MomsMobley

http://www.amazon.com/The-Journey-Home-David-Gitin/dp/0912652799 http://www.amazon.com/Passing-Through-David-Gitin/dp/0976492830

Chuck, I've owned about 1/2 of those over the years, great series even when versions not 'definitive' (usually a false grail anyway. I'm guessing they just offer tracklists and not repros of the booklets? Stravinsky, Hindemith, Villa-Lobos, Medtner, Roussel/Schmitt, Bartok were all faves. The Messiaen, Shosty & Elgar I had elsewhere etc. Don't know why EMI can't spend a few hours w/ intern to scan booklets and offer on disc or website but they're hardly the only ones so callous. (Conversely, they occasionally do it right: they're take on a Messiaen Edition remastered Ollie's solo organ works & did include texts.)

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/28/arts/music/remembering-what-made-ornette-coleman-a-jazz-visionary.html?smid=tw-nytimesmusic&seid=auto&_r=0 one funeral report, i've seen at least one other. good thing Phil Schaap just shut up and played the records (as if that's a 'service' to anyone, even before nearly all records were available at internet fingertips etc) or else he might have said something to 'offend' etc... Any Organissimonauts make it uptown today?

Concur. The biography is greater than a good % of music per se (Mr Bojangles is vomitous, Beatles covers worse than that etc etc) but lest we forget black ("as night") woman negotiating racist America, brutal show & record biz etc... "Ain't Got No" from "Hair" is excellent however, "Rich Girl" not bad... Was she a hard ass? She'd have been crazy if she wasn't (see also, say, Carmen McRae...) Her "Notes and Tones" interview was good also. I wish her "Brown Eyed Handsome Man" was better but... alas.

Ari Eisinger ---> anyone not stunned has never played fingerstyle guitar, right up there w/ Paul Geremia

Sabine Liebner = great great Cage-ian (& elsehwere Feldman-iac)

"Sing Sing Sing" 1983, aspect ratio a bit off, hail Bob Fosse & Ralph Burns, apologies to Sven Nykvist, great great GREAT movie

Is there an ** exciting ** version of the Mozart flute concertos? Maybe I only saw 'em good nights-- symphonies, overtures, maybe Masonic music warm up?-- late '90s but I thought they were fine-- albeit not in the style I most prefer in Mozart. Even taking Ross at face value, a combination of conductor & musician lassitude seems likely explanation. And, not to put Schwarz on the same level but look what "you" (Chicago, not LK personally) did to Jean Martinon & Rafael Kubelik... And, as I suggested, nearly over "major" NYC orchestra except the Met gets ragged on, perhaps deservedly but... *** Sandow sidenote, from his Fischer-Dieskau memorial And yet… strengths can also be weaknesses, and one could say that Fischer-Dieskau’s tricks with volume make his singing fussy, especially in Bach, where often I wish he’d just let the music speak for itself. http://www.gregsandow.com/old/fdieskau.htm even with scores unseen, I suspect that's something ** everyone ** can agree upon: that Sandow's music is best left to speak for itself. (I've run hot/cold DF-D but finally you gotta say he was a real artist, take or leave or choose wisely etc but I'd NEVER use that old (hack) saw against the man in any repertoire.)

Nobody was saying Schwarz was, say, Rene Jacobs, but he's certainly a more than competent Mozartean; is it possible-- even probable there were 'off' nights & on? Of course. But look at the orchestral situation in New York-- who has been pleasing, and who has pleased the musicians, besides Levine? AND you saw what Sandow-- out of nowhere then, the world's great "moralist" (sic)-- tried to do to him. Hint: maybe its "major" institution New York musicians who are as much the problem as the conductors, though, to be sure, I've been less than pleased a # of choices etc.

