Bruyninckx A-Z completed

[Chuck Nessa]

I received the final installment of Walter's cd-rom discography today.

More info after I've spent some time with it.

He does say corrections and updates through December 2006 will be issued in 2007.

[ajf67]

This is the one I am seriously considering purchasing, so I look forward to your comments about it.

[BeBop]

Likewise.

- Drew

[mikeweil]

Chuck, would you mind tell what was included on your next-to-last installment, and when did you receive that?

I'm afraid something went wrong with my upgrades and would like to make sure whether I missed a step. Thanks!

[Chuck Nessa]

Mike, the previous cd was titled "A to Thiele" but it actually went further into the letter T - I know Lucky Thompson was included. I don't remember when I received that one.

[Michael Fitzgerald]

Got mine yesterday, haven't yet explored. Walter Bruyninckx mentions that the 2007 revision/update will be his last discographical work. His son, Lucien and Domi Truffandier may continue but this hasn't been decided.

In the same package I got the vol. 8 of the Erik Raben discography Jazz Records 1942-1980 on CD-ROM. Looking forward to digging into these this weekend.

Mike

Edited September 17, 2004 by Michael Fitzgerald

[Shrdlu]

I used to have the old Jepsens. Is he completely out of the picture now?

There were some charming typos in those. His typewriter didn't have a number 0, so he used to write Roost 221o etc. And I loved "Arnold Fishkind". (I saw that last one resurface recently!)

[Michael Fitzgerald]

Erik Raben was designated as the successor to Jepsen, who declined to continue after he completed the eleven volumes of Jazz Records 1942-196X. He died in 1981. A bootleg edition of Jepsen was published in 1986 (straight photocopy). The first edition of the Raben update (Jazz Records 1942-1980) was published in 1989.

Mike

[Bluerein]

got mine today but no OS-X Acrobat version

Let's hope it will be made soon.

Cheers,

Reinier

[Michael Fitzgerald]

I was disappointed that the planned reformatting of the Bruyninckx CD-ROM wasn't put into effect. A sample (for the letter I) was included in an earlier installment. It used different colors, a better font (including bold typeface for some things) and other methods to present the information more clearly. The latest version is still basically in typewritten mode (Courier font) with underlines or ALL CAPS to distinguish certain elements. I hope the 2007 one does make the change.

For those serious about discography, the Raben CD-ROM looks good. Like the Bruyninckx, it's in Adobe Acrobat .pdf format. Just one file for the whole volume 8 (Fre-Gi) plus a couple auxiliary files. It has information (both new sessions as well as details about old sessions) that is found in neither Lord nor Bruyninckx (and certainly not Jepsen). Raben has long had a reputation for being the more accurate general discography and this holds true. Support this project so that it might continue in the face of quicker, but sloppier products.

$25 from http://www.storyville-records.com/book.html .

Mike

[EKE BBB]

Michael (or Chuck or anybody):

I´ve only got the Lord so far (on CD-Rom, last version). But have been considering the purchase of another discography.

Could you briefly comment the differences/advantages/disadvantages of each one (Lord/Bruyninckx/Jepsen/Raben). Preferably on CD-Rom, if available.

Thanks in advance!

[Michael Fitzgerald]

Jepsen is long out of print and out of date. I only keep it for historical purposes - to find out where the mistakes began. Jepsen did the actual research that Bruyninckx and Lord copied (and Raben, but he is official).

Raben only goes from A to Gi at this point and will only ever be from 1942 to 1980. Only volume 8 is on CD-ROM. I strongly encourage supporting the project by purchasing this CD-ROM. There are plans to issue at least the earlier volumes on CD-ROM. Anything later seems to be contingent on sales of what's available now. Lord has killed a lot of the market with his quickly-produced but problem-filled books and now CD-ROMs. After spending a weekend with vol. 8 I am very happy with the massive quantity of new entries (that neither Lord nor Bruyninckx have) such as many Stan Getz broadcasts and private tapes, also corrections to long-standing errors that neither Lord nor Bruyninckx have fixed.

Bruyninckx was the immediate source for most of Lord's information. Much of what's in Lord was taken *exactly* from the Bruyninckx books. At this point, Bruyninckx is WAY more up to date on certain letters (but still behind Raben for Fre-Gi in 1942-1980 in terms of new discoveries).

Gotta run - more if there is interest.

Mike

[Chuck Nessa]

Check out these previous discussions:

http://www.organissimo.org/forum/index.php...wtopic=2402&hl=

http://www.organissimo.org/forum/index.php...wtopic=5422&hl=

[EKE BBB]

Thanks, Mike and Chuck!

