king ubu

found these in sales here: Haven't played any of them yet, but maybe I'll feel like playing some more ratty music than I did of late (thus I mostly disappeared from the thread, recently).

Derek Bailey? I haven't read his book, but even a few quotes from interviews are very insightful, I think! One of the wittiest minds of any music, ever, methinks!

Get "Aspects"!

I was being a bit harsh, but had to do, I guess, with the Sco vs. ECM comparison (I know, I know, he's on ECM, too, now... but it's DeJohnette actually who was the leader, I think). Anyway, I really, really enjoyed a recent (2006, spring, I think) live broadcast of Sco's Ray Charles programme - must be the one thing of his that immediately connected to me. Bluesy, basic stuff. And I never wanted to really put him down, I am sure he's a very able musician, to say the least - it's just not that I can connect to most of his stuff that easily (and I'm used to connecting with lots of "difficult" things, see funny rat...) Regarding the sound of ECM, it seems to me that from the older (80s) albums, those done in NYC often don't have the "ECM sound". Also there might be differences between Ludwigsburg things and the Oslo stuff (their house studio by now? But then again Stanko did his latest at La Buissonne in France and it seems it sounds different again - La Buissonne is the great studio where most if not all of the gone and regretted Sketch releases were recorded). Of am I mixing things up and Ludwigsburg is Enja only? By the way, a funny thing about ECM / Enja is, that in my opinion, Enja Winckelmann, after the split with Weber (Enja Weber) has got the far more interesting catalogue by now, not just as far as size is concerned, but he does (did?) all those "mediterranean" projects with WDR and SWR radio stations, La Banda, Trovesi's Midsummernight Dream, Michel Godard's two "Castel del Monte" discs, Pino Minafra etc., plus stuff like Johannes Enders, Rabih Abou-Khalil, Dhafer Youssef, while Enja Weber has mainly a "great black music" catalogue (his new releases go beyond that, too, though, with Charlie Mariano, Aki Takase or - also, I think - Michel Godard). Of course the "great black music" or black avant stuff needs to be documented, but by 1980 it was often just some old trad stuff and not really where things where happening. So in the end while it may be worthwhile, I don't look at it as a mistake on anyone's side not to focus mainly on that kind of music after say 1980. And another thing is that of course a label's owner often just records what he likes himself - so did Alfred Lion, so do Uehlinger (hat hut records) and Eicher. That's perfectly legitimate, although it may be hard on musicians of a lesser demanded style, but such is life. Now keeping ones old catalogue in print or doing the occasional reissue (hello, Mr. Weber!!! and to some lesser extent of course Uehlinger and Eicher, too!) I think should be done more often - sort of taking responsability for ones own catalogue and keeping to spread it, instead of turning it into collectors' stuff (as happens with hat releases, but Uehlinger simply hasn't got the means to reissue all his stuff AND do new releases, and - again, that's perfectly legitimate - he does by no account want to turn his label into a reissue label, but still sees his main focus on documenting new music and producing new releases).

Or holding marriage until good sex. busted, you sexmaniac!

hey, we don't slam chillun here!

An evolution shirt? You might be taken for a darwinist and get stoned (well yes, that's what it meant *before*, I guess) by some re-born again messiases

The film is with and about Grachan. Being shot by the person who made that documentary about Gary McFarland... So is there any footage of Grachan jamming with McFarland (possibly on Bacharach or Beatles tunes)?

The title of this thread always fools me again and makes me believe it's one about holding off sex until marriage...

(my reply to the hillbillswaps, that is... )

Maybe Enja Weber was the guy who did for the black musicians what Eicher could have done in the 70s and 80s if he wanted, over here in Europe? I don't know...

ok clem, I see what you're saying, but then I assume the music black folks tended to produce was rather not what ECM was ever looking for? There are many others, Lester Bowie's own albums, their first release which was a Mal Waldron album, a couple of never yet on CD things by the likes of Sam Rivers or Julian Priester (or has "Love, Love" finally ended up on CD?), and there was a Dewey Redman album, too? Also a Marion Brown... I guess that's in the end just not the stuff that fits the image ECM wants to have, and maybe it won't sell enough - I don't know if that's true. And in the end I don't really care - I would never nominate ECM as my favourite label or anything close to, but I still think they do worthwhile releases nowadays, just as they did in earlier years. In the end I give props to Eicher for doing his thing, for creating his own niche and being much more successfull than one (he?) could have hoped for. There's not much more I have to say about this... there are plenty of labels releasing plenty of discs, and we can lucky enough make our picks without having to endorse a whole catalogue - it's not just thumbs up or down, luckily!