LK-- Sandow is a fucking crank just more than little embittered that, uh... nobody is playing his compositions. And yeah, good to great composers have also been interesting, sometimes weird, critics also but Virgil Thomson he ain't, let alone Berlioz. I won't dignify Sandow's schtick but running down list of conductors he's ambushed on slim, often fatuous, evidence but Schwarz ain't the only one. Also, no comment, from Sandow's website-- but maybe he'll help Anthony Braxton with his interplanetary aspirations etc?

Yeah, who knows but the question is, how much could he ultimately do with a band like Seattle? I did, years ago, hear him do Mozart etc in New York and he was very good but of course anyone damn well should be. Aside from some quasi-'juicy' content in the NYT piece, I think some motivation stemmed from grief on that side also. But you know what a snakepit etc... Also, this Hindemith recording is excellent-- http://www.amazon.com/Hindemith-Nobilissima-Visione-Pieces-Orchestra/dp/B00KQ31IZ2

Not so much: http://www.nytimes.com/2007/12/16/arts/music/16waki.html?_r=0 Times was mostly a hit piece, LK. Schwarz could be a hardass, possibly imperious on occasion, but isn't that his job? Case dismissed btw-- http://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/symphony-violinists-lawsuit-dismissed/ http://www.seattlepi.com/news/article/Case-against-Seattle-Symphony-dismissed-1262642.php Without having examined the medical records etc, if above is the case... is violinist in full time symphony orchestra really the appropriate occupation? And maybe-- just maybe-- any musician who left Seattle would, because of GS, have a # of better-than-previous professional opportunities? Meanwhile, pretty much any GS conducted album is at least worth hearing & if one can snag his American orchestral series' recordings cheap (or find at library), they're estimable if, in my case, I usually prefer more modernist fare. also--

While I share your fascination with this story, I see the biz side the other way: Ornette is NOT a commodity, both for health & asspain reasons. To be blunt, who gives a fuck what Denardo thinks? However faithfully (let's presume) he's carried forth Dad's perogatives, it's done little good for anyone else (but Art)), all the Harmolodic Verve stuff is out of print (new recordings + reissues) despite their presumed ownership etc etc. If Antibalas can make me, as booking agent, festival and/or club owner $$$, let GuardianDenardo & his lawyers have a ball-- even with Ornette in best fettle, by his own choice he was setting himself apart etc & not really a player in the contemporary live music scene. Here's A's current date calendars by comparison-- http://www.antibalas.com/shows/ you think even 1% of their likely audience heard of or would care about this dispute if we could even explain it to them? What power is O's name? How many gigs has he played in the last 10 years? 15? 20? Yeah, sure there are "loyalists" but what's "loyalty"-- and what should it be, really?-- to such a quixotic cause worth when we got tickets to sell? Ornette & Denardo in their loft/castle is admirable as shit, OK, but it's their life & sure is shit isn't a living for the rest of us. And, obviously, assuming Antibalas not suicidal, O's discography is now littered with "questionable" or "questioned" releases.... well-- as I think you & others suggested earlier-- what's the common factor there? You probably have a saner grip on this, but one thing I've learned is to never underestimate the power of Anonymous Art Money when it gets pissed off. You look at all the Art Money (Anonymous & Otherwise) that has been invested in Ornette over the years, hey, Noble Cause Alert, write a check. "Commodity", no. Icon, yes, and deservedly so. But people invest in Icons just as surely as they invest in Commodities. And also, this is true, booking agents/etc. don't give a damn who' s in the band, they just want the name on the bill and on the stage. Antibalas can get a fucking trumpet player, ya' know? And there we go back to the question- if System Dialing Peoples NOT suicidal, whose Anonymous Art Money did THEY get promised if/when shit hit fan? So many angles to this, and none of them particularly savory, no matter how you come at them. There are definitely layers & layers of questions and clearly something was kinda-- if not 'shady'-- then purposefully 'shadowy' about this release. But just on functional level of, yes, people trying to compete, if Antibalas can handle their business, are pleasant to deal with etc... I just don't see anyone but Ornette's very very best personal friends taking sides and I'd suggest the same even if was 10 years & the prospect of 'future' Ornette more realistic. (Ten years ago CDs had greater value, natch; now, with almost everything available somewhere... Except for the obviously higher manufacturing costs, I'm surprised the label didn't do this on vinyl... And actually, in some ways that's weirdest thing about this is the sequal/"homage" to O re: "New Vocabulary" though maybe they see it in line with the provocative Contemporary & Atlantic titles?) Also, I'm not generally an NPR fan-- brought to you by swill beer whose sponsorship I won't repeat here-- but I didn't see their original Kevin Whitehead review posted so... http://www.npr.org/2015/02/20/387772281/ornette-coleman-returns-with-his-unmistakable-sound

