Jim R

Hmmm... I've got to disagree with that a bit, even though I'm sympathetic to some of what you say, Brad. I too was interested in blues for several years before I really got into jazz. A lot of it WAS monotonous, unimaginative, and stale. However, I always found enough creativity- especially in terms of song structure (things that went well beyond the typical 12-bar patterns)- to keep me interested. I think I was fortunate in terms of timing, in that the genre was experiencing a renaissance during the 70's. There were a lot of great young artists coming up (Robert Cray, Stevie Ray Vaughan, the T-Birds, Duke Robillard and Roomful, Little Charlie & the Nightcats, etc etc) in addition to many of the greats still being around. Plus, we had the advent of major festivals, including the SFBF, which I was fortunate enough to live fairly close to. Most of the local no-name bands were in the stereotypical "wannabe macho hardcore Chicago screaming guitar" mold, but at the same time there were a lot of people stretching the boundaries in different directions (blending soul, rock, jazz and other influences into the mix). Speaking of jazz-tinged styles coming out of Chicago, I've got to mention Robert Jr. Lockwood. He put out a couple of LP's on the Trix label in the 70's that were just as much jazz as they were blues. Another favorite guitarist of mine back then was Billy Butler, who I could never bring myself to label. Then there was Robben Ford...

In my experience, there is a considerable amount of overlapping interest among music fans. There are of course some folks who are more fanatical about one genre or the other. There are a lot of "blunatics" who don't care for the complexities of jazz, and there are a lot of jazz fans who prefer their jazz with less of a blues influence (people who can't digest a lot of grease ). And, as has been stated, there is also a great deal of overlapping within the music itself. It's hard to draw the line sometimes, and generalize about whay type of music is being played. The old problem with labeling music (the problematic nature of which is evident in this thread). It's all subjective to some degree. Personally, I don't think of Jimi Hendrix as a "blues" musician, although I know a case can easily be made. (I don't think of him as a jazz player either, but ironically enough in terms of this discussion, Hendrix was included in and pictured on the cover of Norman Mongan's "The History Of the Guitar In Jazz" in 1983). There are any number of artists who really can't (and shouldn't be) labeled as either "blues" or "jazz". Some artists are probably both- legitimately. In terms of origins, how about "Blues is A (as opposed to THE) fundamental basis of jazz"...?

Never have I been so tempted to click on "report (this post)"...

... And the sale ENDS when the customer says: "Who the FUCK is Elmer G. Leterman?"

Waiter, you see the redhead at that table over there? Please tell her I got a phone call, and go open the window in the men's room!

1. No, I don't know you, but I think I know your name now! 2. I thought I knew you, but that was before you decided to glue yourself to a basement wall. 3. Yeah, I think so... didn't we sit next to each other at a 3-D showing of "It Came Out Of The Lagoon"? ========================================================================== Come on guys, we need some more captions/punch lines/zingers/social commentary here. This thread is a GOLD MINE of comedy material! B)

Alright, whoa, wait a minute... HOLD IT!! The hats were supposed to be GREEN!

Probably not, but one CAN learn skeet shooting by shooting at it. PULL!

Sheesh- who in hell was Lena Horne's agent at THAT point?

Actually, that's not a pillow. It's a family sized chimichanga (and it looks like there's a considerable amount of guacamole in there). I'd be tempted by that sucker, too!

Really great stuff, Noj. Thank you for sharing these with us. I love art, although I have almost NO talent myself. People like you really p*ss me off! All I can say is, I hope you will continue to paint! I have an older brother who has incredible artistic talent, but he hasn't had the time or the inclination to express it. He does play the guitar and the trombone, though, so I'll cut him a little slack. I really dig the Wes image- I've tried doing pencil sketches (from photographs), and for some reason his face was always very difficult for me to capture (I had more success with a few others I tried). I also love the way you shaped the guitars (his and Jimi's). A little abstract... that's probably the way I should try doing it (I always used to go for realism in shape and dimensions, and I've never been able to pull that off). I think my favorite of these is the Milt Jackson image. You NAILED Bags, and that background is really intriguing (reminds me of Pacific Northwest native arts). Any details about that you'd care to share? Thanks again- you are a wonderful artist.