Hasn't Scofield always been a somewhat boring player? I have several of his discs (the BNs with Lovano, the one with Eddie who?, Groove Elation, Quiet, Shinola, Works for Me, ScoHoLoFo, maybe even more) and I occasionally even listen to some of them, but he never really "touched" me in any way. Sometimes his stuff is fun to listen, but most often it's not interesting enough for me. The Sco-Swallow-Stewart trio live (I've known it from broadcasts, from ca. 2000 to 2006) is another deal quite often, though. But there Scofield goes for a straighter approach and Swallow works perfectly with him, and Bill Stewart is a great drummer, too...

There's plenty to enjoy, both old and new (maybe less new, that may be true, I don't know enough of ECMs catalogue to really tell). Anyway, with all the BN fetishism going on, there's plenty of boring BN stuff, too, and many might feel the older the label got, the lesser the quality/freshness of their releases... look at all the mediocre stuff from the late 60s...

Amusing little discussion here... I agree about the sentiment of ECM "getting old" and one being able to generally notice that, but I also am in that camp who thinks there's enough good new stuff coming out on ECM - Rava, Balke, Tord Gustavsen, Trygve Seim. DeJohnette and the AEC made several albums for ECM, I don't think this has to turn into yet another one of those dreadful skin colour-specific threads.

Hm, for some reason I always preferred that one... can't say why - maybe just becasue I got it first? And that short bass solo on "Knock on Wood" is killer stuff!

yup, me too... but what do we know, we're all innocent faggotts, I guess... Interesting Brownie, how although we are from vastly different parts of the world, I too had (have) a serious "thing" for Susan Harrison. When this movie was released in Cape Town in 1957, after a great deal of anticipatory publicity in Metronome and Downbeat regarding the Chico Hamilton Quintet contribution, I saw it three times that first week. I now teach this movie every year as a personal indulgence in my "Social Aspects Of Film" class, and I always confess to the class about my fixation on her. (Most of the males in the class just don't get it ... the females recognize her vulnerability, though). It is a real mystery what happened to her ... she just disappeared from the Hollywood scene after doing some television roles. She probably married an insurance salesman, and moved to the Valley, where she is now a grandmother and the general secretary of the local John Birch Society. This is a very rich film for social and cultural analysis of the period ... from prevailing sexual mores to the blacklist and communism (remember J.J. asks the Marty Milner character if he is a "red'?) ... and we must not forget that director Barry Levinson (who is our age) offers a wonderful homage to the film in his great film DINER ... where one character repeats large sections of dialog from TSSOS. The fiilm captures a lost world of American fifties culture (perhaps peculiar to Boadway/New York), and requires a great deal of background explanation for today's students. Also, it is very interesting that it was made by a Scotsman, Alexander McKendrick ... perhaps it required someone from outside of the culture to capture it so precisely, much like John Schlesinger did later with MIDNIGHT COWBOY. That post makes me want to see the film again soon! It's really a great one!

MG, check out Maceo's "*Soundtrack" (it looks untitled on the cover) - I always preferred that one over the Planet Groove one. They do some old favourites (Knock on Wood, and the usual J.B. stuff - of course Wesley and Pee Wee Ellis are there, Larry Goldings is on organ).

The two Cobblestone dates were reissued on Muse and 32 Jazz. These are definitely worth looking for! (The 32 Jazz release paired them on one disc!)

Elton Dean and rostasi, or what's this thread about again?

Oh, and the West Coast 3CD set (now singly available as VMEs, I think, but I'm not sure if all of it is out in that form) is much better than the reviews I remember reading back when it came out! Lou Levy!

Quite a few of these have been published... I used them to practice earlier... was quite interesting to find out more about his pet licks and all... he's not the most inventive soloist to troll on earth, it's his sound and soul that makes him special, his phrasing and bending etc. - you don't get that on transcriptions, of course!

I'm not leaning that much towards acid jazz today... I used to like it much more, but that's where I got into jazz, starting out with funk, both old-school and new stuff (Crusaders, Larry Graham, Sly Stone, Prince, Maceo etc.). Will play "Swing Low Sweet Cadillac" again to see how I like it nowadays!

Too right, how often have I tried listening to a new album in "the wrong mood" and got too little out of it. Revisiting reveals a much better session than first spin. ... Now that's a different story altogether, reaching out for the right thing at the wrong time or vice-versa! Happens quite often of late, but that's likely because too much new stuff has piled up over the last 2 years or so...

don't know it long enough to really say something but at the moment i really really like that 1968 Reunion Big Band MPS album not to forget the subject of the thread: Dizzy Gillespie - Digital in Montreux I got the Berlin one on your recommendation, it's good, but it's too short... and there are too many fine musicians that don't get heard in solo! I generally like the live material more than the studio stuff with Diz, that applies to his group with James Moody, the Gillespiana stuff with Leo Wright, as well as to the 1957 big band. Again, let me point out that I have all this stuff on CD and like it - it just to me never really lives up to my expectations, it's like it all should have been a notch better...