While I share your fascination with this story, I see the biz side the other way: Ornette is NOT a commodity, both for health & asspain reasons. To be blunt, who gives a fuck what Denardo thinks? However faithfully (let's presume) he's carried forth Dad's perogatives, it's done little good for anyone else (but Art)), all the Harmolodic Verve stuff is out of print (new recordings + reissues) despite their presumed ownership etc etc. If Antibalas can make me, as booking agent, festival and/or club owner $$$, let GuardianDenardo & his lawyers have a ball-- even with Ornette in best fettle, by his own choice he was setting himself apart etc & not really a player in the contemporary live music scene. Here's A's current date calendars by comparison-- http://www.antibalas.com/shows/ you think even 1% of their likely audience heard of or would care about this dispute if we could even explain it to them? What power is O's name? How many gigs has he played in the last 10 years? 15? 20? Yeah, sure there are "loyalists" but what's "loyalty"-- and what should it be, really?-- to such a quixotic cause worth when we got tickets to sell? Ornette & Denardo in their loft/castle is admirable as shit, OK, but it's their life & sure is shit isn't a living for the rest of us. And, obviously, assuming Antibalas not suicidal, O's discography is now littered with "questionable" or "questioned" releases.... well-- as I think you & others suggested earlier-- what's the common factor there?

Late, if you like Toradze's Scriabin-- which I do-- check out his Prokofiev PCs, also with Gergiev. I'm great admirer of Ahmed Adnan Saygun, roughly 'the Turkish Bartok'-- Here's some ace later Casella --

LK, please consider: Schaap didn't need to "lead" anyone-- he didn't invent the line of inquiry, one or more Ellingtonians told him their version(s). What other possibility is there that Schaap would question the 'accepted' Avakian version? Now I would like to know who first told Schaap this; how (relatively) drunk & sober the various participants, witnesses were, etc. We know Duke's band, like nearly all others, often drank a lot. I know nothing about Avakian's habits. Nonetheless, those who drank with Duke were very experienced drinkers and why, if Avakian a benign, even benevolent figure in their professional lives, would they speak otherwise? Might Schaap have a 'secret' revisionist agenda? Anything is possible, sure, but that seems unlikely. And however much a nudge he might occasionally be, Schaap is a GREAT interviewer because he's both thoroughly prepared & unabashedly loving to his subjects-- not generalized "I Heart Jazz" but that you did this specifically & its wondrous, how did that happen? Here's another thought: besides the Newport question, I see that Avakian was Charles Lloyd's manager for a spell. Schaap is long-time good friends with Lloyd, continuing to this day. I have no beef with George generally but I've never viewed him as any kind of "saint." Who besides Johnny Mathis, maybe, am I to credit him for? And just because he was "classier"-- slicker anyway-- than, say, Syd Nathan?

