to believe that that Decca LP of 1959 is radically more "modernist" again.

@Rabshakeh: Re-Steve Gibson & The Red Caps (a recommendation I'll second any time) : That group evolved over time. Their earlier records (c. 1943-46) for the Joe Davis-owned Beacon label were looser and more overtly geared to the Black market. A cross-section of their recordings from that period is on two LPs on the Krazy Kat label. Their later RCA records (post-1950) sound a bit more polished and may have been produced with an eye on potential crossover sales to white listeners. But they are not to be dismissed at all for that matter either. Their RCA period is covered on a Bear Family CD. The further tracks on the above Youtube link of "Tuscaloosa" (56 tracks in all) will provide you with enough samples. But note the tracks are not arranged in chronological order.

Individual tracks probably are. You might have to search tune by tune. As for what you don't like about 30s blues and more conventional and/or sparsely instrumented post-war blues, particularly the slower ones: I understand and agree somewhat. But remember (and this seems to be very obvious to me) those 78s were never intended to be listened to in one row for 12 songs (or more) one straight after another. At the time the audience usually absorbed ("consumed") them in "instalments" of 2 tracks from each newly-bought 78. That does make a listening difference. And even a certain sameness of diction and intonation will then be less noticeable or repetitive. BTW, re- Roosevelt Sykes: At a recent local clearout sale I picked up one of his "blues revival" LPs (Storyville label recordings from 1966). Rather a lot of sameness there overall. So to be taken in small doses in the future. But who am I to complain at an outlay of 1 EUR?

Not wanting to twist your arm, but from what you said I'd think you would enjoy the abovementioned "Jamaican" 3-CD sets on Fantastic Voyage as introductory starters. Each one of them neatly segues from the mid-40s (jazzy Jump Blues) to the late 50s R&B with more or less distinct Black R'n'R overtones. So you get all shades of early R&B as it developed in various nuances during that time span.

Yes that is one way to go, but it was just too much for me at the time. Their contents ARE a nightmare as they draw their material from almost anywhere among Black music from that era (like the Koko Mojo CDs now), so at the time (when they were current) I preferred to invest primarily in somewhat more focused reissues in that field.

See my first post a bit earlier today. I mentioned both the Stompin' and Savage Kick series LP there. I have all of the vinyls. I did not go far into the Stompin' CDs, though, as they recycled most of the LP contents on the CDs again (at least on those I have checked out) and I definitely did not wish to unload my vinyls.