EVERY goddamned time I'm about to come up with a great gag to match one of these covers, somebody posts five more that completely blow my mind (well, sort of... I feel a combination of confusion, awe, total disbelief, and nausea). Of all the LP cover threads I've EVER seen, this one is EASILY (and BY FAR)... not all that good.

Thanks Jim. Everything seems to be working pretty well for me, except that I'm back to that multi-pastel look (lavender, light yellow, dusty pink, and the lovely "children's aspirin" orange). If there's any chance we could get a second skin option like you created for 1.1.1, that would be great.

..................................................................................................................................................................................... WOW!!

Here's some info: Buddy DeFranco -- Pretty Moods (Japanese paper sleeve edition) . . . CD . . . Verve (Japan), 1954 One of Buddy's great little albums recorded for Verve in the mid 50s -- featuring Sonny Clark on piano, and a harder sound than you might expect! The format is lean, clean, almost boppish at times -- and the whole thing's packaged in a sweet David Stone Martin cover! Titles include "Lover Man", "Yesterdays", "If I Should Lose You", and "Deep Purple". (In a limited edition 5" cardboard sleeve -- with a great David Stone Martin cover!) Dusty Groove just had it for $19.99, but it's currently listed as out of stock...

Wish I could find a larger scan. This reissue of "Chet Baker Sings" show's Chet with a guitar.

I have mixed feelings about this one, but I think it qualifies... and (with thanks to Swinging Swede)...

If a set of lyrics *just* covers the head, it's not vocalese by any definition I have learned Mike, I think you misunderstand me. I wasn't talking about sets of lyrics that cover ONLY the head. I'm talking about the many examples of "vocalese performances" where both the head AND the solos are lyricized jointly. The example I used was "Four"- a complete set of lyrics for both the head and the solos. I was simply trying to make the point that the type of lyric writing that Hendricks does for the heads is still very artistic (moreso than the typical type of lyric writing that has been done for centuries), and using a definition of vocalese that ignores that seems odd to me. Your earlier statement: And strictly speaking, vocalese is the setting of lyrics to the *solos* not the melodies ) completely ignores the efforts that are made for writing the lyricized heads. When I look at the page you referred to, I see (under "The Swingers", of course): "Four" - Hendricks vocalese." So, if some layperson looks at that under the assumption that "vocalese" only involves lyrics having been set to the solos, one might assume that the head is instrumental. "Four" may not even be a very good example of my point. Think of the lyricized head for something like "Move", for example. Lyricizing a head like that may be easier in some ways than writing lyrics to solos and getting all the phrasing and inflections just right, but I don't think it would qualify as "normal" lyric writing. At any rate, I'm just following through on my own feelings here. If Jon Hendricks makes the distinction one way, then that's certainly good enough for me. Perhaps he's not giving himself enough credit for those lyricized heads, though...

Mike, I'm not seeing that (can you point me to it?). The closest thing I could find was this: ""Vocalese" is the art setting established instrumental jazz solos to lyrics and singing them." To me, as I've already stated, this seems like an incomplete definition. Surely the opening lyrics from "Four" (which fit the main head of the tune)- that are included right beneath the heading of his Vocalese page- are part of the art form. I think they are a major part, as I think the majority of vocalese recordings feature new/original lyrics for the melody itself. These are also important relative to the lyrics for the solos, as they establish the lyrical theme for the piece. It seems the "normal" lyrics to "A Night in Tunisia" are by Hendricks, now that I check things out. I think he wrote that much earlier (c. 1961) than when he did the vocalese lyrics for the Bird solo. Hmm... for the 1962 LH&R recordings (two takes) of the tune, released as bonus material in the "High Flying..." sessions, Paparelli is credited. Interesting (and complicated) topic!