More Villa-Lobos, starting with Choros 11... Uuno Klami ballets & symphonies ... Milhaud symphonies ... lots of Delius, choral music included... Dutilleux... Messiaen obviously... Casella ... Szymanowski... Tubin... lesser known Profkofiev inc. cantatas... tons of Martinu... MacMillan ... Sally Beamish ... how well do you know-- and I mean really know-- your Ives? Ives lives! There are Spanish composers, Portuguese composers, Greek composers-- Skalkottas !!! (some serial, lots not)... Leevi Madetoja ... How well do you know-- and I mean really, really know-- your Nielsen ? Take a whiff of Roy Harris sometime, not just Symphony #3. ******* LOU HARRISON !!!!!!! *********

LK, I'm sorry to say this but you've been drastically misled & perhaps even swallowed Chris A's poison pill on this matter. I've heard many 100s (of 3,000 or so) Schaap interviews both live & re-broadcast and that characterization of Schaap's Q&A is nonsense, flat out. Q: If I had the honor-- really-- to interview you about your estimable career in journalism, would you have immediate daily, weekly recall of your work from 20-30-40 years ago? And if not, what if I first offer framing devices-- because I have your clips and a goodly # issues of magazines/papers etc-- & then perhaps a few cues, either based on evidence or educated guess? I'm trying to get you to talk... That's what ANY historian or diligent journalist would do, what they should do... Now, I would have to consider those answers to see if you weren't just talking to be heard-- or to shut me up-- but that's part of the process, later, or writing history. Q: what has Schaap gotten with his "reputation"? He's not a writer-- he wasn't taking that work away from anyone, when such work as available. And I doubt anyone writer wanted to take his adjunct teaching positions, hauling ass back & forth from Princeton for a pittance... He DID stay on the radio, yes... and he DID get some reissue gigs... You can argue this 'authority' was part of long range plan that allowed to him hook up with JALC education & finally at age mid-50-something get a job with health benefits* but I don't think it was really that well thought out. Q: Who once used to be on the radio & then wasn't AND who used to produce reissue records & then didn't & I don't know (really) whose choices those were or why but to pretend one's harshest & most obsessive critic is personally 'disinterested'... hardee har har as Mr. Kramden would say. Now once more, what Schaap DOES with his fact gathering is open to question-- he's not publishing papers or books, doesn't footnote his liner notes or Facebook posts etc-- but the criticism of his ** interviews ** etc is utterly fatuous. You (generally, not LK) would fucking shit to hear even a fragment of those interviews-- maybe sometimes in spite of Schaap's Queens-born nudgeiness, fine, nobody says you gotta like him but he sounds like a New Yorker to me & he did it. For those 100s of interviews + the Dean Benedetti box alone I'd hold Schaap in high, if circumscribed, esteem. it's a nice line yes but Al Haig-- Al Haig?!?!?-- as a character witness? * How many years did George Avakian not have health insurance? How many major label record execs have died impoverished or had to draw on the Record Executives Welfare Fund? And-- it's not enough for him to be wealthy & reasonably respected, he had to be loved by Ellingtonians too? Maybe he should be, maybe not but it's certainly well within range of possibility that perceptions, Boss & Worker, White & Black, (Sober & Drunk) etc differ, often greatly.

But none of this is contradictory, is it? Chris A's vindictiveness doesn't interest me in slightest & can be quickly dismissed on # of levels. Avakian v. Schaap, real and imagined, is interesting because it's almost certainly... Avakian v. Collective Memory of Ellingtonians voiced by Schaap or Avakian v. Particular Memory of Aggrieved Elliington(s) voiced by Schaap You gotta think this through deliberately and logically: for whose benefit is Schaap attempting, in his view, to set record straight? There's no $$$ in it, no glory (living people who care = statistical zero), no sex, probably not even one free beer. And again, who spent more hours in more different settings with Ellingtonians 1963-2005, George or Phil? Doesn't mean Phil's "right" but it is 99.9% certain that such assertions are NOT coming out of nowhere. also, I daresay non-New Yorkers don't really get how zany Phil Schaap's life has been: his life, from out of the cradle to present, is almost completely defined by jazz obsession + hanging out with old-- & dying, & dying, & dying etc-- black guys-- and some hep white guys too. There are those who mocked Schaap for the time he put into the Dean Benedetti tapes-- oh, and what a "surprise" Chris A. was among them!* (sense a complementary obsession/theme?)-- but I'm not one of them. re: Meeropol, you remember what happened to W.E.B. DuBois, right? Paul Robeson? Albert Maltz? Theodore Dreiser? (Good people gulled by CPUSA and/or lifetime hostility, oppression, lies etc) * This takes nothing away from the various hep things a swell like Avakian-- or even Chris A. in New Orleans-- did but remember Melville "The Confidence Man" too-- "showing that man men have many minds."