Part II ... Before I get going with my CD recommendations, one rec for a SINGLE artist: Clarence Gatemouth Brown - San Antonio Ballbuster (reissued first on Red Lighning, then on Charly, and more recently on CD - and available on Spotify)! This would be one of my Desert Island R&B platters. (But that's only me ... ) CD box sets: The Okeh box set already mentioned above is fine. Others going in a similar direction are the two Mercury boxes, the Mercury Blues & Rhythm Story 1945-55 box set and another one with the notorious radio-shaped - but fragile - case. Both are great at introducing listeners to many artists from the 40s/50s Mercury Black Music roster, but advanced collectors are likely to end up with many overlaps with what they already have elsewhere. One notch up is this: A Shot In The Dark - Nashvile Jumps by Bear Family (blues and R&B from Nashville indies 1945-55, lavishly produced - as customary for that label - but at a price yet worth it for those who want to dig deep enough ...) The following 3-CD sets (all on the Fantastic Voyage label) include many tracks that many collectors will already have elsewhere but they might be worth shelling out for if found at a good price because they are compiled, "curated" and annotated well. And their contents should serve well as nice introductory compilations to relative starters in 40s and 50s R&B. Don't be thrown off course by the "Jamaica" connections in their titles - it's all US R&B from c. 1945-60 (covering everything from jazzy early post-WWII Jump Blues to late 50s R&B that some may file under Black R'n'R), focusing on tunes favored by the Jamaican Sound System DJ scene on the island: - Jumping The Shuffle Blues - Jamaica Selects Jump Blues Strictly For You - Jump Blues From Jamaica Way - It's Jamaica Jump Blues Time! (There may be more ...) Now, for the single CDs: The following list (some of the R&B comp CDs I own and find worthy of tipping others off about ...) is lengthy and you won't and can't explore them all in full. But they should be worth listening in if any artist, region, label or other criterion you noticed elsewhere earlier strikes your fancy in order to explore the music on these CD further. I selected them mostly because they usually were programmed with advanced collectors in mind and do not often overlap to any significant degree with other fairly easily accessible reissues of that music. I'll group them by reissue label: Delmark: - East Coast Jive - West Coast Jive - Honkers & Bar Walkers Vol. 1, 2 and 3 (Vol. 1 ist most often available on vinyl but has also been reissued on CD) (all of the above cover the Apollo label) Acrobat: - Roy Milton's Miltone Records Story - Jumping At Jubilee - Saxophony - Jubilee Honkers & Shouters - The Derby Records Story - Boogieology - The Atlas Records Story - Queen of Hits - The Macy's Recordings Story (some Hillbilly records interspersed on the last two comps) Capitol: - Jumpin' Like Mad - Cool Cats & Hip Chicks Westside: - Groove Station - King-FederalDeLuxe Saxblastzers Vol. 1 - Titanic and 23 Other Unsinkable Saxblasters Blue Moon: - Juke Box R&B 1945-1046 - Obscure Blues Shouters Vol. 1 & 2 Ace: - Mellow Cats 'n' Kittens - More Mellow Cats 'n' Kittens - Even More Mellow Cats 'n' Kittens - Yet More Mellow Cats 'n' Kittens - Further Mellow Cats 'n' Kittens (you get the idea? ) - Let's Jump! Swingin' Humdingers From Modern Records and if an entire box set on the Specialty label is too much for you: - Specialty Legends of Jump Blues, Vol. 1 (cannot coment on subsequent vols.) And the below one on Ace is interesting as it shows that Jump Blues and beboppish jazz were not that far away from each other and are pretty compatible, actually (it draws on the Specialty and Prestige catalogs): - Jumpin' & Jivin' Fantastic Voyage: - Wailin' Daddy - The Best of Maxwell Davis 1945-1959 - Wail Man Wail! - The Best of King Curtis 1952-1961 Both of these 3-CD sets (there may be other, similarly programmed ones on that label) are single-artist and V.A. comps all in one. One CD features tracks from leader dates recorded under the featured artist's name, while the others have him as a featured sideman in the backing groups of others (mostly vocalists). Many of these CDs are likely to be OOP now so you will have to check Discogs and other online sources. But they should be available here and there. Another label that has focused increasingly on 50s R&B in recent years is Jasmine. I haven't explored them in depth as many of their reissues have overlaps with earlier vinyl reissues I already own. But it IS worth checking out if you do not have much from early R&B yet. One UK mail order source for these and related CDs would be Bim Bam Records (Bob Thomas). Checking the track listings on their website is guaranteed to keep you occupied! Now if all of the above isn't enough, there were/are plenty of CD reissues out there that sail under the P.D. flag but visibly are VERY "grey market" things (on fictitious labels such Blaze, Pontiac, Lucky, Eddie, a.o. - check the "Jiving On Central Avenue" CD series on eBay.com, for example). Some of these have the merit, though, of going where not even in the field of obscure early R&B many other reissuers would want to tread. They share certain common traits in their CD inlay artworks and do seem to have come from the US. To give you an idea of to what extremes the compilers of those labels often went, if you peruse the ""Red Saunders Research Foundation website (on 1945-60 Chicago R&B artists and labels), you will come across a label called "Club 51". Short-lived and among the very obscurest ones. And yet among those "grey-market" reissues there is a CD titled "The Best of Club 51 Records", including 22 tracks which are about the TOTAL output of the label during its entire existence ... The label catalog number: "Club 51 C-101"! Finally (whew ...) there is another P.D. reissue label focusing (mostly) on R&B that has been very active during the past 5 or 6 years: KOKO MOJO. Their digipacks are compiled and produced by collectors and R&B/R'n'R subculture DJs in Continental Europe. I bought most of their first 15 or so (plus a scant few later) but they have gathered reissue steam to such an extent that I have given up following their releases long ago. They are past 200 CDs reissued now! On the one hand they are not all that cheap for what they are (unless you search hard for special offers) and on the other I just cannot see myself anymore checking them all out for what I already have elsewhere (overlaps mostly tend to be considerable for me) and what would really be new and essential to me. But to others there may be untold treasures there! Their focus seems to be not so much on pre-R'n'R R&B up to, say, 1954/55 (though they do feature some of that too), but rather on R&B and Black R'n'R from the second half of the 50s (with some contents crossing over into the seeds of Soul). Discogs has a listing of them: https://www.discogs.com/de/label/1323365-Koko-Mojo-Records?page=1 So ... NOW you are entitled to feel "bewildered"! Anyway ... happy browsing!