[EKE BBB]

BTW: do you know how "complete" is Bruyninckx for non-US musicians?

Working with Lord´s CD-Rom, I made some verifications for Spanish musicians and the results were not only disappointing, but also depressing...

For Tete Montoliu, as Mike well knows, there were many inaccuracies and many omissions, but if you follow with other musicians with dozens of released discs, you would only find one, two or at most three recordings!!!

Does Lord intend to be a all-around-the-world Complete Jazz Discography?

[Michael Fitzgerald]

In the past I found that Bruyninckx did better for European musicians. I haven't done a thorough comparison. Certainly Lord has made some additions in the A-Bou letters.

It is my belief that Lord *intends* to be IT - the whole thing. However, while he seems to have this lofty goal he seems to do nothing in terms of active discographical research to reach it. The fact that he didn't even bother to correct errors which were specifically singled out in published reviews of his discographies (in ARSC Journal, for one) makes him rather a laughing-stock, in my view. He's not out searching for the answers, looking for the missing data. He seems to just wait until someone else publishes a book, then he steals the information - and their errors (and he introduces not a few of his own in the process)!

And I have no desire to help him by sending in the dozens of pages of corrections I have compiled. If he's too lazy to keep at the job, too lazy or inconsiderate to even proofread his own stuff, why should I do his work for free?

Raben, on the other hand, continues to go above and beyond as a serious discographer. He's found that missing data, filling in little gaps here and there - and more.

After reviewing the threads that Chuck listed, I will note that Ed Berger's review of the Lord CD-ROM (v. 3.3) that I mentioned has finally been published in the Annual Review of Jazz Studies which came out a few weeks ago.

Mike

[Michael Fitzgerald]

I've got nothing against Bob Rusch, but I can document that he was absolutely ga-ga over Bruyninckx. In fact, Cadence was the U.S. distributor for Bruyninckx. Here's what he said in Cadence vol. 6 no. 5 (about 60 Years Of Recorded Jazz): "When this entire work is complete and the cross index added, there is little doubt that this will be THE monumental discographical work, pretty much encompassing everything that has gone before it."

Bruyninckx was still in the ballgame when Lord/Rusch swooped in, claiming that no one was covering the entire history of jazz in one discography and that's why there was some kind of mandate from the people that they should do this - Bruyninckx certainly was - it was called 70 Years Of Recorded Jazz.

Lord didn't have the faintest idea about what discography was - he admitted to not even owning a copy of Brian Rust's seminal Jazz Records 1897-1942 - he simply copied about 2/3 of his content from Bruyninckx (and had no idea that it might be a good idea to check, confirm, correct) - even the errors, even the footnotes, even the poor English.

Now, Rusch/Cadence and many other journalists are absolutely ga-ga over Lord - I bet they say that to all the girls. After Steve Voce wrote a long rave review about the Lord CD-ROM (which Lord proudly shows on his website), I asked what he thought about the Bruyninckx CD-ROM. He admitted that he had never tried it and, in fact, was unaware of its existence. (!) Clearly, marketing hype has eclipsed all else.

The sad reality is that more than a decade after Lord's first volumes, and now after published revisions (and several CD-ROM updates), there are STILL problems left unfixed.

What is extremely disappointing is that the Lord CD-ROM is now WORSE than the Lord books because of the problem that I noted in this thread:

http://www.organissimo.org/forum/index.php...naughty+sweetie

and every time I use it, I find more problems. Of course, every discography will have errors and omissions, but the ease with which one can find them in Lord is mind-boggling. Honestly, it could be a party game: set the timer for 30 seconds, whoever finds the most errors (not duplicated by other players) wins.

Mike

[EKE BBB]

More on Lord CD-ROM (sorry if we´re going off-topic, Chuck):

What´s the point of not letting us edit (copy and paste) all the discographical information for one leader or musician? You´re only allowed to copy one session and, when you paste it on an Excel or Word file you discover:

-the title of the disc, when included, is not pasted

-the footnotes for the sessions are sometimes also excluded

You have to try and paste it again and sometimes it works. But if it doesn´t, you have to type that information if you want to make your "own discography" for that artist in Word and print it.

[Daniel A]

How does one actually order the Bruyninckx CD-Rom? Despite fervent use of Google I can't find any good resource.

[Chuck Nessa]

http://www.jazzrecords.com/jazzbooks/disco1.htm

[Michael Fitzgerald]

That's an out-of-date page, try this:

http://www.jazz-book.com/disc1.htm

Mike

[Daniel A]

Thanks!

To stand a chance against Lord it appears as if Bruyninckx could perhaps do with some more exposure on the web.