that seems picayune, Chuck. If I had the three hour Truck Parham interview he did (might be more than one) I'd send it over as at least moderate compensation. I don't disagree with someone's objection but can't imagine being bothered by it; it was just "silly" not "offensive." Schaap was just reissue producer in any case-- SOMEONE at Sony Legacy signed off on that & they're at least complicit in any "offense" etc. re: such "Such Sweet Thunder," how many of ya'll have the Stravinsky/Entremont piano concerto that's missing x # of bars from original recording/issue & has been incorrectly reissued multiple times? Schaap had nothing to do with THAT one, obviously etc. (Insert a 1/2 jillion other exampes here.)

I'm adopted myself, not sure what would the potential malice in claiming that about anybody, at least not that in and of itself. As to the other point, not just situation, but music, i.e. - all the gentrefentiled noise about too much bass and all that nonsense. Pay attention caucoids, pay attention and do your homework. Free your mind and your (b)ass will follow. Context was 2005 passing of Schaap's father, Walter Schaap, well-known Ellington Society eminence etc & also, on a personal level, a very racially progressive man (as far from common in NYC as anywhere else) & Chris A. used putative adoption to assert distance between respectable, well-regarded father & son of whom he very much feels otherwise & states it as often as possible. So absolutely, there ** should be ** no malice, only love (I referenced Abel Meeropol above for # reasons) but that was plainly NOT how Chris A. intended it. (This from old AAJ thread btw, I did not and never do look at that site except when someone points me towards or it unexpectedly comes up in search engine.)

Thanks for this, LK, but you've just proved my point. And I take no sides in this dispute but here's the breakdown-- You have one BOSS executive, amiable OK, with his first person version. He lives in a world with other aristocrats etc-- that's life & George did alright. You have Schaap, who wasn't there but is coming up with this composite account based on MANY conversations with MANY of the relatively un-landed & relatively un-enfranchised participants-- some, in fact, effectively dis-enfranchised in their lifetime, which is one reason Koester is in D.C. '63 & George is where?-- In the years since Newport, Avakian and Schaap spent how much time with the Ellingtonians & Jo Jones etc, respectively? If Schaap is wrong-- & again I have no opinion on the matter this moment-- is he stating ** his ** invented opinion or the opininion he was ** taught ** to have? The problem w/ Schaap documenting himself is he spent lots of time hanging with those dudes socially & in some cases professionally; he was not, in real time, creating some Oral History Archive etc though if there are tapes-- almost certanly not transcripts-- of Phil's on-air interviews from 1971 thru whenever... that would be a start. Is it possible that certain Ellingtontonians did not, in fact, love George Avakian the way he believed they loved him or wanted to be loved? Or does that not even enter into the picture and each party, from their perspective, believes themselves correct without rancor? I'm saying Schaap is probably an honest (but potentially sloppy) representative of his otherwise largely voiceless sources. Have black folks and white folks ever looked at the same situation and interpreted, recalled things differently? Nawwwwwwww. Is it possible that Schaap is misrepresenting his sources? Possible, but generally unlikely-- too many long-term intimate frienships with musicians & family. (I've been advised btw that Schaap was perhaps NOT adopted and that Chris A. was either misinformed or malicious. I do not know the "truth" in this matter but don't want to be thought spreading potentially false rumor.)