This has almost slid off the first page of active topics, so I thought I'd bring it back up. I haven't really spent enough time to figure everything out. When I have tried things like enlarged color, I've struggled, gone the trial and error way, and then moved on without really mastering any of it. Ron, in terms of using FONT/SIZE/COLOR, any of these (and any combination) can be easily accomplished by first selecting something from the pull-down menu (such as "Impact" from the "FONT" menu), then typing in your text, and then just clicking on "Close all Tags". Let me try a "triple", just to make sure... Impact / largest (size 14) / purple I'm having some technical issues with this posting window right now. This has happened to me a few times before. I think I'll start a new post to experiment with individual tag closing...

I'm sure that's true, but now I'm wondering if my general impression of the art form is accurate. As I said above, I don't own or listen to a great deal of vocalese, so I don't consider myself a real expert here. The thing is, your comments have got me thinking about what types of songs (in general) were used as vehicles. I think I tended to associate vocalese more with tunes that were originally written as instrumentals, thus my decision to point out that vocalese lyricists do write lyrics for the melodies quite frequently, if not in the majority of cases (my current impression). You mention "A Night In Tunisia" and "Round Midnight". I'll admit I'm a little foggy concerning the origins of the "normal" (as you referred to them) lyrics- and earliest recordings of them- for these and other tunes that were originally written as instrumentals. Some classic tunes like these had lyrics written for the melodies before the advent of full blown vocalese, correct? In some cases, there were more than one set of lyrics that were "accepted" and used over the years, but I suppose the most popular of those would be considered the "normal" lyrics. At any rate, I'm not clear as to how common (relatively speaking) it is for a vocalese piece to use "normal" lyrics for the melody and original lyrics for the solos. BTW, on the MT's version of "Another Night In Tunisia" with McFerrin, Hendricks gets full credit for the entire lyrics. Anybody know anything about Frank Mignone? The liners to Eddie Jefferson's "Letter From Home" mentions that he wrote "special" lyrics for A Night In Tunisia, which Jefferson uses for the head.