Late to the game in this thread, so ... First of all, I understand your "early R&B" wants to cover roughly the 1945-55 period, or at any rate the PRE-Soul R&B years (i.e. some of the stuff from the later 50s falling alternately into the R&B or R'n'R category, depending on how you classify your music "historigraphically" - an approach I sympathize with because I tend(ed) to adopt the same, but am not afraid of wading through ). I am not sure what you refer to as "shit that stinketh". (Any examples of what stinks to you? ) I'd venture a guess these feelings are more of a matter of taste than anything else (particularly i that field where the rough cohabits with the sophisticated). At least to those who dig deeply into this and who are prepared a) not to be turned off by less-than-perfect fidelity of ultra-rare 78s being reissued, and b) to take the tracks above all as unpretentious dance and entertainment music for the "average man" (and woman ) of the target audience of those bygone days (plus those who are into it again now). As for the COMPILATION recommendations (I'll concentrate on Various Artists anthologies in order not to get carried away with too many individual artists - you might risk ending up with lists of ALL artists that there were, depending on the respectives forumists' preferences) and looking at vinyl in the first place, I'd second ALL the SAVOY recommendations. Their twofers were great and numerous. The Atlantic box (that in its later twofer volumes enters Soul territory) is excellent too. Though maybe with less "new finds" than the Savoys. Beyond this, the Ace, Charly and Krazy Kat labels from the UK had plenty of interesting compilations. Ace drew heavily from the Modern/RMP catalog (plus King, IIRC, and Specialty), Krazy Kat did a lot on the Gotham label. P-Vine from Japan did some very nice "themed" vinyl comps too, but they are likely to be very rare and expensive to source secondhand these days. At least in Europe. With you being UK-based, in case you come across R&B compilation series titled "SAVAGE KICK" or "STOMPIN'" (even though they may look sort of grey-area-ish ) at good prices in specialist (underground) record shops, pick them up! They were done with the hardcore R&B and Black R'n'R collectors (and deejays and dancers) in mind in the 90s (and as CDs a bit later on) and circulated mainly at the concert record stalls. https://www.discogs.com/de/label/341528-Savage-Kick?page=1 https://www.discogs.com/de/label/59225-Stompin?page=1 As for the CDs, I'll do a separate post later on. There is sooo much there, particularly off the beaten tracks of the "usual suspects" labels ...

If you google "Great Day in Harlem" along with "Jean Bach" at least two sites pop up at once where the film is online. And it is also on Youtube: I downloaded it from YT after I had become aware of it (a short while after the book arrived here - it may actually have been following a link provided here at the time this book was first discussed here in an earlier topic). So it's saved for posterity now.

They were discussed on page 28 of this thread (see posts starting on Oct. 30, the latest one on Nov. 3 by adh1907): Initially I was quite interested but my enthusiasm has waned a little, seeing that these seem to be all articles taken from various long-published (and sometimes easily accessible) sources of which i already have several on my shelves. It is not quite clear how much new info (i.e. very recent info by the autor) is in there. So I am still undecided about whether to pick them up. (Which is a rare occurrence for me when it comes to printed documents on 50s West Coast Jazz )

But the Urbie Green set isn't that "modern". Even though the starting track says "Old Time Modern". I don't know about others but I did not hesitate filing my copies (original 10" Amadeo-Vanguard vinyl and Membran label CD reissue pairing it with a Vic Dickenson session as a straight reissue of Jazztone J1259 "Slidin' Swing") in the "Swing" sections of my shelves. I'd describe it as mainstream swing neither moldy-figgish nor adventurous.