I think I detect a typo. "MGV8169 In A Mellow Tone (originally Norgran MGN1068)" Should read: MGV8169 In A Mellow Mood (originally Norgran MGN1079) ========================================================== Found details on the web: Buddy DeFranco Quartet Buddy DeFranco (cl) Sonny Clark (p) Gene Wright (B ) Bobby White (d) NYC, April 7, 1954 1535-1 Jack the Fieldstalker Norgran MGN 1068, Verve MGV 8158 1536-3 Cable Car Norgran MGN 1094, Verve MGV 8182 1537-4 I Wish I Knew - 1538-1 If I Should Lose You Norgran MGN 1068, Verve MGV 8158 1539-1 Lover Man - 1540-2 Tenderly - 1541-2 Deep Purple - 1542-4 Monogram Norgran MGN 1094, Verve MGV 8182 1543-1 Yesterdays Norgran MGN 1068, Verve MGV 8158 1544-1 Blues in the Closet Norgran MGN 1094, Verve MGV 8182 * Jazz Tones / Buddy DeFranco (Norgran MGN 1068, Verve MGV 8158) * Odalisque / Buddy DeFranco (Norgran MGN 1094, Verve MGV 8182) Buddy DeFranco Quartet same personnel Los Angeles, CA, August 9, 1954 1868-2 Mine Norgran MGN 1096, Verve MGV 8183 1869-2 You Go to My Head - 1870-3 Gerry's Tune - 1871-4 Now's the Time - 1872-1 Autumn Leaves - 1873-1 Titoro - 1873-4 Titoro (short ver.) Verve MGV 8195, Mosaic MR5 117, MD4 117 * Autumn Leaves / Buddy DeFranco (Norgran MGN 1096, Verve MGV 8183) * A Compendium of Jazz / various artists (Verve MGV 8195) * The Complete Verve Recordings of the Buddy DeFranco Quartet/Quintet with Sonny Clark (Mosaic MR5 117, MD4 117) Buddy DeFranco Quintet same personnel Los Angeles, CA, August 10, 1954 1874-1 The Bright One Norgran MGN 1079, Verve MGV 8169 1875-1 Sonny's Idea - 1876-1 Laura - 1877-1 Everything Happens to Me - 1878-1 I'll Remember April - 1879-1 Willow Weep for Me - * In a Mellow Mood / Buddy DeFranco (Norgran MGN 1079, Verve MGV 8169) Buddy DeFranco Quintet same personnel Los Angeles, CA, September 1, 1954 1920-1 Minor Incident Norgran MGN 1079, Verve MGV 8169 1921-2 A Foggy Day - 1922-1 What Can I Say Dear Verve MGV 8224 1923-5 Moe - * In a Mellow Mood / Buddy DeFranco (Norgran MGN 1079, Verve MGV 8169) * Sweet and Lovely / Buddy DeFranco (Verve MGV 8224) Buddy DeFranco Quintet Buddy DeFranco (cl) Sonny Clark (p, org) Tal Farlow (g, 1) Gene Wright (B ) Bobby White (d) Los Angeles, CA, August 12, 1955 1. 2425-3 Getting a Balance Verve MGV 8224 2. 2426-1 That Old Black Magic - * Sweet and Lovely / Buddy DeFranco (Verve MGV 8224) Buddy DeFranco Quintet Buddy DeFranco (cl) Sonny Clark (p, org) Tal Farlow (g) Gene Wright (B ) Bobby White (d) Los Angeles, CA, August 26, 1955 2458-5 They Say It's Wonderful Verve MGV 8224 2459-1 But Beautiful - 2460-7 Between the Devil and the Deep Blue Sea Verve MGV 8195, Mosaic MR5 117, MD4 117 2461-1 The Nearness of You Verve MGV 8224 2462-1 How About You? Verve MGV 8221 2463-1 Little Girl Blue - 2464-5 Indian Summer - 2465-1 I Can't Get Started - 2466-2 Stardust - 2467-2 Cooking the Blues - * Sweet and Lovely / Buddy DeFranco (Verve MGV 8224) * A Compendium of Jazz / various artists (Verve MGV 8195) * The Complete Verve Recordings of the Buddy DeFranco Quartet/Quintet with Sonny Clark (Mosaic MR5 117, MD4 117) * Cooking the Blues / Buddy DeFranco (Verve MGV 8221) ==================== Norgran 1068 included the tracks from Norgran 16 ("Pretty Moods" 10" LP)

I just looked at Dusty Groove. PRETTY MOODS is currently out of stock, but the session includes Clark, and all four of the tunes they list are on disc one of the Mosaic set. Seeing the cover art reminded me that I once had a 12" DeFranco Norgran with that same cover sketch (could have had a different title...?)

THE ARTISTRY OF was originally issued in 1954 as Norgran 1012. It was reissued circa 1956 as AUTUMN LEAVES (Norgran 1096), and later as Verve 8183. So, this is definitely part of the Mosaic. PRETTY MOODS was the title of a 10 inch LP from 1954 (Norgran 16). So far, I'm not finding any info as to whether it was reissued on a 12" (or as part of a 12") under another title. FWIW, I have seen Japanese releases of a few DeFranco Norgrans over the years (before the advent of mini LP packaging). I can't recall which titles, though ("The Artistry Of" may have been one of them).

[Edited to correct an error I made the first time I posted this] Disc One Jack The Fieldstalker Cable Car I Wish I Knew If I Should Lose You Lover Man Tenderly Deep Purple Monogram Yesterdays Blues In The Closet Disc Two Mine You Go To My Head Gerry's Tune Now's The Time Autumn Leaves Titoro (Long) Titoro (Short) Disc Three The Bright One Sonny's Idea Laura Everything Happens To Me I'll Remember April Willow Weep For Me Minor Incident A Foggy Day What Can I Say Dear Moe Getting A Balance That Old Black Magic Disc Four They Say It's Wonderful But Beautiful Between The Devil & The Deep Blue Sea The Nearness Of You How About You Little Girl Blue Indian Summer I Can't Get Started Stardust Cooking The Blues