Yes that's a pity. I wasn't quite sure which site this "Both Sides Now" actually was. The name didn't immediately click with me. But I now see (as I have just googled an obscure LP and was led to this site). It's been quite a wqile since I last used it, but I now realize I've used it often. However ... I must admit I am not totally surprised. The site layout is sort of "first generation website"-ish. I.e. one of those sites that must have been created ages ago but its layout still looks like way back (and where you just keep your fingers crossed it will be around for a long time to come). Maybe I'll just have to save the contents of some "favorite label" pages in Word files to my PC ... (but reformatting the contents properly does not look to be easy)

The first one has the merit of including some relatively rare EPs conveniently all in one place But the second one is a hodgepodge. One of those annoying habits of FS and its subsidiaries to recompile sessions by some secondary and tertiary criteria such as a specific number of musicians ("complete quartet" and the like) or one specific musician from the lineup (as Quincy Jones here). Tracks 1 to 10 plus 15 to 19 are part of the "Harry Arnold Big Band Classics 1957-58" reissue (the key recordings of the legendary "Jazztone Mystery Band") on Dragon. Isn't it so that anyone listening to those recordings would do so on account of the Harry Arnold band in the first place, whereas Quincy Jones in the overall picture of things is more of a nice add-on and icing on the cake? So why stop short of the whole thing as reisseud e.g. on Dragon? And tracks 11 to 14 are no live tracks (contrary to what the FS website says) but studio "moonlighting" recordings by part of the Lionel Hampton band during its 1953 tour (sort of the Swedish equivalent of the "Clifford Brown in Paris" sessions on a smaller scale), also widely available on various reissue labels such as Esquire and Metronome. In short, fairly pointless overall. At least at full price.

Yes, that's a nice one. I have the original US pressing on Argo. (Strange ... Americans playing the European rleease, Yurpeens playing the US release ) In the same manner, the late 50s arrangements that Quincy Jones did for Harry Arnold's big band merit re-listening any time.

RIP. Just too bad the daily press and news obits reduce his work and accomplishments more or less to Michael Jackson.

Your impressions of the Bunk Johnson bio made me smile ... Seems like a labor of love, but one for hardcore fans only (who'd soak up every snippet of the life of their hero). Reminds me of a musician and entertainer you ought to know from German TV (Götz A., long-time co-host of the "Zimmer frei" show, a.o. ) once wrote (tongue-in-cheek) in his self-published fanzine in his younger days (around 1980): "I'd happily listen to a 10-LP box of Jerry Lee Lewis brushing his teeth!"

This is the impression I eventually got when I checked the tables of contents of both books. So it all depends on how easily accessible the sources are. I know I already have "Modern Jazz" by Alun Morgan, the Robert Gordon JWC book (I guess it is this BOOK he quotes from when Robert Gordon is mentioned as the source) and JazzLife. As for the rest and maybe more obscure sources hard to locate ...? Who knows? I know Down Beat is no mystery anymore since the volumes could be accessed and downloaded via the World Radio History site. But to how much trouble to search each feature article would one want to go to? Or what would it be worth to have everything in one place and at your fingertips? We'll see ...

Thanks for that info! You are right - the error must indeed be in the recording date of "Early Autumn" indicated on my CD. The date of 7 July 1952 (already indicated correctly in Jepsen's discography, BTW) must be the correct one. The timing is 2:54 indeed (indicated as 2:55 in the booklet but that one second may be a matter of timinig of the fadeout anyway). So the "Early Autumn" recording by the "current band" (as per the original liner notes by Woody Herman) means "current as of 1952". But definitely not "1954", as alluded to in that reivew. I just checked my other Woody Herman LPs and see I also have Discovery DS-845 (which features part of the studio recordings from the Mars period). But the liner notes indicate 30 May 1952 as the recording date of "Early Autumn" (though the lineup they provide is the one of 7 July 1954, with Lee Fortier replacing Jack Scarda). So maybe this is how the error found its way into the booklet of my CD on the "Poll Winners Records" (PWR) label? One thing remains puzzling, though: The review under the link you provided gives a time span of 26 Feb. 1945 to 15 July 1954 for the contents of the CD and LP. The date of 15 July 1954 corresponds to the Omaha broadcast mentioned above. However, neither Early Autumn nor any of the other of the 12 original tracks come from that broadcast and date. The most recent one on the original LP contents is from 21 May 1954, according to the booklet of my CD. So how did that date of the Omaha broadcasts find its way into the review (by Brian Priestley, no less ...)?? Did Columbia use the recording date indicated incorrectly (for an "Early Autumn" version allegedly released on the original Columbia CL592 LP) in the Jepsen and Bruyninckx (and other?) discographies for the CD reissue? And Priestley didn't notice??